FIRST IMPRESSIONS
Devinci Chainsaw GX Super Enduro
Chainsaw
As I write this, I've not so much as pedaled the Devinci Chainsaw. I love this bike, or at least the idea of this bike, and I want to write about that before our relationship moves to the next level.
I'm not particularly enamored with any high-pivot plus idler (HP+I) suspension platforms. Generally, if anything, I carry a simple single-pivot bias. There are clear performance trade-offs when comparing full suspension designs, and despite what some aficionados of the current crop of 'hype-pivot' rigs claim, that includes HP+I bikes. I'm also certain that, generalized performance characteristics aside, there are good and bad examples of every suspension design out there. I also don't generally gravitate towards mountain bikes with this much travel.
Why do I love this bike then and why, as I'll discuss more later, was I so thirsty to write about the Chainsaw that I'm riding a used one many months after the platform was released? Three reasons:
- It's one of the last production bikes that's manufactured in Canada.
- It's currently the sole heir to a legacy of unique Quebec DH platforms.
- It's very approachable price-wise for what Devinci delivers with a full GX* build at 5300 CAD including a Zeb Rush RC fork, Super Deluxe rear shock, and good rubber.
*Almost full GX. It includes a XG1275 GX cassette and GX crankset, but uses an NX chain.
I was on the fence about this blue but my daughter says "It's so good and every bike should come in this colour, and you're just mad because it's not Cosmic Lilac." Proving once again that beauty is in the eye of the bike owner.
When it comes to suspension I'm more into simpler-is-sweeter than idle complexity. But there are neat factors I appreciate about the high pivot + idler (HP+I) design.
For example, it's amazing how sweet the most basic shocks can feel on HP+I bikes.
It's also neat how the HP+I design is virtually uninfluenced by chainring size. If I have enough time I'd love to play around with fewer gears and very small chainrings.
How rad is this? The regularly changing artistic expression in the abandoned tennis courts makes me think the DNV needs more old walls near the woods.
Whether you’re lapping the park, lining up for your first DH race or pedaling to the gnarliest trail in town, the only thing stopping this Chainsaw are its brakes. - Cycles Devinci
Approachability
I'd imagine most folks reading NSMB.com are aware of the oft-discussed concept that DH bikes, true World Cup Racing level DH bikes, which are sold by many brands, are so specialized at this point that they're not truly approachable for the average mountain biker. They require the highest degree of focus, speed of terrain reading, and level of commitment to ride. They also command a significant financial commitment. Produced in very small batches, DH bikes are expensive to purchase, depreciate even faster than they descend, and even at a significant loss, they are difficult to sell used.
Discussing this bike, Devinci brought up the We Are One Arrival I just wrapped up reviewing. Whereas WeR1 used a single frameset to deliver three unique platforms topping out with a 170mm travel Enduro+ rig, Devinci has used the cost-saving system to deliver two rigs. A 170mm front-and-rear Enduro+, or Super-Enduro, bike that should garner the bulk of sales and a DH platform that sells complete for 800 CAD more than a Santa Cruz V-10 frame.
While only the Chainsaw DH comes stock as a mullet, this year all the bikes have a flip-chip on the lower shock mount that makes them mullet-friendly.
The 5800 CAD Chainsaw DH has 190mm travel front and 170mm travel rear, but the rear can be bumped up to 180mm via shock stroke. Photo - Devinci
The 5300 CAD Chainsaw GX sports 170mm of travel front and rear, but the Zeb fork can easily, and relatively cheaply, be bumped to 180mm or 190mm. Photo - Devinci
This looks like a SRAM SX level bike, but Devinci is using it as a placeholder image and I'm pretending that model doesn't exist. Especially when the Deore 12spd model is only 100 CAD more! (4600 CAD) Photo - Devinci
Sticking to the theme of approachability and the Chainsaw DH for just a moment, even in its 190mm front / 180mm rear travel configuration, sporting a 62.1° head tube angle and Devinci's racing pedigree, the Quebec bicycle-concern is not making any claims of top-step super-race-bike status. They don't even currently offer a high-end build with their Boxxer Select fork and Super Deluxe Select+ shock-suspended DH build coming in at 5800 CAD for the complete bike.
The Boxxer chassis is well-regarded, and there are several sweet upgrade options for significantly less investment than a new fork. I'm partial to Avalanche DH Racing's damper but that's not the only option for this 35mm RockShox chassis.
Chainsaw Enduro+ geometry in 'low' setting with dual 29" wheels.
Chainsaw Enduro+ geometry in 'high' setting with dual 29" wheels. This will deliver the 'low' geometry with a mullet setup.
Chainsaw DH geometry with mullet setup. Bumping the Zeb fork up to 190mm would deliver something similar.
The 170mm front & rear suspension Enduro+, or Super-Enduro, version that I'm riding attempts to balance the high pivot bump munching of the DH configuration with a pleasant level of climbability. The stock Zeb can, of course, be bumped up to 180mm or even 190mm of travel for a relatively minimal cost if desired.
I don't know if I'll get there in the few months that I have the bike, but there's also the delicious potential for an off-menu pedalable blending of the two platforms. Either a dropper post and larger cassette, or smaller chainring, on the Chainsaw DH or a longer stroke shock and fork on the Chainsaw Enduro+.
'Long Live Chainsaw' with the Stevie Smith Legacy Foundation. Photo – Fabio Piva/Red Bull Content Pool
I also want to clearly state that, in terms of approachability, I'm looking to the Chainsaw to deliver every-person potential as a comfortably capable and fun platform for someone with my confidence and control level. In terms of the pricing and build, this is what Devinci is looking for as well.
My review isn't intended in any way as a drag on the Chainsaw's full-on capabilities though. Just check in on Steve Vanderhoek or Yoann Barelli if you have any doubts. I'm not half the rider of either of those gents, and it's always been my experience that it's the rider more than the machine in any mountain biking situation anyway. But if a bike can present a great platform for most riders and also serve to keep those gents safe as they explore their limits, then that would be a rad machine.
Combining a high-pivot layout with our Split-Pivot platform effectively separates acceleration and braking forces for a buttery smooth ride with hyperactive small bump compliance, in all situations. The rearward axle path increases traction and stability the harder you push it..." - Cycles Devinci
The frameset version of the Chainsaw includes a shock, dropper post, chain guide, headset, and saddle for 3400 CAD. Photo - Devinci
Frame Only
The Chainsaw is available as a frameset, including a rear shock, headset, and a dropper post for 3400 CAD. Which, like most other frame-only prices, isn't much of a value compared to the basic Deore 12-spd complete bike at 4600 CAD, which includes the same level of parts that ship with the frameset.
I would love to see the Chainsaw instead sold as a true blank slate without a shock. It's a frame that, for the right price, would inspire folks to create their own bicycle. While that doesn't deliver the same margin dollars to brands as complete bikes do, the marketing potential of passionate customers showing off their custom rigs shouldn't be underestimated.
As good as the basic Select-level Super Deluxe air shock may feel on this frame, it's hard to imagine it being the choice of anyone doing a true custom build. I imagine DH customers will want to run a longer shock and fixed post and Enduro+ customers buying a frame-up would prefer a more Gucci shock and a longer dropper post.
This seems like a good spot for a photo of happy people and bikes. Photo - Devinci
Legacy - Stevie Smith
In 2013, Canadian downhill racing legend Stevie 'Chainsaw' Smith was the first Canadian to win the World Cup DH Overall. He "earned global attention with his captivating personality, mischievous grin, and thrilling riding style" (SSLF) and inspired his peers, the next generation of grom-rippers, and a bunch of old-farts as well before his untimely death in 2016 at the age of 26.
There are plenty of folks who've done a better job of writing about Stevie's influence and legacy than I could. For folks looking for a deeper dive, I'd suggest starting with the full write-up of Stevie's Story on the Stevie Smith Legacy Foundation page.
In terms of the Devinci naming the Chainsaw after him, here's what they have to say on the topic:
"Stevie Smith's love for riding was contagious. Just being in his presence made you want to go fast, whether you were racing or not. We made the Chainsaw to embrace that spirit and carry on his legacy, with an annual donation to the Stevie Smith Legacy Foundation."
The Big Bang occurred over two decades ago! Photo - Devinci
Bolt-on downtube, high-pivot, bottom bracket eccentric linkage. Photo - Devinci
Devinci dug into the Big Bang legacy with the launch of their Spartan HP+I bike. But I wanted to revisit it. Photo - Devinci
I saw one of these in person in Victoria, BC around '00 but in the Team Ford-Devinci livery. Mind-blowing at the time. Photo - Devinci
I'm a sucker for the twin top-tube aesthetic, though I imagine the layout of the Chainsaw is lighter, stronger and more cost-effective to manufacture. Win, win, win. Photo - Devinci
Legacy - Big Bang
The only Quebec-made bike I've owned to date is a Balfa 2-Step, but, though I have not ridden most of them, I've long loved the individual passion inherent in every unique rig that rolls out of La Belle Province. Balfa was a nurse log for Appalache, Cycles Xprezo, and Dobermann, and who knows how many future builders they may inspire, but at this point, Devinci is the last brand standing as a Quebec production bicycle house.
One beauty of the Chainsaw being an HP+I bike is that in appearance, as well as production locality, it carries forward that legacy. It's nowhere near as 'WTF' as their original high-pivot rig, the Big Bang, but the latest Devinci is still an easily identified bicycle. Even compared to a similarly split-pivot and HP+I bike, the Trek Slash.
Continuing the legacy of Quebec-Made HP+I goodness. The BB7 captured my imagination twenty years ago. Photo - Balfa.Wooyek
Instead of an HP+I setup the Balfa 2 Step DH used Niner's CVA suspension system before Niner invented it. I had a non-DH version and loved it. Photo - Balfa.Wooyek
The Appalache Real was a direct descendant of the BB7, even down to the aluminum front triangle and steel rear end. Photo - Lowcard via Balfa.Wooyek
The Xprezo Furax DH did not employ an HP+I suspension layout, but still carries forward a made-in-Quebec aesthetic that Devinci captures with the Chainsaw. Photo - Stuart Kernaghan
Used Bicycle Brief and Spec. Notes
Thanks to the efforts of Steff at Devinci, this Chainsaw GX is in excellent working condition but it is a used bike. A case of Devinci buying the bike they already own, which is on-brand for me.
With the Covid parts shortages in full swing, Devinci had an issue acquiring the use-case-appropriate DoubleDown tires from Maxxis. Hence the unwelcome combination of a so-so-slow rolling MaxxGrip DHRII DD rear tire with a MaxxTerra DHF DD front tire that's a hard 'no thank you' on a bike of this intended capability at this time of year.
The other item of note is the 150mm dropper post on this size-medium test rig. I have plenty of room for a longer post and would prefer a 170mm, though I can get along with a 150mm. From talking to Devinci, I suspect we'll see this spec change in the future with the addition of a post that can be easily travel-adjusted for riders who need, or prefer, a shorter drop.
Otherwise, since the bike was a new model this year I suspect it will remain unchanged as most brands switch to doing minor specification changes on multi-year runs. I would also be surprised if all Chainsaw platforms aren't sold as mullets next year.
It's nice to see the GX-level crank and chainring but I'm surprised Devinci didn't spec a chain guide with a bash guard.
Other than some obvious wear on the cranks and chainring it's hard to tell this Chainsaw was used. The quick-release rear wheel was a bit of a surprise.
The fork uses a QR axle as well. I don't know how many bikes Devinci sells in the UK, but I know this is still a popular spec choice for anyone putting their bike in their car.
Super Boost 157
The 12x157 rear hub on the Devinci shouldn't come as a surprise. Firstly, the brand is a big believer in Super Boost 157 rear spacing, and also the frame does double duty as a DH platform, and that is the DH standard. I suspect we'll see many more companies selling Super Enduro and DH race bikes with similarly shared frames which would include more Super Boost rear spacing.
For those that are SB-157 curious, I've written a couple of pieces on the subject previously:
I'd personally prefer it if all bikes went back to 12x142 spacing, but given that drivetrain companies aren't going to make chain lines any narrower, SB-157 makes sense for the average new bicycle.
My gut feeling is that Devinci is missing my perfect size. A Chromag-esque medium-large option. I'm riding a medium Chainsaw Enduro+ rig.
The large was certainly too big, so the medium has to be my size. I'll discuss that more in my actual bike review down the trail.
Sizing Up & Down
The Chainsaw uses size-specific chain stays that grow 5mm per size from 425mm on the small to 440mm on the XL. This medium has 430mm stays and, combined with the 469mm Reach and 62.9° HTA, the wheelbase is a decently long 1257mm.
As with so many bikes these days, I find myself wrinkling my nose and wondering why Devinci hasn't, thanks to their in-house production capacity, added more frame sizes. There was a time when riders sized 'big bikes' with stems ranging from 30mm to 70mm (40mm range) and now most folks are talking about 35mm to 50mm max (15mm range). It's a huge difference and I'm fairly certain if there was a medium-large size that would be me.
Based on my height Devinci scores me in their medium range where most companies now either have me in the overlapping zone or for some bikes, like the Arrival, push me into the large. Based on my preference, I would have probably also bet on the medium as well since the 494mm reach for the large is much longer than anything I've ridden. I'll get into sizing, and geometry charts, more in my review.
It's a Chainsaw! Don't worry, my #dadhumour solicited a proper eye-roll.
It's a high, high pivot frame. With creative, but not adventurous, cable routing.
My first choice is external cable routing. But if it's going to be internal this is clean and works well.
Build Notes
I've had great experiences with the basic RockShox Zeb fork and good experiences with the basic RockShox Super Deluxe Select shock on some bikes. I did raise my eyebrows at the lack of a climb switch for this application, a feature that's present on the DH build, but I'm keeping an open mind.
The GX drivetrain, even with just the chain downgraded to NX, is nice to see on the platform. If I was king for a day, we'd see the suspension of the GX model combined with the drivetrain of the Deore 12spd model, for a price in between the two, but no brand is ever going to please everyone at any price point, and I think Devinci has done a great job with value here.
It's not an HP+I bike without an idler. Devinci's is super smooth and low drag. I wouldn't say the same about the e13 chain guide, which strangely doesn't have an integrated bash taco.
Devinci candidly says that the 2-piece shock linkage was used, along with a chainstay bridge, as it's less expensive to manufacture and still very stiff compared to a 1-piece unit.
Brands can always spend a bit more money, and jack up the suggested retail price (SRP) a bit to match. Deciding on price points, and where to compromise, is what makes building a bike like this Chainsaw GX so hard. Stop at 5300 CAD, or jump up to 5500 CAD and go with a better wheel option than the insert-hungry RaceFace AR30 rims and quite decent Novatec Factor hubs? At 6K CAD the rims, brakes, and rear shock could all get a little bump. How much money to ditch the TransX dropper for a nicer but not super-Gucci option like the OneUp V2? And so forth.
As someone who will min-max my rigs with much nicer wheels than Devinci would have equipped even for a couple of grand more, I'm quite happy to see good enough OE options rather than spend more on hoops and hubs I'm going to replace anyway. But to each their own.
The SRAM G2 RE brakes combine a Guide G2 master cylinder assembly with an older generation of the Code caliper, which uses the current Code pads.
They have a much more positive action and almost the same level of power as SRAM's Code R brake and I actually prefer these.
Note the beveled washers above and below the caliper. This is not a mistake, it's due to re-using an older model caliber.
On the subject of not pleasing anyone, this may be a bit controversial but I prefer the Guide RE brakes on the Chainsaw over the Code R that Devinci could have run for more money. While the Code R brakes have more power, the Guide RE, which uses a Guide master cylinder and a previous generation Code caliper, are pretty darn close and have a significantly nicer lever feel.
If it was my bike I wouldn't choose to run either, since I find brakes make a bigger difference to my riding than any other upgrade, but I'll take Guide RE over Code R any day. There are always larger rotors if I need more juice.
In my perfect world, the Chainsaw would have external cable routing. But most mountain bikers seem to have internal-routing expectations. Fine. As I've seen more and more issues with stuck-up tube-in-tube internal routing and multiple stripped-out bolt-on cable ports at the bike shop, I'm increasingly happy with simple holes-in-frame like Devinci, and WeR1, are using. That is, if it has to be internal, I'm okay with this setup.
A full SRAM GX 12-spd drivetrain, less the chain, a Zeb fork rather than a Domain, and decent G2 RE brakes on a Canadian Made HP+I platform. Not bad for 5300 Canuck-Bucks.
The Chainsaw looks wicked fun standing still. Thanks for your work on Lower Crippler, Andy!
Changes
I would love to experiment with smaller chainring sizes and fewer gears, a longer fork and shock stroke, and just generally work through the Chainsaw as I did with the WeR1 Arrival, but I'm not certain how many different configurations I'll be able to arrange in the few months I'll have the bike.
I will be mulleting it right away as I've realized at my height anything more than a hardtail or trail bike's worth of rear-wheel travel has me appreciating the extra tire clearance. I'll also likely swap to a longer travel dropper post, just for personal preference, and the same with the cockpit.
I'm completely convinced that in addition to leaving off pedals, bikes of a certain performance level should forgo the bar, stem, grips, and saddle as well. I don't know how brands could do that, but it's a lot of money tied up in parts that riders are either going to replace or in some cases worse, not replace even though they're sub-optimal for their experience. From bar backsweep to contact points there's a lot of personal preference when it comes to cockpits and perches.
I will also swap out the brakes at some point for a pair of Hayes Dominions four-piston stoppers that I'm using as control brakes on various bikes.
I have no complaints about the Novatec Factor at this price point, but I'll be swapping in a different pair of wheels to mullet the Chainsaw.
The Devinci-branded SDG saddle and 150mm KS post are similarly fine, but I'll likely swap to a perch I prefer and a post with 20mm more drop.
A 20mm rise, 35mm clamp Race Face bar joins an in-house stem and lock-on grips will be swapped for my preference.
Time to swap some parts and then actually go and ride this rig. I know it's going to be tons of fun on chunky descents and I'm cautiously optimistic that I'm going to appreciate it on all the janky trails I love to ride. At the very least, high pivot being what it is, I love the idea of this Canadian-made mountain bicycle that presents excellent value.
For more information on the 5300 CAD Chainsaw GX, and Chainsaw in general, check out Cycles Devinci.
Height - Steve Buscemi-ish
Wait - Patiently
Ape Index - T-Rex
Age - The same as DOS
Favourite Trail(s) every week - Pipeline (thank you Ken!) to Lower Crippler (thank you Andy!)
Favourite Song(s) this week - I'm Your Man. Nick Cave (covering Leonard Cohen)
Favourite Colour - Cosmic Lilac
Bar Width - It depends
Reach & Stack & ETT - It depends
Crank Length - 175mm except when it's 170mm
Wheel Size - Hot For Mullets
Comments
Lu Kz
4 months, 1 week ago
"you're just mad because it's not cosmic lilac"
The roasts are only getting better with time, I see. Hope you're ready.
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I think, if truly given the choice, lots of DH riders on this platform would choose at least a short stroke dropper rather than the fixed post. On this platform, the dropper doesn't interfere with anything. There's lots of parks with transition trails, and more shuttle zones with the same. Personally, I'd love to have a 100mm dropper on my Aurum but that would require either a lever activated dropper, which are rare for a quality piece of hardware, or the dremel - and even though the bike is pushing 5 years old, I'm not quite ready to pull that out on the DH bike.
I do respect only offering an attainably priced DH platform. They know the majority of people eyeing it up in that configuration are going to acquire it as a second (or third?) bike, it makes sense to keep it reasonable. That, or it's going to fill out rental fleets as your comment regarding the hyper focus of other dual crown platforms rings true and those bikes become less and less attainable (both in ride and price point) for the average rider, and suitably no longer make up the lion's share of bike park rental fleets.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Oh, I’m ready! Hahaha.
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“That, or it's going to fill out rental fleets as your comment regarding the hyper focus of other dual crown platforms rings true and those bikes become less and less attainable (both in ride and price point) for the average rider, and suitably no longer make up the lion's share of bike park rental fleets.”
Makes so much sense as a ‘park bike’ style DH rig.
Interesting point re. dropper post on DH bike. It certainly appeals to me. But I’m not really the prime DH bike customer.
I do think the key though, versus most companies selling their WC platforms (or at least the WC platforms at the moment they hit go on production) is that with this sharing the frame with a bike they should be able to sell stronger numbers of (Enduro+) the DH bike could actually also be a money maker. The average rider gets a better DH rig experience, the company selling it doesn’t have to justify DH as a lost leader?
But then… I circle back to why I wrote this before riding the bike. I’m putting a lot of pressure on this bike - and recognize it.
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Lowcard
4 months, 1 week ago
That was my Appalache Réal with the photo of it taken on my lawn in Kamloops in 2006. Not sure how Balfa.Wooyek has that pic!
That bike had potential. The HT was far far too steep, but the whole bike as pictured was ~36lbs. It had a Mojo Boxxcart equipped Boxxer (with speed sensitive valving), 225mm rotors, and a custom tuned Manitou air shock.
I owned 4 Balfa BB7's prior to that, with 3 of those spent racing for Balfa. They worked very very well for that time period, but had major drawbacks. Weight was one, so was the limited shock space.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
I’ll update the photo credit.
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I think, in terms of the performance and geo of older bikes (some of them two decades old) that progress is in recognizing where you’ve come from - whose shoulders you’re standing on.
The Split-Pivot, for example, should make the HP+I bikes easier to ride in more situations with braking.
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Vik Banerjee
4 months, 1 week ago
I'm stoked to see a Canadian made production bike.
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Cr4w
4 months, 1 week ago
It's also available in surprisingly big sizing, which is unusual for Devinci, typically only offering the littlest of little bikes. I guess they're testing the waters, to confirm that bigger people (who presumably don't exist in Quebec) actually exist and want to buy bikes.
I hope the XL in this adult level sizing sells well and they apply it to future iterations of their other bikes as well as Andrew's M-L intermediate size.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
The things is, it wouldn’t be that hard for them to fab a XXL assembly if demand was there. It’s a fairly simple bike in terms of construction - in entirely a good way. But yes, in addition to doing an XL, each size is really in the range of what they say it is… this is the first time in years I’ve reviewed a straight-up medium.
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Cr4w
4 months, 1 week ago
It wouldn't be a huge leap to create a M-L or XXL since they would just be front triangles. I bet there's enough demand for that, probably not enough to justify molds for the carbon models though.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Maybe not enough demand if it was just a DH frame either, but with it being a multi-platform frameset adding sizes, as long as components aren’t size specific (since those are ordered in advance) seems like it wouldn’t require a huge amount of flexibility? Easy to trim a steerer tube if you need to weld more XLs than XXLs.
Anyway, it’s something I’ll ask about for the final piece.
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ackshunW
4 months, 1 week ago
Hahah great write up. I started, like you Andrew, not fussed about another high-pivot bike. Too much chain, too many more bolts, too much chainstay growth. But then, transported by a rambling history (and zoom-worthy photos of those other strange Canadian bikes from the lineage), I arrived with interest piqued.
This piece was almost like, a deep dive on fruitcake or fly-tying or something, where I gained a new appreciation for an object I’m usually blind to.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
“This piece was almost like, a deep dive on fruitcake…”
Hahaha. A super-dense alcohol soaked brick that’s an acquired taste mainly enjoyed by people who’ve been around long enough to be nostalgic?
Sounds about right.
This was everything I needed to get out of my brain so I could give the bike an honest review.
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ackshunW
4 months, 1 week ago
“A super-dense alcohol soaked brick that’s an acquired taste”
Hahahah, who are we talking about again??
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
The fact that fruit cake and I share a biography isn’t news. A little nutty. Deliciously sweet on rare and random occasions. Mostly brick.
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pbass
4 months, 1 week ago
Fruit cake deserves a deep dive! If you don't know it, you are missing out.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
It’s not like I haven’t tested many different examples for scientific purposes.
I’ll leave it to the connoisseurs and double up on the butter tarts. With raisins, thank you.
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DanL
4 months, 1 week ago
Those are some gorgeous stick leanings!
I'm also looking forwards to this series, as soon as the chainsaw turned up I thought it was such a great price point for what it promises and from Devinci no less. It sits perfectly beside the more lux looking Troy frames in the racks.
Your riding impressions are also going be closer to my levels of enjoyment (and neighbourhood) than in the Barelli/Vanderhoek riding continuum - as much as I enjoy seeing their riding, wondering how the bike feels is equivalent to watching Kelly Slater surfing a door and a table and thinking about the furniture.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Thanks Dan!
Looking forward to sharing my riding thoughts soon.
“Your riding impressions are also going be closer to my levels of enjoyment (and neighbourhood) than in the Barelli/Vanderhoek riding continuum”
This is actually the (exact) same bike Matt Beer reviewed and he shreds on that rarified level, at least compared to me. So it’ll be interesting to re-read his thoughts on the bike when I finish my series.
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DanL
4 months, 1 week ago
Hopefully a testament to this bike will be that it can be enjoyed on a wide gamut of trails with a wide selection of desired outcomes. Until I'd read your thorough WR1 variations investigations there was not a part of me that felt like that bike would be even close to something I'd be able to ride and not feel "all talk and no trousers".
I love the new artwork on that wall, the blue patch almost appears to mimic the bike colours.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Yeah, I'll keep an open mind but I don't think it's 'that' bike. That is to say (recycling from below) for folks who want to enjoy the Shore-XC experience this will be an 'N+1' bike rather than an 'N' bike.
My gut feeling is it will be an excellent other-bike for something who loves riding a Tech-C bike like a Rocky Mountain Element or Transition Spur, or who loves riding a hardtail.
In theory, it's the perfect bike for someone like me who loves riding their rigid single-speed but also wants a different experience on chunkier trails. Both bikes can be pedaled up a hill but about as far as two bikes with 'Enduro' geometry can get in terms of experience.
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DanL
4 months, 1 week ago
I hear you on that, being Super or Enduro isn't an attribute I have but wanting an N+1 for the fast chunk or large drops is real
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Alex Leich
4 months, 1 week ago
Excited to see your ride impressions. In my experience the split pivot HP on the spartan is an excellent balance of braking and suspension performance. My real question is if there is clearance to offset the front chainring akin to the WA1 with the SB157 rear end.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
I’ve not disassembled it yet to be sure but no, I’m 99% sure with the idler you’re fixed for chainline.
There’s always ways to improve it though. Smaller chain ring, ignore the 52t cog, maybe (we’ll see) run a T-Type cassette with a cable SRAM drivetrain.
I won’t have the bike long enough to get really adventurous but I’ll at least explore ideas in writing.
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First ride impression - just out and about - is that the design works shockingly well (pun intended) with the basic Super Deluxe (which I had heard to be the case). That’s a neat sort of more complicated bike, less complicated shock min-max-money-wise trade-off, potentially.
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Martin
4 months, 1 week ago
If it had a not-trunnion shock mount, there would be a frameset coming my way already. I like that it's made here in Quebec and I'd be curious to try the HP+I, but having just bought a new Ohlins shock, I'm not willing to sell it or invest in getting it modded to a new mounting standard.
Quebec's unique perspective on making bikes continues with Tool bikes https://rideontool.com/ There was an interview this week on the Blister Bikes and Big Ideas podcast and the man behind the brand seems like he's really clever and much thought has gone into his design.
Curious to see your ride impressions on the Chainsaw, Andrew!
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
“Quebec's unique perspective on making bikes continues with Tool bikes https://rideontool.com/“
Tool is rad. Daambuilt is doing neat custom stuff (and maybe some small batch production) in Quebec. Altruiste carrying on the Dobermann legacy too!
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jrouellet
4 months, 1 week ago
Altruiste are based in New Brunswick, but yeah they wave the east coast bike building flag.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
I did know that; thanks for the fact check!
I don’t have a need or the terrain for a track bike / tracklocross bike but if I did, I love their aesthetic.
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Morgan Heater
4 months, 1 week ago
That tool looks a lot like a Druid. Not to say it's not hot.
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Cr4w
4 months, 1 week ago
Ya it's a got a lot of V1 Forbidden energy but it looks great. My big complaints with the Dread were having to run that lower pulley and the weird sizing. If I could get that same ride quality but solve those two issues that would be a win.
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Allen Lloyd
4 months, 1 week ago
Can't wait for the this vs. WeR1 content :)
Couldn't agree more on the Shimano build with better suspension being the right answer on this.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Two very different Canadian-Made 170mm bikes. The A170 is actually TWICE the price! Different suspension designs…
Yeah, actually can’t wait to compare them :-).
I’ll be very interested to see how spec changes on this bike on ‘24, ‘25, ‘26 as we move beyond limited Covid-era spec options and flexible min-maxing product managers take advantage of new product releases to create value buying out previous gen stockpiles.
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Allen Lloyd
4 months, 1 week ago
I just want a Shimano build with Rock Shox suspension. I know that is counter to the SRAM empire, but I hate SRAM brakes and Fox suspension.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
When you look at the cost of ownership (suspension service / service parts) there's actually a strong min-max argument to run SRAM's Select+ suspension products with a Shimano Deore drivetrain (M5130 or M6120). I've made the argument to a number of folks lately that that would be my personal baseline when reviewing both less expensive and more expensive options.
Brakes-wise, I don't particularly care for SRAM brakes and like them better than most Shimano options, so that's the one place I'd pay to bump up my personal spec. Formula Curas, Hayes Dominions, etc. But then, as with cockpit parts, I don't expect any stock bike to be exactly what I'm looking for. The object is to get enough value to swap in my key preferences and still come out ahead price-wise compared to building it up from a frame.
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Mammal
4 months, 1 week ago
Not that you don't enjoy a good suspension bike, but I find it hilarious that you're the guy who ended up with the Chainsaw. It makes perfect sense in the context of the WAO-type review with different configurations, but the WAO iterations seemed to fall more directly into the Andrew wheelhouse. I hope you get a chance to do some repeat gravity runs on this beast, to provide just a little more "shuttle-bro" context compared to most reviews. It's a tough season for that, but may I suggest a very accessible Sh*t Connector -> Lower Paul Hogan lap for that application?
I love this bike. If I needed to replace my Aurum, and I weren't in mega-saving mode, this would be my #1 choice.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
“I find it hilarious that you're the guy who ended up with the Chainsaw”
Hahaha. Yeah, I’m not going to get in an argument with anyone who suggests that I’m not the best NSMB test-writer candidate to review this bike.
Not because I won’t approach it thoughtfully or come up with some interesting insights, but frankly I don’t generally ride bikes in this category.
I guess the only counter point I’d make is I think this is a really important bike (for many reasons highlighted above) that NSMB needed to cover and here we are getting that done!
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Mammal
4 months, 1 week ago
Do it justice Andrew! It's beckoning.
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roil
4 months, 1 week ago
So excited for you to try running smaller chainrings and cassettes with a HP+I setup! How small of a chainring do you dare go?
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Comes down to chainline (matching the idler) and what I can scrounge in terms of rings. No commitment today, but I’ll see what I can dig up.
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Andy Eunson
4 months, 1 week ago
That cable routing though. More curves than a contour line in canyon country. That blue is spectacular.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Whether internal or external, I don’t see a better path for the cables in terms of how the rear suspension moves.
How would you route it?
The Clairebarian’s thinking her next bike should be this colour.
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Andy Eunson
4 months, 1 week ago
Maybe along the top tube "seat stay". But then you’ll get a moving loop. I hate to say it, but electric might be the way. I have this theory that when you curve a shift housing too much the housing ovalizes a bit. The narrow dimension can become smaller than the cable dimension. So if one is using a Shimano cable at 1.2 mm and Jagwire housing which presumably is smaller for Jagwire’s 1.1 cable you get an increase in friction. I recently put a new cable and housing (Shimano cable and Jagwire housing) on my Fuel ex. Shifting stunk. I soon replaced the housing with Shimano sp41 and it improved immediately.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Yeah, I only use Shimano housing at home and in the shop.
I’ll report back either way, but honestly have no concern about the routing.
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BarryW
4 months, 1 week ago
You need to familiarize yourself with a web search...
But you asked: Chainsaw merch
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Lu Kz
4 months, 1 week ago
Not to be a hater or anything, but just a warning: Redbubble is one of those sites that kind of just lets whoever upload a design for stickers/t-shirts/posters etc. without worrying about copywrite or paying whoever came up with the original design. I think the original "long live chainsaw" shirts had some charity component to them, I would be surprised if these ones did too.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
The Chainsaw stickers NSMB sold were net to the Stevie Smith Legacy Foundation.
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Mammal
4 months, 1 week ago
That's correct, and redbubble isn't the only online store that's selling T-shirts with that same ripped off logo. Nobody that's a part of the Stevie Legacy org is going to litigate, but they're definitely not legit, and I'd never buy something like that to commemorate the Legend.
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XXX_er
4 months, 1 week ago
That Big Bang frame looks a lot like the FRD1 frame from > 20 yrs ago we had one which junior broke completely in half, cuz it was still in warranty Devinci sent us a replacement which they had beefed up with an large extra gusset between the 2 main frame tubes at the headstock so i would guess a lot of those frames broke especaily the model that came stock with a Boxxer
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Yeah, it failed in August 2002 at Whistler. You’ve told this story a few times.
What bikes, even bikes designed for much more aggressive riding than a Magma didn’t break then?
I have witnessed some amazing frame failures of full-on DH and Freeride bikes and none of them would impact my purchasing decisions in 2023.
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Cooper Quinn
4 months, 1 week ago
Yep. I was drinking beer on the GLC patio when I watched someone snap a headtube off a Stab Primo on the GLC drops (RIP). I have a very vivid memory of the wheels touching down and the rider just.... continuing into the ground. I don't think that has any bearing on the current crop of Konas.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Endless stories both out in the woods and even more from working in shops. Not that stuff doesn't still break but generally, these days when someone breaks a frame they can tell you why (sometimes you need to ask the right questions).
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XXX_er
4 months, 1 week ago
Sure everything broke back then but Devinci beefed it up with a BIG extra gusset,
you don't normaly see big frame up grades like that unless something is not up to snuff
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
I think you might be missing the forest for the trees. This is something that happened in 2002.
.
For conversation's sake, running design changes are certainly not limited to Devinci or to the past. This is actually a good thing.
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Ride.DMC
4 months, 1 week ago
I wish there was somewhere I could buy Long Live Chainsaw merch...
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Hopefully NSMB will be selling them again when the online store relaunches.
https://nsmb.com/articles/longlivechainsaw/
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Jerry Willows
4 months, 1 week ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL-HOmdh6eI
no video embedding?
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Perry Schebel
4 months, 1 week ago
that's an interesting take. you mean a 170mm hp w/ 63* h/a & ~1300mm wb isn't optimized for crinkum switchbacks? criticizing the bike because it doesn't match what HE thinks the design intent should be is novel. that said, well presented, entertaining review.
i kinda / sorta like the idea of this bike. cheap(ish) & canadian made. wondering if it could be built into a viable long-legged all-rounder (ie, pedal friendly, lighter build). i imagine you could ditch the lower pulley; anyone have a frame weight?
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Cooper Quinn
4 months, 1 week ago
I didn't actually watch the video, but it does seem to be lost on some folks (including some reviewers themselves) that just because a bike is bad for what you do/want/need, doesn't mean its necessarily a bad bike. There *are* bad bikes, but there's also just bikes that aren't a fit for the rider, terrain, etc. They're good bikes, for other things.
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Todd Hellinga
4 months, 1 week ago
I think Dave covers off most of that, fwiw.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
@Jerry, can you clarify the point you're trying to make by sharing this video? Without comment, it's impossible to determine what you're trying to contribute or reply to it.
...
@Perry/Cooper, yeah I think it's safe to assume I also wouldn't like the Chainsaw on blue-level Tech-C trails. For riders who want to enjoy those trails, a Chainsaw would be an 'N+1' bike, not an 'N' bike. Entertaining as the video was (it was well done) I think it says more about the premise than the bike. Sticking with Devinci's rigs a Troy would be a much better choice that's more than capable of anything in that video.
In addition to the fact my nine-year-old can almost clean it on her 24" hardtail, one of the recent times I was up there, on my rigid single-speed, I ran into some dudes doing Leopard/CC/Kirkford on their gravel rigs. Not saying they were hauling ass but they were laughing and making their way down just fine.
My assumption is that the Chainsaw is for going fast down trails that I would either be riding much slower on my hardtail or wouldn't choose to ride on my hardtail at all and that I'm probably not riding with my kid. I'm certainly not going to see anyone riding a gravel bike on my way down. (Maybe an exception is a trail like Ned's which can be both shits and giggles on a big bike and also fun on a hardtail).
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Jerry Willows
4 months, 1 week ago
no point other than a different perspective on the bike.... probably should have said that.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Is that a different perspective on the bike though, or round peg square hole?
It was well done regardless.
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Lu Kz
4 months, 1 week ago
It's pretty funny to see this guy acknowledge the legacy of the bike's namesake at the start of the video, fire in a bunch of footage of Steve racing DH, spend the first half of the video talking and climbing, and then immediately drop into what has to be one of the most chill trails you could still pull decent footage out of. I laughed when he did the overhead comparison on the tight corner section between the chainsaw and *checks notes* a dedicated pump track bike.
It's not a schmuck-C bike, so fair enough he didn't like it on the style of trails he rode.
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
I’m trying not to be cynical, but maybe this is just the natural evolution of controversy sells meets the reality of every bike being pretty amazing in its lane, at its price point?
Future Content:
“We Race The Trek Slash HP+I In The BCBR - The Results Might Surprise You.”
“Specialized Epic Vs. Whistler Bike Park’s Chunkiest Lines - It’s Not A Demo!”
“Custom Frame Bags & Intense’s New M1 - Bike Packing In Nepal”
Gotta keep things interesting!
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Lu Kz
4 months, 1 week ago
Damn it Andrew, now you're making me feel like Ive been "Got".
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Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
Hahahaha, does “if you can’t beat ‘em, join ‘em” fit here?
NSMB Reports: ‘Devinci Chainsaw Sucks For Cutting Logs.’
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Lu Kz
4 months, 1 week ago
Remember when commencal did skis? I'm thinking Devinci has got a great setup for a somewhat confusing Stihl crossover
Andrew Major
4 months, 1 week ago
You don’t think the folks at Devinci are Husqvarna people?!
Lu Kz
4 months, 1 week ago
Sure, but Husqvarna "makes bikes" so maybe they'd be less interested?
BryceAnthony
4 months, 1 week ago
I just built one up, 180/180 with a zeb/vivid. It’s quite poppy and only gets deep in its travel when needed. Not a much as a chore as I thought it would be on mellow trails. Very confidence inspiring on feature and wide open trail
The drag from the lower chain guide was horrendous and once removed pedaling was much easier.
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