Vikb profile

Wow. Shocking news. So sad to hear. :(

With saddle at ride height I'm at ~73.5 deg STA [non-setback dropper] on the custom HT with a 140mm fork that's not sagged. I could have gone with a slacker STA, but that would have meant a shorter Reach as the bars would be too far away. So it was a bit of a trade off.

I have an older rigid MTB with a 72.5 deg STA and I put a 1" setback seatpost on it. Pedals very well for me, but the front end is short compared to the newer custom HT.

My FS bikes have 74 deg and 75 deg eff STA [based on geo chart] with a 1" setaback dropper the 74 deg bike has the saddle in a good position for me. I find the 75 deg bike I am a little further forward than I would like. It's not bad, but I definitely don't want steeper.

I can't ride the super steep STAs comfortably. I use 1" setback droppers on my FS bikes and had a hardtail custom made to stay on the slacker side of what is popular at the moment. Obviously YMMV and it's down to your particular body and its needs.

Great looking bike AJ. Always nice to see what choices are made by riders that really care about the nitty gritty details of their bikes. I'm with Pete though. I see the G2 Mega XL on the horizon!

Personally my geo journey seems complete at least in terms of front centre. I don't like super steep STAs as I can't pedal efficiently like that on varied terrain and my arms don't enjoy being super stretched out so that in turn limits the Reach I can manage. Well unless stems flipped backwards become a thing...in that case I may just have gotten started!

Have fun on the new machine and report back frequently. :)

Honestly you can get your gear and water attached to most frames with some effort. So unless you are really needing to haul a bunch of extra gear you don't need much in a fanny pack. I have used a variety of packs and I'm more likely to go with no packs or a minimal hip pack or if that's not enough go straight to a backpack. I don't see the point in a heavily loaded large hip pack.

Porcelain Rocket out of Calgary makes some nice fanny packs that are waterproof. You have to buy them in the fall when the crank out a big batch, but that should be coming up shortly.

https://porcelainrocket.com/collections/seasonals

I have a bunch of PR gear and it's all been superb. Well made. Really durable.

It's paid for. I'm going to keep driving it until it's not economically feasible to keep it rolling. But, hey if you want to loan me your vehicle for a few years I'll beat on it and then give it back to you if you see that as a win. ;-)

Nice truck! :)

I'm 10yrs into seasoning my F150 so it'll be as rad as Owen's truck in another 13yrs.

You have to choose your poison. Either you accept a generic geo that's not made for you, but some "average" rider with whom you only share some traits with or you make your own choices and assume the risk you don't make good ones.

Splitting the difference are designs that have some adjustability [CS length, FC length, shock bolt placement, HTA/STA] so the bike designer can put the bike in a zone she feels comfortable will work for the "average" rider and specific customers can adjust aspects of the geo to suit them with no risk since they can just go back to the "average" stock settings.

People have been building custom bikes successfully for many years so it's not like the Atherton approach is totally novel. Part of the custom build process is the customer requesting specific design/performance elements and the builder considering the requests and providing feedback for areas that they think merit concern or further consideration.

We face the same issues with suspension. You either deal with a generic tune which you adjust to the best of your ability or you get your suspension reworked so it's setup specifically for your needs.

Companies making different length rear triangles is interesting. I kind of hope they start offering customers the opportunity to mix and match front and rear triangles since as you note what is the "best" CS length [or ratio to FC] is not a settled issue. It would be great to be able to order up you CS length and FC to meet your needs. Even if there was an up charge for the service to cover the extra costs or if it was offered as a frame only option to avoid the hassles of adjusting complete bikes.

Companies that are offering adjustable CS are slicing the problem another way since they can cover the desired  CS length range with fewer rear triangles. It's also nice as a customer to be able to change CS length as you may want your bike shorter on slow techy days and longer on high speed days. Adjustable CS combined with adjustable FC [ie Guerrilla Gravity] gives the customer a lot of ways to tweak their bikes.

The other obvious option is made to order bikes like what the Athertons are offering. Where a customer can just dial in their preferred CS/FC STA/HTA...at least within a certain range. As 3-D printing for consumer goods becomes more common the prices for these items can drop making custom or semi-custom bikes affordable for a wider audience.

Posted by: DemonMike

Shammies , WTF are those . Get a quality seat , no need for those.

Agreed adult diapers can wait at least 20 more years! Getting the right saddle is key, but it's something you gotta find through trial and error like finding a pair of shoes that fit your feet great.

My GF got herself a 2019 GG Smash. 160/145mm so not super long travel, but it punches pretty solidly above its weight class. GG got all the little details right and it's sweet to have a made in the US carbon frame.

She's been digging it enjoying her new bike stoke and having fun on her first wagon wheeler.

My 2018 metal Smash is still going strong and I've got no plans to do anything, but ride it a whole lot more. Super fun bike and very capable. :)

Posted by: JBV

anyone in here own a pair? if so, would like to hear your opinion/experience.

I was having elbow/arm issues so I tried a Spank Vibrocore bar. It didn't help my problem and I didn't feel any difference from a normal bar, but as it turns out vibrations were not my issue. It works and feels just like a normal bar. Nothing bad to say about them.

Posted by: syncro

looking at the geo on your Django, the Warden is sitting 2 slacker so I can see how adding the angleset to your Django made an improvement. I'm not sure if going down to 64 is worth it tho considering I like tech climbing, I'm worried the front end will get a bit too floppy.

I'm on a GG Smash with 20mm longer than stock fork and -1 deg Works Component headset. So at ~64 deg HTA. Took a moment to get used to slacker front end. Now it feels normal. I love my techy climbs as much as my techy descents. I haven't had any issues at all going up or dealing with tighter Van Isle trails. I would say the stock bike had better handling feel on tamer terrain, but the new setup is a lot more confident going down techy steeps and the cost in terms of handling isn't a big deal and I am happy with the change to the overall ride of the bike.

Posted by: cerealkilla_

Posted by: Vikb

Right of Way Rules exist. Bikes going downhill give way to bikes climbing. That's easy to figure out and universal. 

Um no. Please feel free to show us where that "rule" is formally stated. It is a general convention among bikes, and it has been followed by pedal-powered bikers over the last 30 years, with the application of this idea being limited pretty much to those trails that are two-way traffic. 

Having an ebike does not automatically grant a special privilege to turn what everyone has always descended into a special climb. As I mentioned before, most Section 57 applications have a directional orientation stated. It may not be clearly signed, but it only takes a teaspoon of common sense to separate descents from two-ways. Credit Line? Descent..... Bobsled? Descent..... Espresso? Descent......Nicoles? descent......Word of Mouth? 2-way....Wonderland.? 2-way.....Bridal Path? 2-way.

As for special ebike rules, when mountain bikes came along way back when, we did indeed have special rules for them and restrictions on where they may go. Same thing should apply to ebikes (I.e. Lord of the Squirrels). Again, we don't need to place strict limits or unreasonable and unfair boundaries around their use. Just reinforce the common sense that has helped keep the trail traffic running smooth for the past 3 decades. 

However, we do not need a special rule for Ebikes when it comes to this issue. Any one (regardless of bike type) that wants to go up a trail that is primarily used for descents, should yield to the descending traffic. It is totally unreasonable, and potentially dangerous to expect downhill traffic on steep trails to be yield to those going against the flow. I see people making all sorts of inappropriate comparisons (Oh ebikes are like snowboards, oh ebikes are like paddle boards, everyone is just hating on us wah wah wah).....Okay, lets use those examples. Would you paddle your paddle board straight out through the break just because you can and expect people to bail off their wave? Would you boot-pack your snowboard straight up under the rollers just because you can? No. ......That is using ebikers OWN logic, and it seems to clearly indicate that riding up against the flow of downhill traffic and expecting others  to yield is non-sensical.

Signage is likely coming, but it takes time and it costs money. In the meantime, it would be nice if common sense prevailed.

I've been riding 30+ years and it's always been downhill bikers yield to uphill bikers. Unless the trail is marked as directional. In that case the rider going in the signed direction has the right of way.

https://www.singletracks.com/blog/trail-advocacy/mountain-biking-basics-trail-etiquette/

If the trail is not signed at all entrances as directional it's a two way trail and you can't assume someone new to the trail network knows what direction the trail is usually ridden in. So there needs to be one universal set of right if way rules because the decision needs to be made to slow/stop very fast.

If the right of way rules are not universal than they are pretty much useless.

Posted by: cerealkilla_

I don't think you actually need local knowledge to know what is a descent and what is a climb. Signage would be helpful for sure, and that signage should be based on the current normal flow of traffic.  However, in absence of signage, what should be the norm?

Right of Way Rules exist. Bikes going downhill give way to bikes climbing. That's easy to figure out and universal. The only exceptions are trails explicitly marked as one-way at all entrances. In the 3 main trail networks I ride there is one trail that is marked as one-way. Given how fast both parties need to deal with meeting you can't have complex rules or different rules at different spots - barring the one-way trails we talked about. The reactions need to be pretty quick when bikes are closing in on each other fast.

The problem I see with adding any special rules for e-bikes is that at a glance I can't tell and e-bike from a mountain bike especially just from the the front. So if they have different Right of Way Rules than mountain bikes it doesn't work because it takes too long to know what's going on and right of way needs to simple and fast to understand or it fails. 

So if you have a downhill trail you don't want someone on an e-bike to climb you need to sign it and make it a downhill only trail.

Posted by: cerealkilla_

Most trails are built with a directional orientation, and this is usually listed in the Section 57 approval (i.e. downhill primary). I would suggest that the person riding the trail in the primary direction holds the right of way, regardless of their propulsion system.

Unless a trail is clearly marked [at every entry point] as being one-way or that right of way is based on a specific direction of travel than a rider has to assume it's a standard two-way trail and the climber has right of way. You can't have right of way be determined by local knowledge and not have that info on clear signage or it's just not workable. Whole purpose of the current right of way rules is that you know instantly who needs to stop or move over.

Posted by: mtbman99

This is the issue with ebikes how do you stop these guys vs specific categories.

You aren't going to stop them. It's got pedals and so it's good to go.

Posted by: Kenny
With ebikes the only cap is technology. if ebikes are not a motorbike loophole currently, it's pretty tough to imagine they won't be in the future. It's the nature of capitalism and "progress" that makes this inevitable. That'scary.

Yes. That's the problem. We would never have been okay with gas motorcycles on MTB/hiking trails, but because there is an electric motor and a lower powered stock configuration as "get the foot in the door" product it now makes sense to mix motors and human powered recreation like that? The process of getting faster/more powerful e-motos on these trails is inevitable.

If riders/MTB companies don't care and think that's a good idea we can agree to disagree, but please don't come back in 5-10 years and act like they couldn't see this coming.

Posted by: Hepcat

Dismayed to discover during yesterdays ride that both the guys who ride e-bikes at my local (highly sensitive) trail have now pulled the cranks off. 🤢

Just throttle.

Nobody should be surprised. This idea that someone is going to inspect every electric moped/motorcycle to see if it meets some arbitrary authorized standard is fantasy. If you let motors on the trails you let anything even remotely resembling what's legal onto the trails. That's just our new reality. Pedaling is now optional. If pegs catch too much attention that same throttle equipped moped will get the pedals reinstalled just to get past any parking lot scrutiny and on the trails he can happy pin the throttle and shred.