EDITORIAL
Sweating The Small Stuff At Crankworx 2019: Part 3
ALN
I'd never met Andreane Lanthier Nadeau so it was a treat to bump into her at the Rocky Mountain booth while I was giving her bike the once over. This is the machine she raced to third place, in a tight top three, at this year's Whistler EWS. It's obviously setup just-so with ALN preferring a carbon Race Face rear wheel, with CushCore inserted, and a more forgiving aluminum wheel up front. There's even a custom mini-fender where the chainstays meet the main pivot.
Race Face carbon wheel with CushCore out back.
Race Face aluminum wheel sans insert up front.
OneUp chainguide meets custom mini-fender.
Lots of leverage from the Race Face dropper remote.
Maple Syrup saddle from WTB.
I've been riding Schwalbe ProCore up front all summer with a 29x2.8" tire in a i39 rim and it's been great. Right around the corner from Rocky some poor wrench at the CushCore booth was doing endless installation demos. I'm not much for watching self-flagellation but I did have to snag a quick shot of the new Plus-sized CushCore and I have to admit I'm beyond intrigued about how the inserts' performance scales up to big rubber.
I'm a fan of the ride quality of a CushCore front setup and the rim protection it offers out back. How does that scale up to Plus-sized rubber?
I could have spent the rest of my day at the Rocky booth listening to Jesse Melamed talk about bikes. I know it's not a metric that counts on the race course and I haven't met a lot of EWS racers, but after briefly meeting ALN, Jesse, and previously Remi, it seems Rocky has assembled the nicest trio of folks you could have on an Enduro team.
Jeff Bryson used to wrench for Rocky's EWS team. Cam wrote an interesting piece about their process in 2017.
Wicked Rides
Speaking of sweet bikes. I dropped by to visit James at SuspensionWerx in the pits and this Ohlins equipped single speed is in the stand. I've never seen one of these SB One in the flesh. They're big money, but they are also of obvious quality.
James was turning the wrenches on Cane Creek and Ohlins product providing athlete support and warranty service.
The SB One tensioner is a great looking piece of small production product with a matching price. It has adjustable tension and chainline and rebuildable.
I would certainly go single speed for a DH/Park bike. I've experimented plenty but it's not a winning configuration for an FS bike that needs to be pedaled up hill.
I was heading to the village when what should appear but Jordie Lunn's current YT ride. I was under-caffeinated at the time if you're wondering how I missed it. The custom cut I-Beam saddle is sweet.
The stock I-Fly has been a popular DH saddle for years, so I can't guess at Jordie's motivation in trimming it.
The saddle nose has been shortened quite a bit. It takes a lot of will power to resist throwing a leg over!
Sensus Swayze push-on grip with the flange cut down.
Looks fun standing still.
Don't see Ti springs much these days.
Product testing. If this derailleur could talk.
I'm surprised the grips aren't wired. I assume they're glued in place.
Teardowns
Industry Nine and SRAM both had some interesting displays with bodies chopped to show how the guts look inside. The new Industry Nine Hydra hub has a loud, unique, intriguing... I'm not really sure how to describe the noise it makes. I didn't realize that SRAM had carried over the counter measures spring concept from their air rear shocks to the coils. It's meant to aid with initialization.
Wicked fast engagement from a relatively simple looking pawl mechanism. The sound is one of a kind.
Leaf springs replace the coils which will make service easier and should outlast the tiny wound boingers.
Here I am thinking 31.8mm stems were on the way out and Industry Nine releases a smaller clamp version of their sweet A35 (A35 shown in photo).
Counter Measures spring gets that damper IFP moving.
Cut out of the latest charger damper.
The standard Debonair can VS. the larger, tuneable, Meg Neg can.
The Meg Neg setup means both the positive and negative air pressure chambers are tuned with volume spacers.
Formula Cura 4
The Cura 4 has been available for a while now but this is the first set I've seen in person. After having reviewed the Cura 2-piston, I'm not surprised these are good looking brakes. I'll be testing a pair so please expect a teardown and first look review soon.
The Cura 4 and Cura 2 share the same master cylinder assembly.
Gone is the caliper quick coupler. It is still available as an aftermarket option
This is Formula's first new brake pad in a long time and their first 4-piston mountain bike pad.
That's it for me and Crankworx for 2019. I'll outro with some random shots that didn't seem to fit anywhere else.
Yes, that is a suspension handlebar. I can't decide how I feel about it.
But, it does make these Rev suspension grips seem so sane that I think they qualify as must-try.
Whoever it is at Specialized who's keeping the dream of an externally routed rear brake alive: I Love You. To other bike designers, I bet you can't come up with a cleaner system than this (yes, it's a challenge).
I'm always hunting for steel hardtails but all I've found is the new, more budget, steel version of Knolly's Cache gravel bike. It does take a dropper post...
Alright, time for Jeff and I to roll back to North Vancouver. This is the least gas I've burned on a Whistler trip.
Comments
Vik Banerjee
4 years, 8 months ago
I've been dealing with an annoying RSI/ergonomic injury for the last year+. I'm glad there are all sorts of oddball touch point products available. Most people don't need them and can ignore them, but when you need something different to keep you on the bike it's great that companies are designing and making out of the box products that offer something different than the mainstream.
I've mostly been experimenting with bar shape and position relative to the saddle, but I can see how Fasst Flexx bars or Rev Grips could be a game changer for someone with elbow/hand issues.
I've got a setup my body seems to be reasonably happy with now, but having turned 50 and wanting to continue to ride hard on challenging trails for a long time to come I'm not fooling myself into thinking this will be the last time I'll be poking around at the margins of the MTB industry looking for a solution to a health problem!
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Andy Eunson
4 years, 8 months ago
I have Revgrips on my hardtail. Nice grips. Feel good and three diameters available. Well made. Expensive. Made zero difference for me. I was having elbow issues and thought it was worth a test. Thing is I don’t deathgrip the bars and if you grasp a normal grip and “rev” it, the fat pads on your hand move in the same way. I’ve said it before, but riders like me who have ridden the shore, in winter, on bikes with minimal or no suspension, with rim brakes, have special forearm powers.
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Vik Banerjee
4 years, 8 months ago
Did you find anything else that helped your elbow issues?
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Andy Eunson
4 years, 8 months ago
Rest from what caused it which was snow shovelling in winter and clearing trails in spring with a small saw and brushing axe. The elbows are just showing a hint of problems now after maybe 150 days riding this year since April.
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MTBrent
4 years, 8 months ago
The Fasst Flexx bars still seem ridiculous, but that makes me want to try them even more.
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Shinook
4 years, 8 months ago
Mine show up this afternoon, we'll see how they pan out. They have a 30 day money back guarantee, so if you try them and don't like them, then you can send them back. The VitalMTB (am I allowed to say that here?) review was pretty positive when it came to feel, but did complain about some design deficiencies. I agree it seems a bit ridiculous and weird, but for people that suffer from certain injuries or problems, they could be an innovative solution that allows them to continue riding. As an industry, the mountain bike world hasn't done a good job of dealing with hand issues that plague most riders (there seems to be certain amounts of acceptance of nerve damage as being 'normal') and solutions like this are a step in the right direction towards improving comfort, reducing fatigue, and reducing overuse injuries.
I have pretty serious hand issues I've been dealing with the entire time I've been riding. I live in an area with long downhills and a lot of eroded, chunky terrain, which aggravates the nerves in my hand pretty badly. I've found relief with some components (smoother suspension, powerful brakes), but little from others that were specifically marketed towards these types of issues (Rev Grips). For me, depending on the trail, I generally start having to manage the pain after 2-3 minutes of going downhill, so anything that lengthens that is worth a try, but IMO the industry as a whole needs to start working on better solutions for prevention of hand issues and the community needs to stop accepting symptoms of nerve damage as normal.
Judging by the bike setup in the photo (DVO suspension, Flexx bars, Rev Grips), I'd wager the rider of that bike has similar problems. I found DVO and Manitou provided the most relief combined with the best performance from suspension components. The Rev Grips didn't work for me, mainly due to ergonomics, but I imagine they could relieve some issues. We'll see how the Flexx bars work out over the next 30 days.
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Andrew Major
4 years, 8 months ago
Definitely let us know what you think - first impressions and long term.
I’ve made more subtle ergonomic moves on my personal bikes - 16* SQLab bars; Push-On grips instead of lock-ons - and the Rev grips are interesting. Currently I’m testing Wolf Tooth’s new Karv...
...just having a really hard time wrapping my mind around the suspension bar!
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Shinook
4 years, 8 months ago
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Shinook
4 years, 8 months ago
Will do.
The Wolf Tooth stuff is nice, but on the grip front, I'm really liking the ODI Dread Lock grips I've had on for a few weeks now. They are grippier than silicon foam and much softer feeling. I wish they made their slide on Vapor grips in larger diameter.
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fartymarty
4 years, 8 months ago
I can vouch for 16 degree bars and Renthal Ultra Tacky push ons for helping reduce carpal tunnel.
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Shinook
4 years, 7 months ago
So apparently there is a comment size limit, so I had to post my thoughts in an imgur album rather than flood this post with chopped up comments. You can read them and see the photos below:
https://imgur.com/a/FJJsY8F
I'll report back after a few more weeks on how they feel and hold up.
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Andrew Major
4 years, 7 months ago
Interesting; thanks! Certainly there’s an opportunity to produce the bars in multiple sweeps by making different connectors to bond the straight carbon tubes into. Might be a combination of sweep and absorption you’re looking for.
Have you moved your grips / controls inboard to match the width you normally run? Big difference between 780mm and 800mm on the trail.
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Shinook
4 years, 7 months ago
I meant to comment on the sweep. I agree, there seems to be an opportunity to offer some tuning, possibly by offering the outboard portions with different angles.
I expect their manufacturing is dependent upon straight tubes, but you could probably replace the entire outer assembly to provide more sweep. I think that'd be a great option, as well, because their current offering is a bit more traditional than I'd prefer, I think I'd like them closer to that 10 degree angle.
On the grips and width, I haven't yet, but I plan to. Strangely enough, these are the first bars I've ridden where the 800 didn't feel insanely wide. I'm not sure if it's because they are compressing on impacts, which changes the sweep and feel, or what, but I thought they felt pretty good where they are currently. I do plan on moving my grips further inboard to see how they feel at 780, though.
Andrew Major
4 years, 7 months ago
Fasst does a range of sweeps in their moto line. From 10 to 19.
Andrew Major
4 years, 7 months ago
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Shinook
4 years, 7 months ago
Following up on this again after a few more weeks. I'll keep it short this time so I don't have to make a post somewhere else.
They continue to do great. I had a first at the park a few days ago: everyone else complaining their hands hurt and mine didn't! It's almost always the other way around. I've been PRing trails that I've maybe ridden top to bottom in their entirety less than 5 in >60 times and my hands do not feel aggravated the next day after pushing through it.
The pain is still there, it's not a total solve, but they help enormously. At this point, I can manage it easier and it's more about slowing down than stopping. I've found the trails where I get really big flare ups are trails everyone else is having issues too, so it brings me onto a more level playing field.
I do wish the geometry was a little different though, I think 10 degrees sweep and a geo similar tot he PNW Range KW bars would be a better fit for those with hand issues, but aside from that, they are awesome. I bought them fully expecting to return them and I have no plans on doing so.
No maintenance or durability issues yet, but it's still early for me on them.
Andrew Major
4 years, 7 months ago
Thanks Shinook!
I have a set of the Fasst bars on the way for a full length review process; really excited to ride them on a few different bikes.
Appreciate your updates on your experiences.
mike
4 years, 7 months ago
Thanks for the review. Being a old school rider , the elastermers and winter use are my main worries. I remember my old RST MOZO 4.5 and the Judy fork I had. When it got cold and wet they stiffened up really bad. Even when fully greased up.
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Shinook
4 years, 7 months ago
When the temps drop here during the winter, I'll try out the softer ones to see if they firm up enough below certain temps. I suppose I could do a freezer test, too, with the soft ones anyway.
cyclotoine
4 years, 8 months ago
Not that I've tried them, but it sounds like Cush Core (based on their claims) might be helpful. I haven't worked up enough saliva to swallow the bitter bill that is the price of admission myself, but I'd sure like to see what this tire damping is all about.
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Shinook
4 years, 8 months ago
I've tried CushCore to help with hand pain and found it provides some relief, but not a ton. It makes the tire feel more damped and less bouncy, which seems to help relieve some impacts on your hands, especially when it comes to square edge, sharp impacts. I found it dulls those somewhat, but it wasn't a night and day difference. I'm able to ride longer and harder as a result of installing it, though, and I'd suggest it to anyone having hand issues for sure.
I did find it helped cornering a fair bit, also, as it provides more support to the tire and prevents it from folding over when the bike is leaned hard, particularly in the front.
Aside from installation/removal difficulty and weight, there isn't much downside to running CC in the front, it is all positive for me: more tire pressure options, more tire support, some hand relief. The benefits of running it in the rear seem more subtle than the front and a bit more questionable. IMO it's a shame so many people run it rear only, because you really miss the benefits of the system when it's just in the rear. The weight of running it front only didn't change much for me, but I did notice more drag and rolling weight when installed in the rear.
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Andrew Major
4 years, 8 months ago
I find my rigid bike is the best isolation test for products like ProCore or CushCore, or Push-On VS. lock-on grips, or maybe even suspension handlebars. The difference between brilliant and blah is simple more obvious every ride (the bike is long and slack with real brakes and tires).
I feel the same way about ProCore. Install, weight, is more tune-able but requires more maintenance but otherwise it’s all positives up front.
Really hoping to have the chance to have a go at the new Plus-sized CushCore on it.
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Timer
4 years, 8 months ago
What kind of grips and bars are you running on the rigid bike? There are so many products, so much conflicting information and so many bogus marketing claims around that it's really hard to find bars and grips that actually reduce hand fatigue.
Andrew Major
4 years, 8 months ago
I generally run Renthal’s Ultra Tacky Push-On grips glued & wired. I like thin grips and they’re awesome.
That said, I just mounted up some Wolf Tooth Karv grips (first ride tomorrow AM) and the potential is interesting. The material is tackier than similar grips (ESI) and the more-at-the-palm shape feels comfy. The angled shape where my fingers are makes sense (and I think I’ve optimized the angle) so I’m very hopeful they’re the new go to - grippy enough, thin enough, more comfy. We’ll see - high expectations.
Bar on that bike is a 16* back swept SQLab 30X. My wrists like the additional sweep. Have ridden tons of different bar geometry and have been happiest with that. Maybe a suspension bar would be the difference maker though?!?!?!
[user profile deleted]
4 years, 8 months ago
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mike
4 years, 7 months ago
@hubsessed on instagram just gave his thoughts on these bars. Mentioned some 45min decents using them. He,s been using them for several months now. Might have to check into them over the winter for my next bike project.
Just priced out a pair of these bars, with today's exchange they are $564CDN that,s a tough pill to swallow IMO.
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Andrew Major
4 years, 3 months ago
Following up to say I contacted Fasst about doing a review. There was a bit of a delay waiting for the new 12-degree bars and now pretty excited to have started the process; I’ll be running the bar with a mediocre 160mm fork, high performance 160mm fork, my 100mm Shore-XC fork, and finally my rigid fork.
I’m testing the new 12-degree backsweep version. First couple photos are up on my Instagram account and the first look should be up on NSMB fairly soon.
Started with the mediocre 160mm fork. I don’t notice them at all riding (probably a good thing) but my hands and bad elbow definitely felt fresher at the end of my ride. Once the weather is more epic-friendly I suspect I’ll notice an even bigger difference.
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Allen Lloyd
4 years, 8 months ago
One of the fastest guys I know rides them and they feel like they do what they say they do. I believe they have been making dirtbike bars for years so it makes sense to transfer over to bikes.
I think the issue for many people is with 35mm you either need a carbon bar or a high quality alu bar. The larger diameter can transfer more vibration that can cause issues. Prime example is the flat Race Face alu bar that comes on a ton of bikes these days, it was killing my hands. Replaced with a Renthal and instantly felt better.
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Vik Banerjee
4 years, 8 months ago
I'm sticking to 31.8mm for stems/bars. Lots of options and I can see no benefit to the larger diameter for own needs.
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JVP
4 years, 8 months ago
Same. I tried 35mm for about a month and went back to 31.8 alum.
Everyone with repetitive stress injuries needs to go to a cycling-specific physio. Seriously, find a specialist, specialist. Normal PT did nothing for me, but a mad scientist who does mostly riders got me back riding w/out pain.
Us 40+ guys who ride hard, especially trail builders, have beat the crap out of our bodies for decades. I think longer bikes are making hand/arm issues worse, while simultaneously helping back issues. We're still on a learning curve on how to set long-ass bikes up for long-term comfort.
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Vik Banerjee
4 years, 8 months ago
I'm with you on long bikes. At first I enjoyed the cockpit room, but then I started having serious elbow issues. Going to narrower bars and a smaller cockpit are the two things that have helped the most so far.
Obviously this is a YMMV issue and not a one size fits all criticism.
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mike
4 years, 8 months ago
You can still size down!!! And repetitive , yup , 32 yrs as a machinist. My hands arms and shoulders are beat. Plus injuries from riding and digging. I find the longer bike more comforting , too small get me crapped up. Also got to remember , the older we get (51 last month) the more other things we have to do. I find working out and stretching. And trail digging all help , but can beat you up as well.
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Andrew Major
4 years, 8 months ago
Renthal aluminum are the most forgiving 35mm bar I’ve ridden (and written about - specifically their effort to mate the cosmetics of 35mm to the ride of their 31.8 bars) and I’m with Vik on just running 31.8 on my own bike.
Interesting that I9 released a 31.8 stem, After first releasing 35mm. I think more people are making the choice to stick with 31.8 than ‘the industry’ may have expected.
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Shrockie
4 years, 8 months ago
I'd like to see how the Fasst Flexx rates compared to the One-Up bars with oval profile section for added compliance. One up has been killing it.
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Andrew Major
4 years, 8 months ago
Not at all similar in terms of what the products are doing/advertised to do. The Fasssssssssst bars use elastomers to deliver actual visual movement in the bars (with tune-able compression and rebound).
Ride a OneUp bar and a Renthal bar (I recommend 31.8 aluminum but any Renthal bar is a fair comparison and the carbon is apples to apples) and you’ll have the fairest comparison I can think of.
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Shinook
4 years, 7 months ago
I've had both the OneUp and Flexx bars. I spent a few months on the OneUp bars and about 3 weeks (so far) on the Flexx bars.
I think the OneUp bar is more to relieve minor vibration issues for people that don't have hand problems. The amount of flex is greater than what you get with a normal bar, so I think those without medical problems will feel an improvement where their hands normally start to act up, but those of us with serious issues won't get much relief. They do flex a fair bit than other bars, but for me there was no comparison, the Fasst Flexx bars had more compliance and adjustability, but it comes at a weight and price penalty. The vibrations damped by the OneUp bars are more the smaller impacts/vibrations, where the Flexx bars dull out the sharper ones much better and across a wider range.
I have no hesitation recommending the OneUp bars, but people with hand issues will get more relief from the Flexx bars.
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earle.b
4 years, 8 months ago
So.eone didn't sweat the small stuff trimming that zip tie on ALN dropper lever. Why a zip tie on there in the first place?
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Mammal
4 years, 8 months ago
Not sure why, but maybe they want a bit more cable length available beyond the clamp screw. Zip tie secures the extra length from getting in the way. I was very curious about that myself.
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Perry Schebel
4 years, 8 months ago
haha, glad i'm not the only one that was bothered by that detail.
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mike
4 years, 8 months ago
I think it's a mechanics trick for the racers. The zap strap replaces the crimp end. So if the racer needs to replace the cable it,s precut to length , and might even have a soldered end on the cable.
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Andrew Major
4 years, 8 months ago
Look on the bright-side here folks - whatever that extra cable / zip tie is for, ALN is all set for what to get her mechanic for Christmas!
A nice set of flush-cut snips.
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Shoreboy
4 years, 8 months ago
How would said mechanic re-tension the cable if it was cut flush?
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Velocipedestrian
4 years, 8 months ago
Is the lever position very adjustable on that remote? Could be a trick to reduce the throw for smaller thumbs / preferred position.
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Velocipedestrian
4 years, 8 months ago
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mike
4 years, 8 months ago
Flex bars have my interest peaked. Been slowly making changes to try and combat hand issues. I run high rise carbon 31.8mm bars with slip-on grips. This does help when compared to other set-ups. Hell even my saddle has some suspension ( SQLab 611) . I have been really hoping to see some new bikes from Devinci and Transition. DJ bikes are cool but bring on the trail and enduro bikes!!!
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Andrew Major
4 years, 8 months ago
Have you tried different bar sweeps as well Mike?
I didn’t bump into anyone from Transition or Devinci while I was there. It was a solid day but not as much time as I needed to track down everything.
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mike
4 years, 8 months ago
No I prefer the highest rise bar I can find and they are limited on sweep. Current bars are 780mm x 35mm rise Renthal carbons. Very precise feeling, I used ODI Vapor grips.
Devinci is redoing the Django , other than that I have yet to see anything on my interests.
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AndrewR
4 years, 7 months ago
@mike you can get SQ-Lab 30X bar in 780 mm x 31.8 mm clamp x 45mm rise in both 12º and 16º back sweep. I am running the 780mm x 31.8mm x 30mm rise in 12º and they are amazing (no hand/ wrist or pump issues but certainly notice an unloading on the scaphoid/ radial head area and far more comfort). I am running Chromag's new single lock-on Factor grips but the SQ-Labs 711 grip is about to get a try out.
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mike
4 years, 7 months ago
Might have to look into those Thanks!!!
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Cr4w
4 years, 8 months ago
Great article AM. Lots of fun tidbits in there!
Jordie Lynn's curious customizations are super interesting. I love reading about the unique tweaks people make to their rides.
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bart
4 years, 8 months ago
what were you driving?
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Andrew Major
4 years, 8 months ago
Jeff has a Toyota Prius. It’s been around but it’s a great little car.
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