what's it going to take...

to get people involved with their local trail associations?

how is it that we live in mtb heaven yet have such a problem recruiting help to run an organization that plays a huge role in keeping the trails open and running?

if people aren't willing to get dirty or donate time, why won't more of them donate a day's pay towards keeping the trails open? if you can afford to ride a two, three, four thousand or more dollar valued bike surely you can afford to donate an amount equal to say the cost of a new tire each year.

it would be nice to get some serious answers to these questions. if we can then maybe we can find a way to help move things forward.

First lets ask people what they want the NSMBA to be?

What do you want from the NSMBA?

We can then look at what the NSMBA currently does and how well they are addressing those wants.

Alot of the things being mentioned in this thread are already happening, or have happened. Maybe some stuff just needs to be done better.

For me, Synchro pretty much nailed it in the AGM thread with the comments on negativity. This is what I hear from most people (not all) involved in either running NSMBA or doing a huge amount of volunteer/trailwork.

1. Want to voice an opinion? If you don't come to the AGM, or have a shovel in your hand, don't bother.
2. Want something done? Become a director or do it yourself.
3. "You guys have NO IDEA how much work we do/have" (basically bitch, bitch, bitch). You'd be surprised how many people understand and appreciate it even though it's not said often enough.

So what would it take for me to get interested in becoming a director?

1. More of a positive attitude towards constructive criticism regardless of the delivery channel.
2. STOP BITCHING ABOUT HOW MUCH WORK YOU DO/HAVE. Why would ANYONE want to take up that much un-paid responsibility for a recreational activity based charity (rec charity not meant to sound demeaning, just comparing to charities involving disease, the underprivileged, etc)?
3. Have a proven structure in place that would distribute the workload over a greater number of people.

Beer and free food are nice, but are not a draw for me. Always bring my own food [HTML_REMOVED] drink to trail days.

btw - let me say that whenever I've worked with monkey he's hauled rocks like a bacon-starved asian so he's got the cred to back it up.

like a bacon-starved asian

lol asia

and Barker still wins for biggest rock. That monster was bigger than me.

well to be honest, from what ive seen. It seems the NSMBA has a very preachy self righteous attitude that i do not agree with. I agree being part of the trail association is mandatory for all users but many including myself are simply turned off supporting a group that looks at guilting users rather than informing them. If you took a more relaxed and open stance it may be a differant siuation. An example of this being boycotting brands that dont support trail days, local shops that dont donate to you. These are very immature tactics to generate revenue.

FLAME ON

i totally understand where you're coming from but i think your comments are a little off base. a lot of the preachy self righteous attitude unfortunately comes from people who may support the nsmba, but are not directors of the organization. you see it every now and then on the boards here when various issues concerning the trails come up.

maybe we could ask everyone who supports the nsmba and flies their flag in their sig to pause before they post that rant as it does not contribute to a positive image of the nsmba.

Lots of builders are doing work on their own, without much, if any, help from the NSMBA, the only exception to this is getting Permits, which the NSMBA will help you with.

If it weren't for the behind-the-scenes work (meetings, grant applications, paperwork, insurance, etc.) that volunteers from trail associations do, there wouldn't be any permits to be had.

It takes an unbelievable amount of work just to deal with the various land owners and government agencies most of our trails are on. There's so much more going on than physically working on trails. That's what causes many volunteers to burn out. Working on trails is the easy part.

Corporate trail days was another initiative.

A few happened, MEC on Fromme, Norco on Seymour could have been others.

These are really great and should be as simple as possible.

The shop gets out the people, food and drink if they want, the NSMBA brought out some tools and expertise.

Again, these initiatives are time consuming.

The ones that we did were not time consuming. There was no prep, no plan. We wanted to show the kids exactly how much work was involved in doing trailwork. It was unadvertised and small. The largest group so far has been about 8 people besides D and myself. We headed up at 930 and were back at 1230. The kids couldn't believe it took so long to do so little. The benefits to the FVMBA is that next year there will be an additional 20 dues paying members (so far).

In my opinion, this approach will far outweigh an official trailday. I think that some people show up for a trailday, mill about in the forest for a couple hours, lift a couple rocks, carry a bucket or two of dirt, collect their free lunch and prizes and figure they have given back for the year. They didn't see the previous weekend spent prepping for a large group and they didn't comprehend that it is impossible for an individual or two to maintain a trail top to bottom in a weekend.

I think big official trail days are good but I think they might mislead the average person who comes out. The kids have now seen that rebuilding a berm is not a one day ordeal, in fact, some of the kids wanted to come back out on the Sunday after the club thing to get the berm done.

I find my efforts are spent better mentoring the kids and educating their parents then trying to re-educate the average rider.

These are my personal opinions and practices and are not those expressed by the FVMBA or its directors.

I met Ducati one time to help out cuz of a post on nsmb. Just saying…

Same here.

I don't check the trail building forum that much (damn NBR) but from last summer I remember that Ducati posted a few times for help with Floppy Bunny/NH and Synchro posted for help with Salvation (sorry, couldn't make it).

Opportunities to work closely with experienced trailbuilders like these guys is what I'm looking for. It seems like the most effective way to train new builders who can then go on to adopt their own trails, which is what I'd like to do. So post it up when you guys need help! Breed skilled builders.

I've got a lot of free time the first few weeks of December (unless snow conditions get good!) so if anyone needs help building then message me.

maybe we could ask everyone who supports the nsmba and flies their flag in their sig to pause before they post that rant as it does not contribute to a positive image of the nsmba.

Maybe people could not get so butthurt all the time over nothing?

Maybe people could not get so butthurt all the time over nothing?

we will catch more volunteers with honey than vinegar.

we will catch more volunteers with honey than vinegar.

i thought it was pizza and beer?:pizza::beer:

Unfortunately I think many of the people that would volunteer are of my demographic. I am mid 30's, work 50+ hours a week, am on the executive board of my national professional association and have a young baby at home. I would love to put some time into the NSMBA (and in past year have put in a fair amount of time) but right now I just can't. I don't get to see my family enough as it is.

I am not trying to make excuses for myself, but I wonder how many people are in similar situations.

I'm pretty much in this exact demographic although I try very hard not to stray over the 40 hours a week mark. Still with a young baby in tow the rules change and things begin to get extra complicated. In our case we're very pointedly learning to simply involve our daughter in everything we normally would do including things like the NSMBA. That being said things have been more difficult to schedule and more difficult to plan for.

In the past few years I've donated a lot of my time to Trail days and helped out where I can (my wife has done a lot more than that). Yes I find myself wanting to do more, but with the complications involved I now require not just to hear 'yes you can volunteer', but I need to hear 'This is what we need people for, and this is when we need it'. I'm sure I have skills that could be of use to the organization, but I don't have time any more to pursue the organization with a resume. I need the organization to give me a very specific idea of what can be volunteered for, so I can look at that list and say 'hey, I can do that' and plan well ahead for it. If the whole concept is vague and non-specific, I can't realistically commit.

we will catch more volunteers with honey than vinegar.

seeing as you actually seem to believe that people are so affected by a rant or two (which are always followed by a ton of posts condemning the rant), i'll just remove my support for the NSMBA from my sig. that what you were after?

i'd rather speak my mind without having people get all butthurt. so when you see my next rant: i don't speak for the NSMBA

that's how I met Synchro

damn this place.

Damn….me too

I think we ought to boycott this place instead.

For what it's worth though,how many people here were actually out building trails BEFORE the nsmba existed?

Remember those days?

When we did it for fun?

Who really wants to go out and mitigate trail failures when they could be out riding?

All the good stuff has gone underground….today's fight on the frontcountry trails is a lost cause to save trails for the gapers.

full circle.