weight training for biking?

Decline bench press sounds like it would be really good for lower pecs. I don't think Canada Games has a machine for that though :(.

mana: You say 12 reps are good for building mass. You mean lower than this isn't good for building mass? I thought the rule of thumb (perhaps the outdated rule of thumb?) was higher reps (ie. 12 or 15) and lighter weight for toning and endurance and lower reps (ie. 6 or 8) and heavier weight for strength. Untrue?

most of the advice on this post has been very good.keep in mind fellow bb users,that when you workout naturally[no juice]your bodies natural growth hormone will drop off around 45-60 min depending on the person.so when hittin' the weights keep your workouts within that range and make it very intense.[not talking cardio here folks.work out your whole body and don;t skimp on leg workouts because they release the most growth hormone/testosterone than any other muscle group.i have been following these principles for 20 years and belive me they work.hope this helps:D

Originally posted by Gandalf

mana: You say 12 reps are good for building mass. You mean lower than this isn't good for building mass? I thought the rule of thumb (perhaps the outdated rule of thumb?) was higher reps (ie. 12 or 15) and lighter weight for toning and endurance and lower reps (ie. 6 or 8) and heavier weight for strength. Untrue?

A general rule is this:
- 1 to 5 reps (2-5 sets) yields most strength gain, some mass, and some definition/tone.

- 6 to 15 reps (2 to 5 sets) yields most mass gain, some strength, and some definition.

- [HTML_REMOVED]15 reps (2 to 5 sets) yields most definition, some strength, some mass.

Obviously there is some overlapping here and results will vary with each individual. Again, it is important to finish each set to fatigue using the proper form and technique.

I have to agree that everyone here has some good advice. But in the end it all comes down to what works for you.

If you took any 5 of us in this thread and put us all on the same diet and the same exercise program, you would get 5 totally different results. THis is actually fairly true even if you took 5 people with the same height/weight dimensions.

While everyone's body reacts similiarly to exercise, it's not identical.

As far as the slow reps thing, I'm not a real believer, but if it works for you, then it works.

I'd take one of the few guys on this board up on their offer to write you up a program. They seem to have more experience than myself with formal programs - I know what works for me, I can only suggest it to you… heheh

Try the program for a month and check the results - talk to your new "trainer" about the results you are and are not seeing so far, and they can modify the program to add a little more focus to the areas you need. A month will not transform your body, but you should be able to tell the direction it is heading if you are strict with your workouts.

One last item - know your body ( I hate saying that, I feel like a highschool councillor about to talk to a bunch of teenage girls….heheh)

Know it - know the difference between strain and fatigue. Fatigue is fine, strain is real bad and just knocked back your workout a few weeks.

Know it - Form! Gyms have mirrors so you don't hurt yourself, not so you can check to make sure you look pretty. You may feel that you're standing straight but look like a friggin pretzel in the mirror. Proper body position sitting/standing/lying down etc will focus the workout on the desired muscles, and save you from possible injury/strain etc.

Originally posted by Derek Diggler
quite hard on the back, and you will always have the problem of one leg compensating for the other.

Actually Diggler, if you work your way up and always lift a manageable weight, you strengthen your back as well as your legs. If squats hurt, they're not being done right. You don't get powerful legs doing those fancy machines. Squats, lunges and deadlifts are what builds explosive power.

I work out 5 times a week, sometimes 6. Me and DangerBoy are both in rowing at our school, We do lots of weights, indurance, and a shitload on the rowing machine eachday. I also do bike circuts on weekends around the forest, yah, its cross country, but will help for racing.

Biking has a lot to do with upper body, when you increase that strength you will be amazed at what you can do. Most peoples lower body is toned already from riding. If you are going to go upper body also work the lower back and abbs. Without strong back muscles you will just get hurt lifting heavy amounts of weight up top.

decline bench is my favourite… i like to do it with a dumbell in each hand… 60lbs dumbells is good

Where's Mr. Fungle?

Originally posted by Derek Diggler
**Easy there, killer. I was working with my coach a while back, and doing squats with 2 45 plates on either end and 1 35 on each side. a lot of weight for a 150 pound guy, but I had been working up to it. She showed me how to do them properly, but even then my back gave out. I mean, you are putting all that weight on a narrow bar across your shoulder, it's going to put stress on your back.

As far as the whole one leg compensating thing, try this. Go and do any excersise for your legs. cut the weight in half and do one leg at a time and tell me if you don't feel a difference. I guarantee you will. **

Question: How tall are you? A friend of mine is 5'9" weighs 170 and squats 580 for singles, (clean by the way) and his back is fine. Your "coach" may simply have not been giving you the proper assistance exercises to keep your back/trunk strength on a par with your legs.

The main reason you feel a difference doing one leg exercises is the balance factor. If you really want to get technical about it have a look at your base of support in relation to your center of mass. I have done and do single leg exercises, and on the leg press I can do half or slightly more than half of the weight I can do with both legs. I understand what you're trying to say but you're not wording it correctly. Compensating means that one leg is doing more work than another during bi-lateral leg movements.

I'm 5' 7" and 155ish. and my back isn't so hot, I do a lot of standing. Everyone is built differently, I was just commenting from my own expiriences.

Originally posted by manalogue
**That's not always true. It's true you can also train synaptic responses (reflexes) by training fast, but unless the resistance is the same throughout the entire range of motion (like on iso-kinetic machines that cost 10's of thousands of dollars) you will more than likely be using the momentum to your advantage.

Eccentric excercises (opposite resistance like lowering a dumb-bell when doing bicep curls) should be done slow. These types of excercises are proven to have the most rapid development too.

I do agree though, that the majority of the time, your rep should be completed at a decent pace, but there are benefits of slow training too. It all depends on what your individual goals are. **

Yes there are benefits to slow training, but why waste your time training that way when other types of training will give you better results.

Training fast is a highly advanced technique that is best applied to a compound large R.O.M. that is sport specific. It is something that needs to done under the watchful eye of a highly qualified trainer.

And yes, eccentric movements done more slowly than the concentric phase can elicit greater gains, but only in the eccentric phase of the movement. This is a technique mainly employed by bodybuilders to help increase muscle mass (not necessarily strength). This technique is different from super slow training which is what PT-Colin was advocating.

Slow training, specificaly the eccentric phase is usually done for 2-3 seconds, depending on the movement. Super slow training involves a tempo of 2-3-0 and higher, or a concentric phase of 2 seconds or longer, an ecentric phase of 3 seconds or longer and no pause between repetitions.

Unfortunately, when looking at most human movement from a functional standpoint, we do not slowly lower a heavy weight. This is particularly true of sporting movements which consist primarily of explosive, concentric movements or sustianed sub-maximal efforts such as climbing up Fromme.

By the way, the NSCA released a position paper last year of the efficacy of super slow training and they deemed it to be an ineffective technique for training athletes in light of the other training modes that are available.

Much of the information being traded here is based on bodybuilding themes. As mtb'ers and high performance athletes, our training routines should be very different from those of bodybuilders.

I apologize if I seem to be ranting here a little bit, but the science and art of advanced athletic training is something I do very well and take a great amount of pride in. It does disturb me somewhat when I see information that is either misleading or simply incorrect being provided to people who have little knowledge about strength and athletic training. When beginners seek information they need first to be provided with the basics and then advanced info that is correct and specific to their needs.

If you have questions, please ask. I will not bite (unless your name is firefly (the hot chick) and you want me too).

Originally posted by Derek Diggler
I'm 5' 7" and 155ish. and my back isn't so hot, I do a lot of standing. Everyone is built differently, I was just commenting from my own expiriences.

No problem, but you should look into some back/core stabilization training if your back is not in the best shape. BTW, I would rather have a job where I stand most of the time than sit, it is actually better for your back.