Rainbow

Posted by: Sethimus

and yet you prohibit ebikes in alpine areas. whistler really offers a strange message here. going up by taking the heli while emitting a shit ton of co2 COOL. climbing up a mountain by ebike, BAD.

FWIW the Rainbow helidrop in Whistler isn't allowed anymore either (per FlipFantasia's post above). So Whistler's message seems to be only self-propelled access to the alpine on that side of the valley. Of course there is still the bike park on the other side.

The helicopter company found a new helidrop location near Pemberton.

I agree with you the cost (both financial and environmental) of a helidrop is excessive. Not to mention the idea a bit silly.

Bottom line the whole concept of a place like Whistler is not environmentally friendly by definition. It's designed for tourists from all over the world to drive or fly there and splurge in consumerism while they are there.

The good news is that any reasonably fit mountain biker can climb up from the valley bottom to the Sproat network on any regular mountain bike and have a great time enjoying the alpine. It's not easy and it's not quick but it's worth the effort every once in a while.

Posted by: Sethimus

and yet you prohibit ebikes in alpine areas. whistler really offers a strange message here. going up by taking the heli while emitting a shit ton of co2 COOL. climbing up a mountain by ebike, BAD.

I would guess the eBikes thing is much more about a) overcrowding issues and mainly b) having people who have no bike skills way out there in the middle of nowhere without the skills, plans or any idea what to do when their ebike breaks down. The amount of punters you see heading up the climb trail, already completely blowing up by the halfway point is insane. I'm talking about people pushing more than half the climb.

Posted by: nortonwhis

Posted by: Sethimus

and yet you prohibit ebikes in alpine areas. whistler really offers a strange message here. going up by taking the heli while emitting a shit ton of co2 COOL. climbing up a mountain by ebike, BAD.

I would guess the eBikes thing is much more about a) overcrowding issues and mainly b) having people who have no bike skills way out there in the middle of nowhere without the skills, plans or any idea what to do when their ebike breaks down. The amount of punters you see heading up the climb trail, already completely blowing up by the halfway point is insane. I'm talking about people pushing more than half the climb.

That's exactly right. fitness and/or the patience to get to the top of the Sproat network is a major squirrel catcher for that remote area. It's not perfect, there are fit people who make it up fine and can't back it up on the decent, but it's an important part of the puzzle.

Posted by: mammal

Posted by: nortonwhis

Posted by: Sethimus

and yet you prohibit ebikes in alpine areas. whistler really offers a strange message here. going up by taking the heli while emitting a shit ton of co2 COOL. climbing up a mountain by ebike, BAD.

I would guess the eBikes thing is much more about a) overcrowding issues and mainly b) having people who have no bike skills way out there in the middle of nowhere without the skills, plans or any idea what to do when their ebike breaks down. The amount of punters you see heading up the climb trail, already completely blowing up by the halfway point is insane. I'm talking about people pushing more than half the climb.

That's exactly right. fitness and/or the patience to get to the top of the Sproat network is a major squirrel catcher for that remote area. It's not perfect, there are fit people who make it up fine and can't back it up on the decent, but it's an important part of the puzzle.

Sethimus has been told previously that the two issues are not at all related to one another... yet he continues to conflate them.

Posted by: FlipFantasia

Posted by: mammal

Posted by: nortonwhis

Posted by: Sethimus

and yet you prohibit ebikes in alpine areas. whistler really offers a strange message here. going up by taking the heli while emitting a shit ton of co2 COOL. climbing up a mountain by ebike, BAD.

I would guess the eBikes thing is much more about a) overcrowding issues and mainly b) having people who have no bike skills way out there in the middle of nowhere without the skills, plans or any idea what to do when their ebike breaks down. The amount of punters you see heading up the climb trail, already completely blowing up by the halfway point is insane. I'm talking about people pushing more than half the climb.

That's exactly right. fitness and/or the patience to get to the top of the Sproat network is a major squirrel catcher for that remote area. It's not perfect, there are fit people who make it up fine and can't back it up on the decent, but it's an important part of the puzzle.

Sethimus has been told previously that the two issues are not at all related to one another... yet he continues to conflate them.

no you didn’t, you only sorta explained why they got a new mountain.

Posted by: mammal

That's exactly right. fitness and/or the patience to get to the top of the Sproat network is a major squirrel catcher for that remote area. It's not perfect, there are fit people who make it up fine and can't back it up on the decent, but it's an important part of the puzzle.

I'm curious do many e-bikes make it up to Lord of the Squirrels ignoring the signs? I've never seen any up there but I don't get to ride up there as much as I'd like.

Back to OPs question would the idea be ride up there instead of LOTS as it better or just something different?

Posted by: TheWasp

Posted by: mammal

That's exactly right. fitness and/or the patience to get to the top of the Sproat network is a major squirrel catcher for that remote area. It's not perfect, there are fit people who make it up fine and can't back it up on the decent, but it's an important part of the puzzle.

I'm curious do many e-bikes make it up to Lord of the Squirrels ignoring the signs? I've never seen any up there but I don't get to ride up there as much as I'd like.

Back to OPs question would the idea be ride up there instead of LOTS as it better or just something different?

The rangers turn around ebikers (at least that's what they told me when I asked a few summers ago). Not sure how often they are working up there. I haven't seen an ebike in my 5 or 6 times up over the years, besides the ones the rangers ride. Didn't make it up to LOTS last summer, kind of dreading the ride on my 38lbs Patrol with DD casing tires, I'll be the wheezing punter pushing up ITM haha. I did manage the entire shebang with Ninja Lakes and Happy Hour in 2020 on my older lighter bike that still had heavy tires.

I've heard the new AlpX trail is fun but not amazing. You can drive up part of the way and push into the alpine if you wanted. Have never done a heli drop, but I feel like $250 is my ceiling. Have wanted to do Cartier in Revy but it's closed at the moment. Not sure what they are charging for float plane drops in the Chilcotins but that is a waaaaaay cooler experience/ride than TOTW/LOTS etc. in my opinion.

Posted by: grambo

Posted by: TheWasp

Posted by: mammal

That's exactly right. fitness and/or the patience to get to the top of the Sproat network is a major squirrel catcher for that remote area. It's not perfect, there are fit people who make it up fine and can't back it up on the decent, but it's an important part of the puzzle.

I'm curious do many e-bikes make it up to Lord of the Squirrels ignoring the signs? I've never seen any up there but I don't get to ride up there as much as I'd like.

Back to OPs question would the idea be ride up there instead of LOTS as it better or just something different?

The rangers turn around ebikers (at least that's what they told me when I asked a few summers ago). Not sure how often they are working up there. I haven't seen an ebike in my 5 or 6 times up over the years, besides the ones the rangers ride. Didn't make it up to LOTS last summer, kind of dreading the ride on my 38lbs Patrol with DD casing tires, I'll be the wheezing punter pushing up ITM haha. I did manage the entire shebang with Ninja Lakes and Happy Hour in 2020 on my older lighter bike that still had heavy tires.

I've heard the new AlpX trail is fun but not amazing. Have never done a heli drop, but I feel like $250 is my ceiling. Have wanted to do Cartier in Revy but it's closed at the moment. Not sure what they are charging for float plane drops in the Chilcotins but that is a waaaaaay cooler experience/ride than TOTW/LOTS etc. in my opinion.

Maybe we should keep access to new trails not overly publicized? I don't think telling people exactly how to "poach" something is the best idea.

Saw an ebiker up LOTS there yesterday. They are always some around. 33% goobers who dont read sign, 33% goobers who do read signs but dont give a fuck and 33% entitled whistler locals.

Posted by: grambo

Posted by: TheWasp

Posted by: mammal

That's exactly right. fitness and/or the patience to get to the top of the Sproat network is a major squirrel catcher for that remote area. It's not perfect, there are fit people who make it up fine and can't back it up on the decent, but it's an important part of the puzzle.

I'm curious do many e-bikes make it up to Lord of the Squirrels ignoring the signs? I've never seen any up there but I don't get to ride up there as much as I'd like.

Back to OPs question would the idea be ride up there instead of LOTS as it better or just something different?

The rangers turn around ebikers (at least that's what they told me when I asked a few summers ago). Not sure how often they are working up there. I haven't seen an ebike in my 5 or 6 times up over the years, besides the ones the rangers ride. Didn't make it up to LOTS last summer, kind of dreading the ride on my 38lbs Patrol with DD casing tires, I'll be the wheezing punter pushing up ITM haha. I did manage the entire shebang with Ninja Lakes and Happy Hour in 2020 on my older lighter bike that still had heavy tires.

I've heard the new AlpX trail is fun but not amazing. Have never done a heli drop, but I feel like $250 is my ceiling. Have wanted to do Cartier in Revy but it's closed at the moment. Not sure what they are charging for float plane drops in the Chilcotins but that is a waaaaaay cooler experience/ride than TOTW/LOTS etc. in my opinion.

Maybe we should keep access to new trails not overly publicized? I don't think telling people exactly how to "poach" something is the best idea.

Saw an ebiker up LOTS there yesterday. They are always some around. 33% goobers who dont read sign, 33% goobers who do read signs but dont give a fuck and 33% entitled whistler locals.

no heli was needed to get up there (2680m), just a train ride, some hydro/solar power and a punchy hike a bike section

[img]https://i.imgur.com/LWbjajn.jpg[/img]

Posted by: grambo

Not sure what they are charging for float plane drops in the Chilcotins but that is a waaaaaay cooler experience/ride than TOTW/LOTS etc. in my opinion.

Since their float plane crashed, Tyax is having to heli people in for the rest of the season. That can't be good for margins on trips that had already been booked and prepaid.

Posted by: nortonwhis

Posted by: grambo

Posted by: TheWasp

Posted by: mammal

That's exactly right. fitness and/or the patience to get to the top of the Sproat network is a major squirrel catcher for that remote area. It's not perfect, there are fit people who make it up fine and can't back it up on the decent, but it's an important part of the puzzle.

I'm curious do many e-bikes make it up to Lord of the Squirrels ignoring the signs? I've never seen any up there but I don't get to ride up there as much as I'd like.

Back to OPs question would the idea be ride up there instead of LOTS as it better or just something different?

The rangers turn around ebikers (at least that's what they told me when I asked a few summers ago). Not sure how often they are working up there. I haven't seen an ebike in my 5 or 6 times up over the years, besides the ones the rangers ride. Didn't make it up to LOTS last summer, kind of dreading the ride on my 38lbs Patrol with DD casing tires, I'll be the wheezing punter pushing up ITM haha. I did manage the entire shebang with Ninja Lakes and Happy Hour in 2020 on my older lighter bike that still had heavy tires.

I've heard the new AlpX trail is fun but not amazing. Have never done a heli drop, but I feel like $250 is my ceiling. Have wanted to do Cartier in Revy but it's closed at the moment. Not sure what they are charging for float plane drops in the Chilcotins but that is a waaaaaay cooler experience/ride than TOTW/LOTS etc. in my opinion.

Maybe we should keep access to new trails not overly publicized? I don't think telling people exactly how to "poach" something is the best idea.

Saw an ebiker up LOTS there yesterday. They are always some around. 33% goobers who dont read sign, 33% goobers who do read signs but dont give a fuck and 33% entitled whistler locals.

Re: the Alpx trail? Can edit posts if you want, but figured the cats out of the bag now that people are riding it and posting videos/pictures that make it pretty easy to figure out where it is. Don't want to step on toes and agree not cool to poach their shit especially in their operating season when people pushing/hiking up will fuck up guest experience... nothing against Blackcomb heli/Alpx, those are good people creating good jobs. Kind of a parallel to sledders poaching cat ski terrain like at Retallack (10 years ago, dunno if still an issue).

That said can't imagine many people will deal with the long push to get up there. With all the industry drops they've been doing there's a lot of publicity.. trail actually looks way better than I had heard:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAgPG7gMOH4

edit: I just watched the second half of that video, didn't realize when I posted but I guess 1.7M of Sam Pilgrim's subscribers now know of a bunch of secret trails off a pretty popular bike park, at least they kind of hid the entrances.

My take on the ebike ban in the Sproat alpine is it’s the low hanging fruit to keep rider numbers down for the grizzlies. Those areas on Sproat and nearby alpine hiking trails are often closed in September because of grizzlies in the area. It is said that disturbing grizzly feeding at that time can be harmful to the recovery of the species.  Similarly you can’t take dogs up the trails to Joffrey. That place is so popular something had to be done. Sproat gets a lot of riders. A lot.

Posted by: grambo

Re: the Alpx trail? Can edit posts if you want, but figured the cats out of the bag now that people are riding it and posting videos/pictures that make it pretty easy to figure out where it is. Don't want to step on toes and agree not cool to poach their shit especially in their operating season when people pushing/hiking up will fuck up guest experience... nothing against Blackcomb heli/Alpx, those are good people creating good jobs. Kind of a parallel to sledders poaching cat ski terrain like at Retallack (10 years ago, dunno if still an issue).

That said can't imagine many people will deal with the long push to get up there. With all the industry drops they've been doing there's a lot of publicity.. trail actually looks way better than I had heard:

Watched the video and agree the trail looks pretty fun. I wouldn't mind riding that.

It's unlikely I'll ever do so (especially now that I've moved away from the Sea 2 Sky) but I'm curious about the poaching angle. Is Blackcomb's tenure exclusive, i.e. the public is not allowed to use the trail?