Fromme: Singletrack climbing trail.

I did a quick search and didn't see a specific thread focusing just on a climbing trail on Fromme. This thread isn't about other issues on Fromme, it's intended purely to gauge support / discuss a climbing route on Fromme. Pretty sure the powers that be in the DNV lurk on here and read from time to time, I figured a singular thread would stand out instead of being buried in other broad Fromme discussions.

So a climbing trail on Fromme. I want one, who else does?

Went for a ride last night and left our place mid Londsdale rode up thru Princess Park and then went to climb Dempsey Breamar. DB has been talked about as a climbing route in the past that gets you up to the Baden Powell. Yes it's mostly climbable, but it's not a proper climbing trail, the old erosion issues caused by water and downhill traffic has been fixed with our typical rock work (fresh trail work looks great by the way) and make it more difficult to climb. I am sure if we measured the pitch it would be just slightly past what is considered a climbing route by IMBA type standards. Climbing up DB only gets you the BP and we don't have an option to gain the upper mountain from there other than crossing over to the road.

How great would it be to have a four foot wide smooth climbing trail from somewhere around Breamar and Princess that comes out somewhere onto the road between Pipeline and the 6th switchback?

Anybody else want a Fromme climb?

For sure.

It was in the alpine plan, then it became a road. Hopefully it will become a single track climb again.

It was supposed to come out at the 2nd switchback.

There is an old skidder road to air supply that could also be used.

For sure.

It was in the alpine plan, then it became a road. Hopefully it will become a single track climb again.

It was supposed to come out at the 2nd switchback.

There is an old skidder road to air supply that could also be used.

Where was it ever stated that it became a road? Did DNV ever put anything in writing that it would be a road? Lots of gibber gabber on here that someone heard from someone but was it actually stated by the DNV somewhere and I missed it?

I don't think the 2nd switchback isn't really enough, is a trail to the 2nd switchback going to get people to change the habit of just climbing up the road? Would a full climbing trail to the higher elevation be more of a draw?

A climbing trail would be awesome, anything that takes away from the monotony of Mtn Highway is good. I would love to see something go right to the 6th.

I'm all for a climbing route too. But, only natural surfaced ones that are technical single-track. If thousands of litres of fossils fuels need to be wasted to construct some gravel surfaced poodle path, I'm totally against it. The overall carbon footprint of trail construction should be considered, and we need variety for all types of users (such as I like technical challenges that are uphill, natural and trials-like, and don't want more dimensional lumber, gap jumps, gravel or excessively bermed trails covering the native line). Armouring with nearby native materials or trail rerouting can solve many erosion problems with much much less labour and expense.

There is an old skidder road to air supply that could also be used.

The old skidder road is Upper St Mary's Connector. There are many other old trails that have been used by climbers for years that are not on the Alpine plan map. If you go up DB to where Expresso and BP intersect, you will see the old skidder road to the northeast, follow that for an easy climb to the Upper St Mary's Connector which is rooty and undulating and heads west and crosses Expresso and Grannies to near the bottom of Lower Oil Can, the skid road then climbs steeply to Air Supply, but Lower Oil Can was in the process of becoming a Black Diamond uphill route and may be the preferably route. On a good day pavement to LOC is 100% climbable and LOC to the road is 95% climbable.

If you take Dempsey Braemar to the BP, keep going across BP and you are on a climbing trail which if you follow it out takes you to Peugeot and beyond to the Museum and Bitches Brew/Excecutioner areas. Not and easy climb by any stretch. Once upon a time I could clean all sections but never all in one go.

I have heard that you can connect from near the yellow gate to this collection of trails too. This might form a good basis for a trail up. One thing to do is to hike the area and look for existing trails. They are there and have existed since before mountainbikes as many are remnants of hiking routes and logging trails and roads. In the late 80's early 90's we raced the St Mary's Memorial in that area before the Hiroshima Heights/Nagasaki Knoll was developed. I remember riding loop trails above BP but can't really find them easily anymore. Some of those may have melded into Hooters, Digger etc.

In the early 90's I would ride with a gang where we would head up Baden Powell in an easterly direction from Mosquito Creek. Just before Abelard Canyon we would head uphill and to the West on Peugeot and up to Mountain Highway. Air Supply is the lower entrance to Peugeot. That is where the old blue Peugeot car was dumped. The upper entrance to Peugeot is past Starfish but before St Georges and Executioner. It is fairly obvious but becomes a bit vague prety quick with a number of skidder roads and trails heading a number of directions.

A climbing trail would be awesome, anything that takes away from the monotony of Mtn Highway is good. I would love to see something go right to the 6th.

Seconded. Going as high as possible.

Thirded

Absolutely agree. Having spent a couple of days in Pemberton recently - I want Happy Trail / NIMBY style climbs on all of our local mountains! I know that our topography/dirt/weather/whatever aren't the same but those trails are a great way to turn a boring road grind into something really fun.

Thirded

Quartered.

A climbing trail would be awesome, anything that takes away from the monotony of Mtn Highway is good. I would love to see something go right to the 6th.

Hell yes! I would love that :clap: ROADS SUCK if I wanted a road I'd be on a road bike.

you'd have to factor in downhill traffic too - people will ride down it if they can.

you'd have to factor in downhill traffic too - people will ride down it if they can.

I love doing that. Scares the shit out of people climbing up.
:clap:

I kid.
;)

you'd have to factor in downhill traffic too - people will ride down it if they can.

Really tight switchbacks and off camber corners will deter the downhill riders. I can think of one trail that is beautiful to ride up, but I tried going downhill and it was awful, so it's possible to make a one way trail.