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2018 Cypress Trail Conditions Thread

July 8, 2020, 5:07 p.m.
Posts: 174
Joined: March 14, 2017

Posted by: syncro

Posted by: LoamtoHome

Greatest thing about Cypress is there are no IMBA style trails.  Funny how the "authorities" say steep fall line trails are unsustainable but here these trails have existed for decades.  It's just about controlling what they don't understand.

That's too simple a statement for an issue affected by a lot of factors including geology, geomorphology and the amount of traffic a trails gets. There are more than enough trenches to bedrock on Cypress to show that steep fall line trails are typically not great for the environment. IMO the two biggest factors that keep trails on Cypress relatively sustainable are more rock and lower levels of riders compared to other places on the shore.

Cheers to the builders there for sure.

the secret to building steeper trails is having breaks between the steeps and getting water off the trail before the steep sections.  Trails do not have to follow IMBA to sustainable.  Whistler Creekside natural trails are a prime example of this.

July 8, 2020, 6:38 p.m.
Posts: 287
Joined: June 28, 2011

Posted by: heckler

Posted by: Hepcat

Tricky stuff building a sustainable fall line trail though eh, even for the pro builders it doesn't always work out. Upper Tall Cans is a master class, but Lower Tall Cans for example is a nightmare of runaway erosion.

Yeah IMBA's specific trail grade rules are kind of impossibly conservative to implement, but I agree with them on the point that bench cut trails should always be standard practice as it makes for fool-proof erosion resistant trail building.

upper TC was recently (<10years) built new trail as old man serpentine (aka IMBA std), while lower was a cleanup and refurb of an existing proper old school fall line trail, complete with a 25 year old log ride. The differences in sustainability (it's all about water not flowing instead of the conventional perception of "flow") are quite appearant.

Lower is just fine. Just duck out and head over to S&M after the rock drop.

The section after this is a complete mess. But that's really to do with the nearby creek (that the log goes over). Part of that creek just joins the trail and has left it as a creek bed should be.


 Last edited by: Kieran on July 8, 2020, 6:39 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
July 8, 2020, 6:44 p.m.
Posts: 494
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

I guess that depends on how one defines sustainability. I think a better term to use would be maintainability. To me a trail that is sustainable has a minimal amount of impact on the ground and requires no or very little maintenance.

Let’s face, while it’s not exactly strip mining or clear cutting, mtb’ing is not an ecologically friendly activity. Too bad it’s just so much fun.  The thing we should do is try and minimize our impact as best we can.


 Last edited by: syncro on July 8, 2020, 6:54 p.m., edited 2 times in total.
Reason: sp
July 9, 2020, 8:34 a.m.
Posts: 174
Joined: March 14, 2017

Machine built trails with big berms have the biggest foot print and require the most maintenance.  Look at Upper Dales and Empress Bypass, the berms have collapsed down and have minimal support with rocks pointing out everywhere.  How much is it going to cost to fix/redo them?

July 9, 2020, 1:12 p.m.
Posts: 494
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: LoamtoHome

Machine built trails with big berms have the biggest foot print and require the most maintenance.  Look at Upper Dales and Empress Bypass, the berms have collapsed down and have minimal support with rocks pointing out everywhere.  How much is it going to cost to fix/redo them?

We're going a bit sideways from the thread but yeah, I'd agree with you on those examples. With UD that's a Metro thing tho and there's been zero maintenance since it went in. EB has seen some maintenance - one giant revamp last year - but not much. Personally, I think with better design both those trail would have lasted longer - they're too tight for the terrain they're in and the level of use they get. Bobsled is a better example of design. IMO a big part of Cypress's "sustainability" is lower ridership compared to other areas and some dedicated builders. It hasn't always been that way though, there are trails that have been bombed out and suffered.

One of the cool things about the Shore is that each Mtn has it's own distinct overall flavour and that it's not the same thing spread over three areas.

July 9, 2020, 1:48 p.m.
Posts: 142
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

The real question is the ratio of tall cans consumed in the making of Tall Cans vs Upper Dales? The more tall cans consumed on a trail by the builder(s) the better the trail. It's simple math.

edit: and root beer doesn't count. Sorry syncro.


 Last edited by: earleb on July 9, 2020, 1:50 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
July 9, 2020, 7:23 p.m.
Posts: 287
Joined: June 28, 2011

So I fixed up the bridge on Wutang today. Put in extra supports on the down ramp so its super solid and should easily last another season.

I took a wire brush to whole thing as it was super green. So hopefully this will convince the riders who thought the off camber nature was too much :)

I also fixed up the entrance to it. So there more of a clear line to the start of it and some large rocks were buried and moved.

https://www.trailforks.com/report/1091576/

Strangely while I was there I didn't see a single rider. So I guess peeps are either riding out on other trails because of the broken bridge or now everything is opened the masses have moved on.

July 9, 2020, 8:03 p.m.
Posts: 12
Joined: May 27, 2018

Same experience. Spent the day working on Upper Tall Cans and saw nobody.


 Last edited by: HulaOtter on July 9, 2020, 8:04 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
July 11, 2020, 10:35 p.m.
Posts: 819
Joined: Nov. 18, 2015

Thanks Kieran and Hula for your work.

July 15, 2020, 9:41 a.m.
Posts: 1573
Joined: July 11, 2014

Went back to Cypress on Monday for a lunch ride. Pedaled up the road this time which was much more pleasant, maybe 5-10 minutes faster than BLT to Slippery Canoe for me. Not much car traffic so felt safe doing it. Rode Upper Tall Cans this time, super fun trail with all the rock moves on it. Everything was running well barely any mud at least where I rode. Thanks Kieran for fixing that ramp, felt bomber to me!


 Last edited by: grambo on July 15, 2020, 9:41 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
July 15, 2020, 8:53 p.m.
Posts: 287
Joined: June 28, 2011

Posted by: grambo

Went back to Cypress on Monday for a lunch ride. Pedaled up the road this time which was much more pleasant, maybe 5-10 minutes faster than BLT to Slippery Canoe for me. Not much car traffic so felt safe doing it. Rode Upper Tall Cans this time, super fun trail with all the rock moves on it. Everything was running well barely any mud at least where I rode. Thanks Kieran for fixing that ramp, felt bomber to me!

No problem.

I'd rather, ride up BLT any day. The road just seems to go on forever for me. Plus I do enjoy delving into the forest now and then and checking out if there's any trail work to be done.

July 20, 2020, 10:25 p.m.
Posts: 6
Joined: March 13, 2008

Hula and Kieran -- big thanks for your work.  Upper Tall Cans and Wutang running very well today.  Nice work on the bridge rebuild Kieran.

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