To the ass-hat on Bridle today at 5pm...rant-warning

I don't think that will happen on Burke... the people there have more common sense and not as nimby as Seymour/Fromme users. Look at Switch... he's trying to defend himself calling me out and my 8 yr old on a trail built/maintained by bikers on a mtb site. Can't make this stuff up.

Posted by: Bull_Dozer

Posted by: LoamtoHome

I believe it's still there so people can't access Quarry Rock from above. A quick email to DNV would confirm.

I guess that's the one semi logical reason... but even the Quarry Rock closure, yeah it's busy trail for hiking trails, but in the grand scheme of things I'd say that's very low on the covid risk heirarchy. What other hiking trails/outdoor areas are still closed because of Covid? They closed down a lot of that stuff at the beginning of Coivd but then soon realized it made no sense, and 99% of outdoor stuff was reopened but Quarry Rock was like the one exception for some reason. As someone who lives downtown, every single day I am in areas/situations with far more people than you'd ever encounter on Quarry Rock. Walking down the seawall for example, or any sidewalk... and I'm be pretty confident in guessing that there have been next to no seawall related covid transmission over the past year with thousands of people on it every single day. IMO the Quarry Rock/IRR/Deep Cove closures just seem very NIMBY to me.

The issue of density on outdorr trails has me scratching my head...especially when large places like Garibaldi Park were shut down.

The issue with Quarry Rock, isn't just about the volume of people on the trail ( I would argue that it probably sees the highest density of hikers of any downtown or North Shore trail...especially given it's limited width...as well as the crowds that linger at the rock itself), it's about the density of traffic in Deep Cove. Given the amount of traffic seen at Blueridge, Mtn Hwy, and Braemar over last summer's COVID hiking/biking season, I suspect that Deep Cove would be even less prepared to deal with the influx. Add the fact that people go there to kayak, run, linger...and that there is major road work slated for the main drag, and Panorama Park...it's a recipe for conflict even in a non-COVID world.  Essentially, it's a giant Cul-de-Sac.

Posted by: LoamtoHome

https://www.trailforks.com/region/burke-mountain/?activitytype=1&z=12.0&lat=49.32558&lon=-122.75096 shows TORCA as local trail association. Also says "BC Parks is currently drafting a Management Plan for the Park. TORCA is advocating for mountain bike trails to be included in the plan."

So if these trails are unsanctioned, why are they showing up in TF? TF not showing the unsanctioned ones in Seymour (which they shouldn't).  I'm very confused and feel there is a double standard.

I'm confused AF too.  BC Parks is shown as a trail supporter of Overtime...   I don't know either.  Don't forget that Trailforks is user maintained.

So, about that asshat on Bridlepath....

Posted by: heckler

Posted by: LoamtoHome

https://www.trailforks.com/region/burke-mountain/?activitytype=1&z=12.0&lat=49.32558&lon=-122.75096 shows TORCA as local trail association. Also says "BC Parks is currently drafting a Management Plan for the Park. TORCA is advocating for mountain bike trails to be included in the plan."

So if these trails are unsanctioned, why are they showing up in TF? TF not showing the unsanctioned ones in Seymour (which they shouldn't).  I'm very confused and feel there is a double standard.

I'm confused AF too.  BC Parks is shown as a trail supporter of Overtime...   I don't know either.  Don't forget that Trailforks is user maintained.

The trails at Burke have been around for ever, so that could be why they're considered legit. Same as what happened with Seymour/Fromme

Posted by: heckler

So, about that asshat on Bridlepath....

I'm just impressed that this thread has continued for so long

Posted by: andy-eunson

He waited ahead for me but apologized profusely for being a dick. That was that. 

We need more of this. THIS is called "manning up" or whatever term people prefer.

Carry around a nice big stick to shove in his spokes.

First I'm not condoning the guy but flip side would be you were knowingly walking on a bike trail? With your family? Did either you or the wife stay at the beginning of the log and keep watch, essentially acting as a flagger?

Years ago when the Delta Watershed was at its height, there was bike only trail with visible signage at the end of the trail where it met an access road (iirc the signage was bike only trail, proceed with caution). Tons of walkers would be walking up regardless of the signage, either to get a view of us or just because they chose to go that route. The last stunt was a high speed 20 odd foot sender to landing between the tree's that basically dumped you out right onto the access road, where the walkers would turn up the trail. Suffice to say many a walker would complain we were going to fast and being irresponsible even if the Corp of Delta gave us the right of way.

Wasnt there some rule, unwritten or otherwise about walking on bike trails?

Posted by: aShogunNamedMarcus

First I'm not condoning the guy but flip side would be you were knowingly walking on a bike trail? With your family? Did either you or the wife stay at the beginning of the log and keep watch, essentially acting as a flagger?

Years ago when the Delta Watershed was at its height, there was bike only trail with visible signage at the end of the trail where it met an access road (iirc the signage was bike only trail, proceed with caution). Tons of walkers would be walking up regardless of the signage, either to get a view of us or just because they chose to go that route. The last stunt was a high speed 20 odd foot sender to landing between the tree's that basically dumped you out right onto the access road, where the walkers would turn up the trail. Suffice to say many a walker would complain we were going to fast and being irresponsible even if the Corp of Delta gave us the right of way.

Wasnt there some rule, unwritten or otherwise about walking on bike trails?

I understood this incident to take place on Bridle Path -- that's about as multi-use as it gets on Seymour, I'd say.

Posted by: aShogunNamedMarcus

First I'm not condoning the guy but flip side would be you were knowingly walking on a bike trail? With your family? Did either you or the wife stay at the beginning of the log and keep watch, essentially acting as a flagger?

Years ago when the Delta Watershed was at its height, there was bike only trail with visible signage at the end of the trail where it met an access road (iirc the signage was bike only trail, proceed with caution). Tons of walkers would be walking up regardless of the signage, either to get a view of us or just because they chose to go that route. The last stunt was a high speed 20 odd foot sender to landing between the tree's that basically dumped you out right onto the access road, where the walkers would turn up the trail. Suffice to say many a walker would complain we were going to fast and being irresponsible even if the Corp of Delta gave us the right of way.

Wasnt there some rule, unwritten or otherwise about walking on bike trails?

And what about the people walking up Bobsled, and not that I do that trail but the last time I did I clearly remember a VERY visible sign at the bottom about "one way bike traffic only, no hikers".....but apparently people are blind, can't read or don't care.  I am not aware if the sign is there anymore.  My real pet peeve is walkers or other on double blacks; like Lower Skull, where you have NO easy bail outs or stop options.  Or on high commitment features such as rock rolls etc that require commitment from the start of which most seem oblivious to the fact........I went down Lower Crippler recently and went up to one of the rock faces to roll down to find a pair hiking up.  They seemed perplexed that I was there and that from my "intimation" that they were in the way.  Lucky I did not commit blind......

Posted by: blackfly

And what about the people walking up Bobsled, and not that I do that trail but the last time I did I clearly remember a VERY visible sign at the bottom about "one way bike traffic only, no hikers".....but apparently people are blind, can't read or don't care.  I am not aware if the sign is there anymore.  My real pet peeve is walkers or other on double blacks; like Lower Skull, where you have NO easy bail outs or stop options.  Or on high commitment features such as rock rolls etc that require commitment from the start of which most seem oblivious to the fact........I went down Lower Crippler recently and went up to one of the rock faces to roll down to find a pair hiking up.  They seemed perplexed that I was there and that from my "intimation" that they were in the way.  Lucky I did not commit blind......

The fact they are in the woods without a bike is the first sign that they are not the sharpest knives in the drawer, no?

Posted by: blackfly

Posted by: aShogunNamedMarcus

First I'm not condoning the guy but flip side would be you were knowingly walking on a bike trail? With your family? Did either you or the wife stay at the beginning of the log and keep watch, essentially acting as a flagger?

Years ago when the Delta Watershed was at its height, there was bike only trail with visible signage at the end of the trail where it met an access road (iirc the signage was bike only trail, proceed with caution). Tons of walkers would be walking up regardless of the signage, either to get a view of us or just because they chose to go that route. The last stunt was a high speed 20 odd foot sender to landing between the tree's that basically dumped you out right onto the access road, where the walkers would turn up the trail. Suffice to say many a walker would complain we were going to fast and being irresponsible even if the Corp of Delta gave us the right of way.

Wasnt there some rule, unwritten or otherwise about walking on bike trails?

And what about the people walking up Bobsled, and not that I do that trail but the last time I did I clearly remember a VERY visible sign at the bottom about "one way bike traffic only, no hikers".....but apparently people are blind, can't read or don't care.  I am not aware if the sign is there anymore.  My real pet peeve is walkers or other on double blacks; like Lower Skull, where you have NO easy bail outs or stop options.  Or on high commitment features such as rock rolls etc that require commitment from the start of which most seem oblivious to the fact........I went down Lower Crippler recently and went up to one of the rock faces to roll down to find a pair hiking up.  They seemed perplexed that I was there and that from my "intimation" that they were in the way.  Lucky I did not commit blind......

Thanks for not dropping in blind. Most of the trails we ride are on publicly owned land, and anyone has the right to use them. If some misguided hiker gets run over and injured it's likely going to have negative consequences for the rider and for the MTB community. It's up to us to be vigilant and not assume we are the only trail users.

I had a funny one on fromme this afternoon. My Ex and I share our dog, and I came back down to the Shore to do the swap and go for a walk to catch up. I'm out of touch on all of the apparent trail work on Lower Fromme so figured it be a good place to go. We walked up the climb trail for a bit and all was good. Got out of the way for various bikers and had friendly interactions. 

It was time to complete the lap though, and I suggested walking down Lower Digger as it's an old janky trail that not many people ride so we wouldn't get in anyone's way.....

We started to walk down but it didn't look very familiar.... I just assumed that it was a bit of a re-route at the top so we carried on down, keeping a close ear and eye for bikers. One or two came down and all was good. Then I saw another one approach from a good way back.... We rustled up the dawg and got out of the way in time again. Only to be told in a condescending manner that the trail is not a very good choice for dog walking. No shit Sherlock! Sorry, I missed the memo about Digger being turned into fucking A-Line :D I muttered loudly "Oh shut up!" as I didn't have chance to discuss the situation in a mature level headed manner ha ha. My Ex then commented that it's douches like that that give mountain bikers a bad name.

Soooo you can never quite tell why someone is walking down a trail. Someone was walking a big dog down one of my trails on Sunday afternoon and I came up to her on the fastest section. I slowed down in good time, she then saw me and apologized for getting in the way (I don't own the land....), I said no problem and we smiled and each went on our way.