No Trespassing signs on CMHC lands and trails

So with the recent placement of no trespassing signs on trails within CMHC and the lack of communication from the CMHC on the matter the suggestion has been made by a few people to write some letters to the local MP for this area. I also made the suggestion of having a co-ordinated letter campaign headed up by the NSMBA.

Until we hear word from the CMHC via them directly or through the NSMBA or DNV all the chatter is just specualtion. For now a simple, pleasant and respectful letter to the Seymour MP about the importance of access to this recreation area definitely won't hurt things

Terry.Beech@parl.gc.ca

Already done. Pointing out how the restrictions by the CMHC, a Canadian government corporation, is in direct conflict with the goverments plan to help reconnect Canadians with nature doesn't hurt.

The attached document is a great and sobering read about the importance of nature to this and future generations.

Quote:

"Connecting people with nature is an issue that is being embraced by many
organizations in Canada and abroad. Canada’s park agencies are well positioned to adapt and respond to the changing realities that our country is facing, and can contribute to these efforts in a very tangible way, working cooperatively with other sectors of society. Individuals, communities, employers, and governments at every level and in every department need to see the value of outdoor experiences and their powerful and plentiful benefits. Park agencies share the mandate, the dedicated staff, and most importantly, the exceptional natural places that were created for the benefit of all Canadians. Working across sectors and disciplines, we can ensure every child — rural or urban, rich or poor — is given the chance to explore a nearby field or stream, experience the wonders of a provincial park, and develop an appreciation for nature that transcends their generation. Canada’s parks provide the space and opportunity for families to bond, children to play, and communities to meet. They lie at the heart of our efforts to forge a renewed relationship with nature."

https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t[HTML_REMOVED]source=web[HTML_REMOVED]rct=j[HTML_REMOVED]url=http://www.parks-parcs.ca/english/ConnectingCanadians-English_web.pdf[HTML_REMOVED]ved=0ahUKEwi0i-WujebPAhVO9GMKHa3rBqoQFghHMAM[HTML_REMOVED]usg=AFQjCNG99V-TOlKwSGpJwz3fX2dOQ5w4sw[HTML_REMOVED]sig2=zNmupEaUcE8kZg1ZxgIriA

Great suggestion Synco. Will do.

Some info missing from the NSMBA facebook post confirming that it was CMHC who put up the signs.

List of trails affected include 100% of TAP and Academy trails on Seymour many of which were built by NSMBA post 2008 ie most of the new trails.

NSMBA's list leaves out Forever After, Dales Connector, Dales, Salvation, Pangor, Pingu, Incline, Adonis Buster, Baden Powell, Boogie Man, Neds, Dirty Diapers and Boogie Nights. Pretty comprehensive chunk of Seymour affected.

Map of the CMHC lands follows

Here's a list of all the affected trails from the NSMBA

"In summary, trails affected include Severed, Good Sir Martin, R [HTML_REMOVED] R, Rapid Transit, Rapid Transit Connector, Pussyfoot, Sticks [HTML_REMOVED] Stones, C-Buster, Corkscrew, Pangor Connector, Blair Range, Bridle, Cardiac, Salamander, Power Line, Penny Lane, Asian Adonis, Shorn and Academy Climb."

Just a point of clarification I'd like to make wrt Salvation as it was built well before 2008. While the nsmba did assist with a couple of trail days to work on alternate lines, it was not a TAP or Academy project. The trail was originally built under the permission of the LSCR on the understanding it was on their land. Currently seems that most of the trail falls on DNV land and a part may on what appears to be CMHC land being leased by Metro. So the boundaries and land manager control with some of these trails can be confusing to say the very least.

Sharon when you list Dale's as an affected trail does that include Upper Dale's?

Only curious about that since to my knowledge it was Metro Van that spearheaded the work done on that trail separately from the NSMBA. My understanding could be wrong.

Sharon when you list Dale's as an affected trail does that include Upper Dale's?

Only curious about that since to my knowledge it was Metro Van that spearheaded the work done on that trail separately from the NSMBA. My understanding could be wrong.

You are correct that Metro did this work seperately from the NSMBA. If you look at the maps that are available there is a section of overlap between CMHC and Metro lands. Metro has included these lands within their range for as long as I can remember and "managed" Corkscrew, Historic Mushroom Lot trail, Dale's trail and Ned's Atomic Dustbin which primarily falls within their lands.

As a side note there used to be a large sign next to the "Mushroom," an old stump with a roof built over it where people could sit and meet up back in the 1930's when Seymour was first logged out. People used to drive their cars right up to the mushroom lot, essentially the start of Ned's and go hiking from there. A somewhat new sign has been put in place (left in pic) nd the old one (right in pic) has pretty much rotted away now.

The vagaries of the boundaries in this area are confusing and hopefully the solution to this sign fiasco will help eliminate some of that.

I have posted an update on my Facebook page and will include an abbreviated message below. I'll be updating my Facebook page with new information as I receive it and trying to answer any questions that come up there. I probably won't be able to respond as quickly to points that come up on these boards.

The absence of accurate information has led to a lot of speculation about why the landowner, the Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC) has taken this action after decades of showing no interest whatsoever in any active management of these lands. I'll do my best to provide the factual information that I have found below.

The NSMBA website first posted a notice that no trespassing signs has been posted on Friday, October 14th. On October 16th, they confirmed with the CMHC regional office in Vancouver that is was indeed CMHC that posted those signs. That update, including a list of impacted trails, can be found here.

I learned that CMHC staff from Ottawa had flown out to inspect the property during the week of June 14th, 2016. At this time they met with staff from DNV Parks, BC Parks and Metro Vancouver to gain insight on the issues impacting CMHC lands. No decisions were made regarding the use of the property or its future management at these meetings.

DNV staff received an email response from CMHC late Tuesday afternoon and were informed that CMHC is preparing a communique for the public. DNV staff will be following up with a phone conversation on Wednesday morning.

I have also been in touch with our MP Terry Beech. We have been sharing information and updates and he is working hard with the folks in Ottawa to get more information on behalf of his constituents. He is getting your letters.

I would suggest we continue to first press CMHC for an formal explanation of their recent actions. CMHC put up these signs without informing any of the adjacent land managers, or even their regional office in Vancouver. Once we have that explanation, then I suggest we hold CMHC accountable to work in much closer coordination with all stakeholders to discuss monitoring, enforcement and management of activities on their lands. Thirdly, I suggest we get a clear answer from CMHC to the two following questions:

1. What, if any, plans or planning processes are contemplated for the future of this land?
2. When will we know more and how will the public and other stakeholder be involved and informed?

Thank you. :)

Thanks Mathew.

As for the future off the land, wasn't that outlined in the Seymour OCP? Largely guided by DNV zoning?

Note, the NSMBA list is incomplete, see my post above. Funhouse, upper dales is all in MV. Lower isn't but as synchro mentioned there has been confusion on the boundaries. Even the map we have from Trailforks doesn't represent the correct BC parks boundary, the mushroom parking lot, the pic synchro posted is in bc parks. Where you see the 8x8 posts at incline/mushroom on Seymour, is BC parks.

Thanks Matthew for the update.

Question for you. In 2014 Dnv council voted to halt development on Seymour until this year. Can that vote be renewed? Seems like the Dnv has considerable power to confound the CMHC if it tries to develop the area.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

For those that need more of a visual on how much of Seymour this affects!

Cheers! Appreciate the updates.

Man… that map. What a headache.