Originally posted by counterpoint
**"I remember people complaining about nobody has taken the initiative to run a shuttle service on the shore. Now that we have one, people are looking for excuses to complain about nothing. Welcome to the Canadian way!"exactly. **
Even a hard core socialist like myself (ahem) can see that the complaints/concerns voiced by myself - and others - about a pay-for-shuttle service are more than just about "nothing".
I don't think anyone here really has a problem with there being a shuttle service, however, they all seem to want the operators to do it "their" way.
- Don't shuttle to closed trails
- Give back to the trails by:
participating in trail days
monetarily assisting the NSMBA (cash donations or supplies - shovels, gravel, whatever)
- Be legit. They say they've applied to the Parks Board for a permit, so right now they operate without one. Is that legit or not?? If I apply for a gun permit I can't buy the gun and see if it ends up being approved later (maybe a little harsh of a comparison, but one none the less)
I think that's about it, and hope I haven't put any words in anyone's mouth.
Just for the record - as most of you that ride these mountains have a bike that costs $1-4K anyhow, I think anyone here can afford to stop by a building supply place and pay $5 for a bucket of gravel or good topsoil, and arrange to drop it on a trail that needs maintenance, or just bring it with you on a trail day.
For Sharon and LeeLau - has the NSMBA ever approached any of companies to see about getting discounts for gravel and soil etc? I don't know N Van at all, but I'm sure there's a distributor somewehere that would help. Have to go bigger than a retailer most likely. Heck, go make a friend at a gravel pit… heheh
Originally posted by synchro
OMFG, that would be the shit. I would die for that kind of access to materials. Especially because I (and most other builders/maintainers) work alone or maybe only with one other person when we are out there.
Are you the guy who's been working on Severed and also on Bridal?
It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities.
- Josiah Stamp
Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the future of the human race.
- H.G. Wells
Originally posted by gimped I fully agree. It's a capitalistic society we live in, not a socialist
Welfare, UI, medical, taxes up the ying yang, and 1/2 my paycheck going to income tax. Not quite capitalistic enough for me. :(
It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities.
- Josiah Stamp
Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the future of the human race.
- H.G. Wells
IMO, everything we suggest is in Chuckwagon's interest. Acquiring the legal permits is a no brainer (and I realize they have already applied), and cooperating with the NSMBA makes sure the trails are ridable, and there. If there's no trails, there will be no riders.
Originally posted by Heatmizer
Just for the record - as most of you that ride these mountains have a bike that costs $1-4K anyhow, I think anyone here can afford to stop by a building supply place and pay $5 for a bucket of gravel or good topsoil, and arrange to drop it on a trail that needs maintenance, or just bring it with you on a trail day.
But that's typical of our society. The economy can be in shambles - unemployment running rampant, yet people with no money and/or no income can still afford to hit the bars and smoke a pack a day. Selfishness is far too prevelant.
Pick one Saturday - any Saturday - during the year, and stand on Ned's for the day. Get everyone who comes down to sign up to work 1/2 day on Ned's. If they all came out the next Saturday and did their 1/2 day, Ned's would end up in awesome shape.
Getting people to help out is hard.
It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities.
- Josiah Stamp
Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the future of the human race.
- H.G. Wells
Originally posted by switch
**Pick one Saturday - any Saturday - during the year, and stand on Ned's for the day. Get everyone who comes down to sign up to work 1/2 day on Ned's. If they all came out the next Saturday and did their 1/2 day, Ned's would end up in awesome shape.Getting people to help out is hard. **
Mandatory enlistment!
In classical economics this is - ironically - also known as the Free Rider phenomenon.
Its' not really selfishness. Doing nothing (eg. riding and never doing any trail work) is actually rational economic behaviour. Doing something (trailwork) is irrational.
But then its impossible to quantify the personal economic benefits in mental health we gain from doing trail work - as opposed to carping on the Internet.
Which is why most of economics is just so much unadulterated BS.
Originally posted by switch
**But that's typical of our society. The economy can be in shambles - unemployment running rampant, yet people with no money and/or no income can still afford to hit the bars and smoke a pack a day. Selfishness is far too prevelant.Pick one Saturday - any Saturday - during the year, and stand on Ned's for the day. Get everyone who comes down to sign up to work 1/2 day on Ned's. If they all came out the next Saturday and did their 1/2 day, Ned's would end up in awesome shape.
Getting people to help out is hard.**
Originally posted by switch
Are you the guy who's been working on Severed and also on Bridal?
Yup. How do ya like the bridge I made accross the creek with the log/tounge?
We don't know what our limits are, so to start something with the idea of being limited actually ends up limiting us.
Ellen Langer
I agree that shuttling up to closed trails is a no no, as is operating without the right permits….and any good shuttle service must help maintain the trails in my mind…….but really I don't think a shuttle service necessarily increases rider traffic. do people shuttle now? hell yeah, you see way more guys shuttling than climbing seymor. in my mind a service like this simply allows people who would normally be driving on their own to leave their cars/trucks/vans whatever at the bottom and let someone else worry about the driving, it doesn't necessarily increase traffic as much as it just gets people up the road differently…..it can reduce the number of cars running up and down the road, thereby reducing congestion in that sense and making it safer for the roadies that are always climbing up or the other mtb'ers…..can it have negative impacts? sure, anything done improperly can, but done smartly it could be very beneficial….
Originally posted by Incorrigible
Can somebody please just go back and read DD's first post? It made the most sense. I think the image is hilarious, these guys with bikes standing around not knowing what the hell to do next.
Good on the shuttle service idea - I'd never use it myself to be honest, but really…
you mean my post aboot riding up? :???:
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Originally posted by LeeLau
Its' not really selfishness. Doing nothing (eg. riding and never doing any trail work) is actually rational economic behaviour. Doing something (trailwork) is irrational.
Sounds a lot like entropy… ;) :D
It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities.
- Josiah Stamp
Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the future of the human race.
- H.G. Wells
Originally posted by FlipFantasia
…..it can reduce the number of cars running up and down the road, thereby reducing congestion in that sense and making it safer for the roadies that are always climbing up or the other mtb'ers…..
Just eliminating the horrible brake dust smell at the bottom of the mountain would be beneficial.
It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities.
- Josiah Stamp
Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the future of the human race.
- H.G. Wells
Originally posted by Zaskar
**i have talked to digger before.i mean on nsmb. you dont see him comin on here and bitching.
**
Yeah, I think they call that something like "maturity"…what a wacky concept.
Originally posted by Mulletron
Yeah, I think they call that something like "maturity"…what a wacky concept.
no, there's a completely different reason why digger doesn't have a comp or come on here. I won't post it though.
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