New posts

Live tree cut out on Good Sir Martin

Aug. 19, 2015, 11:22 p.m.
Posts: 364
Joined: July 8, 2005

This is a picture taken while we were building Good Sir Martin. The small arched (live) tree above the trail was left in place; we raised it higher to ensure it would be easy for riders/hikers/runners to get underneath it. It added a nice aesthetic. It's not a high speed section and there's good sight-lines coming into it. We liked it :)

Someone took it upon themselves to remove it. With a saw. In the process, they also uprooted a stump on the side of the trail. :(

Please do not "fix" a trail like this. It shows a lack of respect for the builders. It takes away from the beauty of the trail.

If you see something that needs repair, please report it on Trailforks.
http://www.trailforks.com/contribute/report/
We get notifications when someone submits a report and we can address the issue.

Thank you!

Aug. 20, 2015, 6:22 a.m.
Posts: 13930
Joined: March 15, 2003

It has come to this - the trails are 'owned'. I can cut the forest - but you - you can't cut the forest….unless I say so. Vandalism….cute.

Aug. 20, 2015, 8:31 a.m.
Posts: 364
Joined: July 8, 2005

There was no clear reason to cut the live tree.

If it was seen to be a problem, we would have investigated alternatives first (perhaps it wasn't secure in its raised position, but we'll never know).

Removal of the tree without consulting either of the active builders (we're still out most weeks, fixing up a few things since we opened it last month) doesn't do anything to foster cooperation and good will. It's just disappointing.

Aug. 20, 2015, 9 a.m.
Posts: 351
Joined: March 4, 2013

not sure what planet Zedbra just dropped in from. so anyone should be able to do anything they want to any trail? because that would work out really good.

as for what happened, it's sad but ultimately we have enough douche bags in these parts that if it's not too big to be moved by hand or too large to cut without a chainsaw, there is always the chance someone will take it upon themselves to "improve" the trail.

Aug. 20, 2015, 9:15 a.m.
Posts: 295
Joined: Nov. 25, 2013

I think we need to chill out a bit folks.

The likely situation is that someone thought there was an issue and wanted to help out. Rather than post something or bug someone with what they though was a minor issue, they took it upon themselves to "help". I'm sure they did not mean any ill-will or harm to the trail or a key feature.

This is not vandalism. This is probably someone who did not fully understand or realize the vision from the builder.

If you are that concerned and really want to be consulted about everything, post an email address or phone number of each builder below the sign to the entrance of the trail. Not everyone spends time on Trailforks or NSMB…

Aug. 20, 2015, 9:27 a.m.
Posts: 6449
Joined: Nov. 19, 2002

:lol: vandalism bahaha, sorry..that isn't vandalism. I think vandalism is someone keying your car, someone burning the sign at the entrance of a trail..pretty cut and dried IMO.

How did you secure the curved tree up? Did you tie it up? Nail it to another tree?

heres my logic; the curved tree that you propped up probably slipped down, came across the trail and someone who happened to be riding/running/walking past with a folding saw in their pack cut it out of the way because they thought they were helping. maybe they slipped and accidentally uprooted the stump. oh the horror.

Aug. 20, 2015, 9:47 a.m.
Posts: 1885
Joined: Oct. 16, 2005

I thought the tree was a cool little feature and appreciated how much effort was made not to disturb the forest around the GSM line.

Huge appreciation for all your effort Penny and Martin. Sorry to see folks taking things into their own hands on a trail that shows such active signs of ongoing building/maintenance.

Mean People SUCK! Nice People SHOVEL!

Trails For All; Trails For Weather

Aug. 20, 2015, 10:15 a.m.
Posts: 248
Joined: July 10, 2010

It was cut out on Tuesday evening. 1st lap up the tree was alive and it was still out of the way, so it had not fallen and become an obsticle. On the 2nd lap up I passed a group of 6 at that tree as it was being moved after being cut. I recognize the riders and I would suspect they will come forward and PM you Penny, as they are all frequent riders on the shore.

I believe there intentions were to help and simply did not realize this was a feature.

Personally I had seen the tree as Penny and Martin had intended, as a trail feature. I can only imagine many riders inocently took it as something that needed to be fixed…

Misplaced good intentions…..

Aug. 20, 2015, 10:36 a.m.
Posts: 364
Joined: July 8, 2005

Thanks for the info.

I believe there intentions were to help and simply did not realize this was a feature.

Misplaced good intentions…..

Yes, this is what I believe too. We're just a little sad about it - something that is really important to me with building is to keep the trail as naturalized and beautiful as possible.

I would just like to see future issues on the trail to be handled a little more cooperatively with us ;)

Aug. 20, 2015, 11:10 a.m.
Posts: 1584
Joined: June 20, 2003

Well, good luck with that. On the trails we maintain, it is an ongoing battle with people braiding, modifying etc as they see fit.

Aug. 20, 2015, 1:29 p.m.
Posts: 8256
Joined: Nov. 21, 2002

I thought it was cool how you kept that tree in.

Removal of the tree without consulting either of the active builders (we're still out most weeks, fixing up a few things since we opened it last month) doesn't do anything to foster cooperation and good will. It's just disappointing.

This is one of a few reason why I don't build much anymore. I got tired of riders strava'ing trails, changing/braiding lines, re-opening trails in the winter, and generally doing shit that they know the builder doesn't like.

WTB Frequency i23 rim, 650b NEW - $40

Aug. 20, 2015, 3:52 p.m.
Posts: 315
Joined: Aug. 10, 2012

I think we need to chill out a bit folks.

The likely situation is that someone thought there was an issue and wanted to help out. Rather than post something or bug someone with what they though was a minor issue, they took it upon themselves to "help". I'm sure they did not mean any ill-will or harm to the trail or a key feature.

This is not vandalism. This is probably someone who did not fully understand or realize the vision from the builder.

If you are that concerned and really want to be consulted about everything, post an email address or phone number of each builder below the sign to the entrance of the trail. Not everyone spends time on Trailforks or NSMB…

^
this.

Not everyone reads these forums or plays the "game". It may be a simple case of spontaneous volunteerism.

Aug. 20, 2015, 4:06 p.m.
Posts: 351
Joined: March 4, 2013

Well, good luck with that. On the trails we maintain, it is an ongoing battle with people braiding, modifying etc as they see fit.

yup, too many people in these parts, and it only takes one ignorant/clueless/entitled rider.

Aug. 20, 2015, 4:28 p.m.
Posts: 253
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

i feel your pain mudhoney - more than you know as i've been down this road a few times.

i think we can agree that simple things like clearing drains/mudholes, moving blowdown or deadfall off the trail, piling up rocks etc are pretty much a free for all. i appreciate that people want to help out, but when there is an established/recognized/known builder on a trail then common courtesy, decency and respect should come into play before altering a trail. in acting as a potential helper, people have no idea what the builder is intending to do. your actions may help, they may hinder, or they may take away work that the builder was looking forward to doing. it's great that people want to help, but they also need to consider all the implications of their actions. if you don't know, then leave it alone or take the time to find out. in this day and age it is super easy to find out who the builder of a trail is and ways to get in touch with them.

when people have put in their own time to create something that others will benefit from, then the decision making should fall to the builder.

I'm not a human in real life, I just play one on the internet. 

Aug. 20, 2015, 5:35 p.m.
Posts: 207
Joined: July 22, 2014

Not everyone is part of the 'biking community' as defined by being part of NSMBA or nsmb.com or NSRIDE or whatever. And for that matter, they may even be tourists from another area and see something they think is awry.

What exactly is 'altering a trail'?

" clearing drains/mudholes, moving blowdown or deadfall off the trail, piling up rocks etc are pretty much a free for all. "

But what if someone 'feature' looks like mother natures 'deadfall' or just a bad design.

What if it looks like it could fall lower and snag a rider in the dark?

Does NSMBA have a hotline I can text a picture to whenever I see something that needs immediate attention? Perhaps post that number and a sign at the trailhead to any sponsored trail that they want guarded from other independent trail hacks.

Given the free-for-all in most areas of mtbr around the world, a visitor would have no idea how 'organized' things are up here …

Forum jump: