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Incident on Cypress WuTang on Wednesday

Oct. 1, 2022, 8:42 a.m.
Posts: 935
Joined: Nov. 18, 2015

I’ve been bothered by reports of asinine behaviour from three riders on WuTang on Wednesday afternoon. Riders were on DH bikes.

Hiker with a dog was walking at the top of WuTang. Riders didn’t provide proper caution when approaching and when the hiker asked them to slow down, they proceeded to yell obscenities; it sounds to me like this was a viscous verbal assault.

Firstly, there are only three authorized trails on Cypress; WuTang is not one of them. Hikers with dogs or young kids have equally as much right to be there (none) as you do. Riders need to be prepared to meet unexpected obstacles around the next turn - it might be a dog but it also might be a family sitting down in the middle of the trail. Foot traffic on Cypress is way up, especially on the trails above the first switchback. Your days of blindly flying down these trails on DH bikes are probably over unfortunately. The good news is that you can theoretically do that on the authorized trails

I understand what happens when riders on fast bikes come across people on foot with dogs, I’ve been on both sides of that equation dozens of times. But there is NEVER any reason to verbally assault someone for simply walking in the woods with their dog. Your asinine behaviour makes us all look bad. The woman you yelled at probably rides Cypress more than you three do, but had this been one of the (many) people who are currently writing letters to DWV and BPP about how now that mountain bikers have their own authorized area around Mystery that bikes should be prohibited from the rest of Cypress, they’d have written to the NorthShore News or the District about what horrible people us bikers are. You three made us all look bad on Wednesday - including the many people who are fighting for your ability to continue to ride these trails. You are not entitled to ride them- it’s a privilege.

Perhaps if you realized that you were not anonymous behind your full faces and goggles you would have thought twice about your behaviour.

Lessons for us all, please expect to come across hikers with dogs on Cypress (especially close to the first switchback), it’s a multiuse area and others have as much right to be there as you (again, nobody has any right to be there) and FFS don’t be a$$holes when you come across others

Many people are working hard to retain an ability to ride Cypress’ trails outside of those which are authorized. It’s important that we maintain a positive reputation amongst those who decide if we get to keep riding there or not. Let’s be positive contributors to the community as often as possible. Happy trails to all!


 Last edited by: Ddean on Oct. 1, 2022, 9:17 a.m., edited 4 times in total.
Oct. 1, 2022, 10:50 a.m.
Posts: 1775
Joined: Nov. 8, 2003

Posted by: Ddean

Firstly, there are only three authorized trails on Cypress; WuTang is not one of them. Hikers with dogs or young kids have equally as much right to be there (none) as you do. Riders need to be prepared to meet unexpected obstacles around the next turn - it might be a dog but it also might be a family sitting down in the middle of the trail.

That bit there /\

Every pirated little trail  instantly becomes a sanctioned World Cup downhill course closed to all others in some idiot's minds, and not the illegal mixed use trail it is. Hopefully these guys were at least riding with loud bells.


 Last edited by: Hepcat on Oct. 1, 2022, 10:52 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Oct. 1, 2022, 12:07 p.m.
Posts: 23
Joined: May 27, 2018

Very well put Ddean.

The "bike trails" on lower westside Cypress will undoubtedly see more uphill foot traffic in the future due to the pop-up village and mountain path/trestle bridge. At first blush signage might seem a solution but, given the unsanctioned nature of the trails, that wanders into a tangle of liability and land ownership issues. For the time being riding on those trails means dropping any sense of entitlement, along with your speed, or risk closure.

Oct. 1, 2022, 7:33 p.m.
Posts: 13
Joined: Nov. 23, 2012

Thanks for bringing this to attention. The majority of the MTB trail users on Cypress are not aware of how fortunate we are to continue to use a network on which is essentially private property. Those very big signs in the middle of most of the high traffic trails really do mean something. More interactions of the same sort only portray us riders more negatively. Situational awareness and respect for other trail users is so important right now.

Oct. 2, 2022, 5:13 p.m.
Posts: 969
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

We talked a bunch about this when that new graded path was put in along with the coffee shop at the first switchback.

https://nsmb.com/forum/forum/the-shore-3/topic/cypress-2022-132328/

There are so many more pedestrians on these trails than there used to be. It sucks for us, who have enjoying these trails in solitude for decades, but this is life now. Lower Cypress is only going to get more crowded as the development plans progress and we gain fewer new trails than we gain. Enjoy this last phase of the "how it used to be on Cypress". It will be something else soon.

Oct. 2, 2022, 9:41 p.m.
Posts: 1300
Joined: May 11, 2018

My wife and I moved to Vancouver in 2004. We both comment to one another how lucky we feel to have experienced vancouver at that time. We used to ride squamish a lot. This was pre University. You had to park at the golf course and ride up the road. We'd rarely see another biker. There were far fewer trails but they were all excellent fun. Pseudo pseuga was single-track and there wasn't a berm on it. Biking there back then was such a different experience to what it is now. 

We also remember having to go into local shops and buy maps (or have them hand drawn) when going to New areas. Growth and development has some advantages but I have to say, leaving Vancouver always feels good. I recently took a Jon in terrace and although I haven't actually had a chance to bike here, I hear it's amazing and I really can't wait. I love riding in towns this size that are not mtb destinations. 

I actually blaim enduro racing for some of the changes we see in the attitudes of riders on the shore. It used to be that shuttle trails would attract a lot of the assholes. Pedal bikes weren't as capable and so attracted less meat head types. Enduro racing attracts a very wide ranging group and brings them all under the same umbrella and onto the same trails. I hate it when I hear about riders doing ignorant rude shit like this. I liked it better when they were a very different group than mine wearing hockey pads and riding different trails. Now it looks bad on all of us! 

Thanks for raising awareness about this and speaking up.

Oct. 3, 2022, 9:18 a.m.
Posts: 531
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Posted by: RAHrider

My wife and I moved to Vancouver in 2004. We both comment to one another how lucky we feel to have experienced vancouver at that time. We used to ride squamish a lot. This was pre University. You had to park at the golf course and ride up the road. We'd rarely see another biker. There were far fewer trails but they were all excellent fun. Pseudo pseuga was single-track and there wasn't a berm on it. Biking there back then was such a different experience to what it is now. 

We also remember having to go into local shops and buy maps (or have them hand drawn) when going to New areas. Growth and development has some advantages but I have to say, leaving Vancouver always feels good. I recently took a Jon in terrace and although I haven't actually had a chance to bike here, I hear it's amazing and I really can't wait. I love riding in towns this size that are not mtb destinations. 

I actually blaim enduro racing for some of the changes we see in the attitudes of riders on the shore. It used to be that shuttle trails would attract a lot of the assholes. Pedal bikes weren't as capable and so attracted less meat head types. Enduro racing attracts a very wide ranging group and brings them all under the same umbrella and onto the same trails. I hate it when I hear about riders doing ignorant rude shit like this. I liked it better when they were a very different group than mine wearing hockey pads and riding different trails. Now it looks bad on all of us! 

Thanks for raising awareness about this and speaking up.

In other words, perhaps this growth that we are told we need to keep out sport healthy is bullshit or at least needs some thought beyond "more is better". I’ve seen the parking areas in Squamish on nice days, I’ve been at the top of Lord of the Squirrels where there were about 50 riders milling about, I hear from hiking friends how many people he sees in North Van and how pounded the trails are, permit system in Garibaldi Park, no dogs at Joffrey to limit user numbers.

Oct. 3, 2022, 1:36 p.m.
Posts: 935
Joined: Nov. 18, 2015

There are two issues, 1) the recurring concern that comes from recent popularity and diversity of user groups in overlapping common spaces, and 2) what happens when there are "conflicts" in the woods.

The incident that I outlined was fairly typical until the verbal assault happened. The approach speed and awareness of the riders, whether they were on the wrong side of appropriate or not, did not result in a collision or a near-miss. Riders ripping down a "multi-use" trail, while more risky in some areas than others, is not worth more than the gentle reminder that we all need to pay more caution than we are used to in some areas on Cypress.

To me, this incident is defined by the behavior of the riders verbally assaulting the hiker.

Oct. 3, 2022, 1:46 p.m.
Posts: 969
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

Posted by: andy-eunson

Posted by: RAHrider

My wife and I moved to Vancouver in 2004. We both comment to one another how lucky we feel to have experienced vancouver at that time. We used to ride squamish a lot. This was pre University. You had to park at the golf course and ride up the road. We'd rarely see another biker. There were far fewer trails but they were all excellent fun. Pseudo pseuga was single-track and there wasn't a berm on it. Biking there back then was such a different experience to what it is now.

We also remember having to go into local shops and buy maps (or have them hand drawn) when going to New areas. Growth and development has some advantages but I have to say, leaving Vancouver always feels good. I recently took a Jon in terrace and although I haven't actually had a chance to bike here, I hear it's amazing and I really can't wait. I love riding in towns this size that are not mtb destinations.

I actually blaim enduro racing for some of the changes we see in the attitudes of riders on the shore. It used to be that shuttle trails would attract a lot of the assholes. Pedal bikes weren't as capable and so attracted less meat head types. Enduro racing attracts a very wide ranging group and brings them all under the same umbrella and onto the same trails. I hate it when I hear about riders doing ignorant rude shit like this. I liked it better when they were a very different group than mine wearing hockey pads and riding different trails. Now it looks bad on all of us!

Thanks for raising awareness about this and speaking up.

In other words, perhaps this growth that we are told we need to keep out sport healthy is bullshit or at least needs some thought beyond "more is better". I’ve seen the parking areas in Squamish on nice days, I’ve been at the top of Lord of the Squirrels where there were about 50 riders milling about, I hear from hiking friends how many people he sees in North Van and how pounded the trails are, permit system in Garibaldi Park, no dogs at Joffrey to limit user numbers.

The sport was more strictly self-selected when it was a bunch of seeker/renegade/innovator types more interested in doing than joining. Now the bar is low enough that it appeals to the same people who would have mocked us in 2005 for wearing pads for riding bikes in the woods. I think there was a deeper sense of community and shared etiquette before.


 Last edited by: craw on Oct. 3, 2022, 1:47 p.m., edited 2 times in total.

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