New posts

ebikes on the Shore

March 26, 2019, 8:16 p.m.
Posts: 11
Joined: Aug. 6, 2004

Like Mr Simmons has said above much speculation on many different fronts makes this a very complicated subject.

As a builder of the Shore my worst fears are already front and center and I see E-bikes accelerating what is going on the shore. We now have a potential

user group that without much effort getting into areas that were previously earned through hard work and many hard learned experiences.

Will this new user group demand a easy access up and down? who can say... But we are losing iconic features that define the shore each and every year.

Will motorized e-bikes be the tipping point on previously safe trail features that were fine to ride with human powered bikes?

This is not speculation on my part. We are actually being mandated by land mangers in removing iconic features that have always been the part of the shore.

little by little we lose what comes to easy.

March 26, 2019, 8:51 p.m.
Posts: 69
Joined: March 1, 2017

I've heard that people on E-bikes are 10 times more likely to run over frogs than people on acoustic bikes.

(There, that should do it....)

March 26, 2019, 8:53 p.m.
Posts: 944
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: trumpstinyhands

I've heard that people on E-bikes are 10 times more likely to run over frogs than people on acoustic bikes.

(There, that should do it....)

that could make people around here more inclined to ride ebikes

March 27, 2019, 8:32 a.m.
Posts: 1091
Joined: Feb. 26, 2015

An acoustic bike sounds like something the hipsters on their fixes came up with, laugh everytime I hear it.

Yes- Ebikers are frog killers

March 27, 2019, 12:08 p.m.
Posts: 8
Joined: Aug. 16, 2018

it's obvious this is coming and the sport will change hugely.

if anyone thinks the changes will all be for the good they are probably delusional. this is directed at the e-bike proponents who don't want to even acknowledge there could be downsides.

in 10-20 years when the sport has increased in size 5-10x and the trails are flooded with people, we'll look back on the pre- e-bike days fondly. how would fromme and seymour do with even a doubling in ridership? parking is already at capacity.

at some point the bike tech, and continued erosion of trail technicality, is going to make this sport so mainstream that we'll long for the old days when the trails were hard, the bikes were shitty, and you actually had to propel yourself uphill.

ultimately as a trail builder, i will move to greener pastures or give up entirely and move on to other sports, if the flood of entitled and ignorant e-bike riders is as bad as i fear it could be. interest in working on trails for e-bike newbs is around zero.


 Last edited by: oldmanbuilder on March 27, 2019, 12:10 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
March 27, 2019, 4:13 p.m.
Posts: 65
Joined: March 14, 2017

I suspect lots of people will be moving if ridership is 2x of what it is now....  too many moochers and freeloaders out there to sustain what we have.

March 27, 2019, 4:29 p.m.
Posts: 263
Joined: Nov. 25, 2013

Posted by: oldmanbuilder

in 10-20 years when the sport has increased in size 5-10x and the trails are flooded with people, we'll look back on the pre- e-bike days fondly. how would fromme and seymour do with even a doubling in ridership? parking is already at capacity.

Soapbox moment:

As someone that rides fromme 50% of the time with one of my younger kids on weekends - Parking is a challenge and a necessity to expose my little groms to the joys of the sport. If you are e-biking, coast (oops, sorry - I mean "pedal") up Mountain highway and leave the lot open.

March 28, 2019, 8:51 a.m.
Posts: 165
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Posted by: oldmanbuilder

it's obvious this is coming and the sport will change hugely.

if anyone thinks the changes will all be for the good they are probably delusional. this is directed at the e-bike proponents who don't want to even acknowledge there could be downsides.

in 10-20 years when the sport has increased in size 5-10x and the trails are flooded with people, we'll look back on the pre- e-bike days fondly. how would fromme and seymour do with even a doubling in ridership? parking is already at capacity.

at some point the bike tech, and continued erosion of trail technicality, is going to make this sport so mainstream that we'll long for the old days when the trails were hard, the bikes were shitty, and you actually had to propel yourself uphill.

ultimately as a trail builder, i will move to greener pastures or give up entirely and move on to other sports, if the flood of entitled and ignorant e-bike riders is as bad as i fear it could be. interest in working on trails for e-bike newbs is around zero.

That’s a really important point. The ebike proponents say things like “it will grow the sport”.  Why do “we” want the sport to grow? “Ebikes are the future of the sport”. What is the future of ebikes?  Last year I rode in Squamish on a cold damp fall Saturday. I could not believe how many vehicles were parked on the Garibaldi park road and lots. Witness the shit show on the Duffey Lake road at Joffrey Lakes. So I ask again, why is growth good?  Ski Whistler on a Saturday in January with 35cm new at -10. So much fun waiting in lines and skiing in a crowd. Why is growth good?

March 28, 2019, 8:52 a.m.
Posts: 397
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

Posted by: oldmanbuilder

it's obvious this is coming and the sport will change hugely.

if anyone thinks the changes will all be for the good they are probably delusional. this is directed at the e-bike proponents who don't want to even acknowledge there could be downsides.

in 10-20 years when the sport has increased in size 5-10x and the trails are flooded with people, we'll look back on the pre- e-bike days fondly. how would fromme and seymour do with even a doubling in ridership? parking is already at capacity.

But but we don't need to drive to the trailhead anymore from any place because self-shuttle. E-bikes will solve the traffic and parking problem altogether.

March 28, 2019, 10:15 a.m.
Posts: 2
Joined: March 2, 2019

We all need to stop using the term "ebike". They are MOPEDS, and should be shamed accordingly for being ridden on trails built for BICYCLES. You only spin the cranks on them for appearances sake, even if you have the bike set up so that you must provide some power, the bike is still providing power, which makes it a MOPED. The perception of any kind of gray area here is bullshit.

Its exactly like what is called "modern country" music. ITS FUCKING POP. But they can't call it that because it would destroy much of the appeal. 

Human power is the essence of cycling. If you don't suffer up climbs, providing ALL of the power, in places meant to be pedaled up you have no right to call yourself a cyclist. I say that because admittedly I shuttle and ride chairlifts sometimes too, having places to do so is all the appeal to the lazy that our sport needs already. I'm not saying all people who ride chairlifts or shuttle are lazy, its just what you do in certain places. But that part of the sport certainly does appeal to lazy people. Sorry. Most of those places with uplifts still require human power to a degree too, so at least there's that. 

I do think there is some small gray area with them that is helping folks that otherwise could not participate in the sport, enjoy it as well. But that's it. Its bullshit that the industry uses stories of these folks to try to make them more appealing to the rest of us. If that was a genuine purpose of mopeds, they would ONLY be sold to those folks.

March 28, 2019, 10:20 a.m.
Posts: 140
Joined: Jan. 2, 2018

I saw YT put a press release on PB for their new moped this morning, so much shaming and pitchforkery ensued in the comments it was almost immediately removed. I did chuckle.

March 28, 2019, 10:31 a.m.
Posts: 1118
Joined: Sept. 30, 2006

I thought PB was trying to adopt a 'no e-bike content' policy?  If it is the same press release that is posted up here, I am not surprised the PB collective went to town on it.

March 28, 2019, 11:52 a.m.
Posts: 725
Joined: March 18, 2017

Posted by: andy-eunson

Why is growth good?

Because the companies and people that will benefit financially from said growth say so. 

Bike companies are in business to sell bikes. Not to promote trail access or anything else.

March 28, 2019, 11:54 a.m.
Posts: 725
Joined: March 18, 2017

Posted by: craw

But but we don't need to drive to the trailhead anymore from any place because self-shuttle. E-bikes will solve the traffic and parking problem altogether.

Somewhat. But how much of your Super Secret Sticky Compound tyre knobs will be worn off by taking the Adanac over Iron workers to Fromme?

March 28, 2019, 12:01 p.m.
Posts: 397
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

Posted by: Endur-Bro

Posted by: craw

But but we don't need to drive to the trailhead anymore from any place because self-shuttle. E-bikes will solve the traffic and parking problem altogether.

Somewhat. But how much of your Super Secret Sticky Compound tyre knobs will be worn off by taking the Adanac over Iron workers to Fromme?

All of it? I was being sarcastic. I originally liked the idea of so-called self-shuttling except when I did the calculations that the batteries on these bikes would be lucky to get a 200lb rider from East Van, up and down one mountain and home again without limping home on an empty battery. So basically I'd have to put this 50lb+ bike on my NSR rack and drive it over the bridge same as ever. It'll be a while before they make one of these things worthwhile for me. 

Though that Nicolai one is pretty slick with its rear Rohloff hub and 9000euro price tag (that's $14000CAD+).

Forum jump: