ebikes on the Shore

Posted by: Ddean

My biggest concern is that sensitive trails that are challenging to get to will no longer be protected. In part, thats up to those who use those trails to stay silent about them.

EDIT: And Ive not forgotten that Ive seen a video from Rocky about ebikes filmed in what Id call a very sensitive "protected by a climb" zone. Shame on Rocky for doing that. Exactly my point and biggest worry.

I was in Whistler on Friday and a group of 3 dudes on ebikes came flying up the Blackcomb road. They had already done two laps (Microclimate, Dark Crystal) by 11am and were on their third ride up to hit Dark Crystal again when one's battery died. They went back down to the village to get another battery and keep riding. They were friendly enough, and their POV was they are on holiday with limited time and want to ride everything... so there's an example of a somewhat sensitive trail that is getting punched hard (DC) by heavy bikes for multiple laps that would never happen except by the most fit riders on normal bikes.

Posted by: grambo
I was in Whistler on Friday and a group of 3 dudes on ebikes came flying up the Blackcomb road. They had already done two laps (Microclimate, Dark Crystal) by 11am and were on their third ride up to hit Dark Crystal again when one's battery died. They went back down to the village to get another battery and keep riding. They were friendly enough, and their POV was they are on holiday with limited time and want to ride everything... so there's an example of a somewhat sensitive trail that is getting punched hard (DC) by heavy bikes for multiple laps that would never happen except by the most fit riders on normal bikes.

perfect example of how these things will change usage patterns and mess up trails that were protected by difficulty to access.  good times in our future. 

i foresee more new trails being built iwith heinous hike a bikes.  that's the direction i would go in, anyways.

Posted by: oldmanbuilder

Posted by: grambo
I was in Whistler on Friday and a group of 3 dudes on ebikes came flying up the Blackcomb road. They had already done two laps (Microclimate, Dark Crystal) by 11am and were on their third ride up to hit Dark Crystal again when one's battery died. They went back down to the village to get another battery and keep riding. They were friendly enough, and their POV was they are on holiday with limited time and want to ride everything... so there's an example of a somewhat sensitive trail that is getting punched hard (DC) by heavy bikes for multiple laps that would never happen except by the most fit riders on normal bikes.

perfect example of how these things will change usage patterns and mess up trails that were protected by difficulty to access.  good times in our future. 

i foresee more new trails being built iwith heinous hike a bikes.  that's the direction i would go in, anyways.

Except that many ebikes now come with a walk mode that engages the assist to help with walking and pushing. But that wouldn't help with a tricky section you have to clamber over so maybe that's the answer.

We had one or two ravines to cross on our dank loaner ride this weekend. Tbh it’s probably less effort to muscle an ebike down and up the ravine than pedal a Mtn bike up to the trail head.

I ran flats for the day since I knew I was going be doing the Enduro Walk of Shame 90% of it.

Somewhat related 

Porter was guest on GMBN Podcast. Chats about ebikes a little. It’s a good watch.

Posted by: oldmanbuilder

i foresee more new trails being built iwith heinous hike a bikes.  that's the direction i would go in, anyways.

I already know of one trail built like this with ebikes in mind.

Yesterday I was getting set to ride down Dale's/Forever After and guy on e-bike is zooming UP Dale's! WTF, really, REALLY bad idea, dude, even if it was a Monday morning.

Had I started riding down  a few minutes earlier....

Nice to see the ebike riders ignoring the DH only signpost. Maybe he should ride up John Deere on a busy Saturday see how that goes.

Posted by: Brocklanders

Nice to see the ebike riders ignoring the DH only signpost. Maybe he should ride up John Deere on a busy Saturday see how that goes.

But the ebiker riders say there are asshole mountain bikers who do dumb stuff too and that ebikes pose no incremental threat to trail access due to user conflicts! Sad to see but it really feels like the tide has already turned in a lot of BC. Takes a special kind of dumb to pedal up a high speed flow trail. Even with an ebike you'd need enough skill that you should realize why that's dangerous.

Re: Chris Porter, he makes an awesome and blunt point about why he doesn't like ebikes (but loves bicycles and motorcycles).

Posted by: shore_flea

Yesterday I was getting set to ride down Dale's/Forever After and guy on e-bike is zooming UP Dale's! WTF, really, REALLY bad idea, dude, even if it was a Monday morning.

Had I started riding down a few minutes earlier....

Considering that some people who promote ebikes routinely post videos of themselves climbing up the descent trails, it is not surprise that this type of assjacketry (technical term) is occurring.

Again it demonstrates that the problem is more in the application and use, rather than the technology itself. Seeing that the ebike promoters have been so quick to compare ebikes to the advent of suspension and disc brakes (and snowboards, and all sorts of other things), it seems appropriate to consider what has come along with the maturation of MTB technology....namely accepting a certain level of restrictions on how they are to be used. For example, there are many places were bikes are explicitly forbidden (i.e. Stump Lake loop between May and September). If one wishes to compare ebikes to other technologies (as so often occurs) then one must naturally invite a consideration of restrictions that are placed upon them. Kiteboarding for example....,look at Hookipa. The addition of a speed-generating sail has required a division between the exclusively paddle-powered wave riders to the east, and the sails to the west.

Seeing that ebike promoters have also likened their technology to snowboards, let's consider that. If a new snowboard was developed with a motor assist that allowed you to ascend the mountain, would it make sense in ANY PLACE to go up the runs that people are descending on skis and non-motorized snowboards? I think that is a fairly acceptable comparison, and I think the answer is obvious.

So, yup, it's likely only a matter of time before we have some sort of collision between an uphill motor-assisted rider and a descender.....ooops wait, I think that something like this may already have happened with a recent event in Squamish where two people on ebikes reportedly smacked into each other on the Mashiter as they were cooking along. Could just as easily have happened to two pedal-powered riders, but with the addition of the motor, there was (without argument) less time to avoid the collision.

Anyways, still waiting for some responsible leadership on this.

Posted by: cerealkilla_

Anyways, still waiting for some responsible leadership on this.

That's probably where most people are at - DNV, Metro and DWV need to make a decision and post appropriate signage.

Posted by: syncro

Posted by: cerealkilla_

Anyways, still waiting for some responsible leadership on this.

That's probably where most people are at - DNV, Metro and DWV need to make a decision and post appropriate signage.

Agreed. Now NSMBA has to step up to the plate and get something happening instead of this wait and see approach. At the very least big no ebikes acending on DH flow trails signage would be a great start.

Posted by: Brocklanders

Agreed. Now NSMBA has to step up to the plate and get something happening instead of this wait and see approach. At the very least big no ebikes acending on DH flow trails signage would be a great start.

looks outside for the four horsemen as brock and I agree on something ebike related

Posted by: shore_flea

Yesterday I was getting set to ride down Dale's/Forever After and guy on e-bike is zooming UP Dale's! WTF, really, REALLY bad idea, dude, even if it was a Monday morning.

Had I started riding down  a few minutes earlier....

I wish this stupidity was limited to e-bikes. Riding down Bobsled on Sunday I had to hit the brakes to avoid the people pushing their bikes UP the wood berm.

Posted by: syncro

Posted by: Brocklanders

Agreed. Now NSMBA has to step up to the plate and get something happening instead of this wait and see approach. At the very least big no ebikes acending on DH flow trails signage would be a great start.

looks outside for the four horsemen as brock and I agree on something ebike related

They stopped at my place for a beer last night.

This whole thing is kinda messy. The info I have received recently in regard to the DNV is that they find our whole feeling of entitlement to the trails as a inconvenience, they aren't really interested and could care less. So we better get our house in order. First hand info from convo I had with an unnamed source at the DNV.