New posts

ebikes on the Shore

May 2, 2019, 6:09 p.m.
Posts: 6002
Joined: April 10, 2005

Biking pros young & old have been coming forward espousing the virtues of e-bikes. I guess it's a fine line between selling out or pissing off your purist mountain bike fan base or putting bread on the table.


 Last edited by: Stuminator on May 2, 2019, 6:09 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
May 2, 2019, 11:30 p.m.
Posts: 13016
Joined: Nov. 24, 2002

Posted by: Stuminator

Biking pros young & old have been coming forward espousing the virtues of e-bikes. I guess it's a fine line between selling out or pissing off your purist mountain bike fan base or putting bread on the table.

Yes, exactly. I remember the comments on a short edit of Ryan Howard and Brandon Semenuk, among others, riding somehwere in California on ebikes, trying some jibbing at an old bridge, sliding and goofing around. Most comments were along the lines of "How can you?"

What most riders forget is ...these riders are professional athletes, they make a living riding for certain brands. It is not that they work from 9-5 in an office downtown and go for a quick spin around the neighbourhood. All these athletes "do not get free bikes for nothing" as Harookz so pointedly said a long time ago in a video.

If a company wants them to ride an ebike, it probably says so in the contract.

It seems that quite a lot of people forget this.

May 3, 2019, 8:49 a.m.
Posts: 780
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

Posted by: Stuminator

Biking pros young & old have been coming forward espousing the virtues of e-bikes. I guess it's a fine line between selling out or pissing off your purist mountain bike fan base or putting bread on the table.

I'd be quicker to blame the companies for putting riders in this position.


 Last edited by: craw on May 3, 2019, 8:49 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
May 3, 2019, 8:52 a.m.
Posts: 1992
Joined: April 25, 2003

I don't think we forget it.   I think that the bike companies have mistakenly assumed that we'd go for their mopeds if they put our "heros" on them; turns out not all of us are into them and they've devalued their brand (company and rider) in the eyes of some by being associated with these things.

I wouldn't be surprised if this changes soon: some companies and riders will sell mopeds alongside bikes, others will remain true to mountain (and road) biking and choose not to.  Their branding will reflect that.

May 3, 2019, 11:16 a.m.
Posts: 486
Joined: April 11, 2011

Posted by: Stuminator

young & old

How young?

I’m going to throw another perspective out here that I’ve been chewing on. Being in a position where I do a lot of riding with kids, it’s hard for me not to view this through their lens. I have an 8-year old that is not super keen to be a hammer on the hills. Of course, seeing grown adults rip by on pedal assist, as we aimlessly wander up the hill has her asking: Dad, do they make pedal assist for kids? I’ll spare you the details of the conversation but basically, she’s legitimately puzzled at the prospect of struggling up the same trails that able-bodied adults are laughing at. Rightfully, I think.

In my whole time in the industry, every new product gets criticised. The front suspension, the rear suspension, the dropper post, the disc brakes, it’s all cheating, cheating, cheating.

Schley’s comments in the above article are unarguably true, but all of the developments that he cites are largely developed to aid with descending. My 8-year-old is certainly enjoying these developments but won’t be aided by pedal assist anytime soon. From the perspective of a kid, that makes it distinctly different than the other “cheating” mechanisms. I know my oldest would really enjoy the full Lord of Squirrels descent, but without putting in some work, it probably won’t happen this year.

Don’t mistake this for e-bike hate. I know people who ride pedal assist bikes and I like riding with them just as much as other riding partners. I’m in the market for a commuter with pedal assist, and I’m not going to reject the prospect of riding an eMTB when the joints say it’s time. Though, IMO, it only seems reasonable that I’d ride one on trails that had been sanctioned for eMTB.

May 3, 2019, 4:56 p.m.
Posts: 458
Joined: Nov. 25, 2013

If I were the "Big S" or "Rocky" or another larger brand trying to play both sides, I would look to pair off the e-moped bike under a sub brand. "Trail Motorcycles" and in small print beside it "a "big-bike-company" brand". That way they can try to delineate the two streams while still keeping some brand recognition...Almost like Santa Cruz/Juliana (same bikes, different cockpit), or Giant/Liv (different frames, same brand).

May 3, 2019, 5 p.m.
Posts: 780
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

Putting in the work is what it's all about. The idea that you can now buy your way out of putting in the work but still want to claim that it's the same activity really bothers me.

May 3, 2019, 5:53 p.m.
Posts: 1781
Joined: Feb. 26, 2015

Add a motor, tear out the soul.

May 3, 2019, 6:13 p.m.
Posts: 1241
Joined: Nov. 6, 2006

Posted by: craw

Putting in the work is what it's all about. The idea that you can now buy your way out of putting in the work but still want to claim that it's the same activity really bothers me.

Do you ride park?

May 3, 2019, 6:52 p.m.
Posts: 6002
Joined: April 10, 2005

I gots to say when a couple of riders I follow on Instagram did some e-bike promos I was pretty dismayed. Echo the above comment "How could you?"

May 3, 2019, 7:17 p.m.
Posts: 1624
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: craw

Putting in the work is what it's all about. The idea that you can now buy your way out of putting in the work but still want to claim that it's the same activity really bothers me.

That’s your ego talking. 

You have to reconcile why it bothers you how someone gets to the top. It’s the same thing when commuting by ebike or pedal bike, why does it matter? It matters because humans are inherently competitive and someone “beating” you is especially bothersome if you perceive them to be somehow cheating.  

Ride your own ride and if people are being asshats then feel free to call them out for it, otherwise have fun and don’t let someone else’s choice ruin you day.

May 4, 2019, 8:58 a.m.
Posts: 780
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

Posted by: FLATCH

Posted by: craw

Putting in the work is what it's all about. The idea that you can now buy your way out of putting in the work but still want to claim that it's the same activity really bothers me.

Do you ride park?

no

May 4, 2019, 9:04 a.m.
Posts: 780
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

Posted by: syncro

Posted by: craw

Putting in the work is what it's all about. The idea that you can now buy your way out of putting in the work but still want to claim that it's the same activity really bothers me.

That’s your ego talking. 

You have to reconcile why it bothers you how someone gets to the top. It’s the same thing when commuting by ebike or pedal bike, why does it matter? It matters because humans are inherently competitive and someone “beating” you is especially bothersome if you perceive them to be somehow cheating.  

Ride your own ride and if people are being asshats then feel free to call them out for it, otherwise have fun and don’t let someone else’s choice ruin you day.

Indeed. People can do what they like. Shuttling doesn't bother me, nor to chairlifts. But then again those people aren't out proselytizing are they? 

Commuting is different. It has different requirements - get to work quicker, less sweaty. Perfect.

May 4, 2019, 11:41 a.m.
Posts: 1241
Joined: Nov. 6, 2006

Posted by: craw

Posted by: syncro

Posted by: craw

Putting in the work is what it's all about. The idea that you can now buy your way out of putting in the work but still want to claim that it's the same activity really bothers me.

That’s your ego talking. 

You have to reconcile why it bothers you how someone gets to the top. It’s the same thing when commuting by ebike or pedal bike, why does it matter? It matters because humans are inherently competitive and someone “beating” you is especially bothersome if you perceive them to be somehow cheating.  

Ride your own ride and if people are being asshats then feel free to call them out for it, otherwise have fun and don’t let someone else’s choice ruin you day.

Indeed. People can do what they like. Shuttling doesn't bother me, nor to chairlifts. But then again those people aren't out proselytizing are they? 

Commuting is different. It has different requirements - get to work quicker, less sweaty. Perfect.

I think it’s fair to say both sides of the coin do ALOT of proselytizing.

May 4, 2019, 12:04 p.m.
Posts: 1624
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: craw

Indeed. People can do what they like. Shuttling doesn't bother me, nor to chairlifts. But then again those people aren't out proselytizing are they? 

Commuting is different. It has different requirements - get to work quicker, less sweaty. Perfect.

Well shuttling has pretty much always been around and there was a time when shuttling was hated on in a similar manner and for similar reasons that ebikers get flack. Chairlifts and a bike park are a different beast tho imo simply because it's a paid activity. On commuting I agree, but I'll admit I love chasing down ebikers and passing them on my commute, especially on some of the hills. I also don't like getting passed by ebikers - or anyone really - but I just try and tell myself let it go. Or I drop a gear and go into chase mode.

I agree tho that the ebike proponents can drone on a bit, especially when it comes to some of the specious claims about being better for fitness than pedal bikes. There is an argument to made for ebikes helping fitness, but it gets way oversold in a bullshit manner too much of the time *cough*Norona*cough*EMBN*cough*

Forum jump: