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ebikes on the Shore

March 31, 2019, 2:24 p.m.
Posts: 84
Joined: March 1, 2017

The lake is, and the Four Lakes trails are (which most people don't ride anyway), but what people refer to as 'Alice Lake' (Rupert, Entrails, the slabs etc) are not part of the Park.

March 31, 2019, 3:01 p.m.
Posts: 463
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

A phenomena that just started happening around me is people who've been off their bike for a while (either due to injury or switching focus to some other activity) justify an ebike because they're out of biking shape. These same people just a few years ago would have gotten back on the bike, toughed out the suck and been better for the struggle back to fitness and competence. Adding a motor definitely gets you back in the game faster but is the result really better? A part of me would feel like an imposter, like yeah, I'm on my bike but I didn't have the sac to get here without a moped. The other part of me is like, this might be better.

March 31, 2019, 8:24 p.m.
Posts: 728
Joined: Aug. 14, 2003

Posted by: craw

A phenomena that just started happening around me is people who've been off their bike for a while (either due to injury or switching focus to some other activity) justify an ebike because they're out of biking shape. These same people just a few years ago would have gotten back on the bike, toughed out the suck and been better for the struggle back to fitness and competence. Adding a motor definitely gets you back in the game faster but is the result really better? A part of me would feel like an imposter, like yeah, I'm on my bike but I didn't have the sac to get here without a moped. The other part of me is like, this might be better.

That's an interesting point. I've heard every type of marketing spam from "ebikes make it waaaaaayyyy easier" to "ebikes give you a way harder workout"....both coming from the same marketer (go figure). However, it is undeniable that ebikes make it easier because a motor is doing up to 80% of the work.

To your point....that's not a great thing at all for the soft rider breaking back in. Riding your way into shape means you have to build yourself up before doing multiple epic laps and hitting the far-out and high elevation stuff. Shoot, might even want to hit the gym a bit, do some spinning, or balance out your training a bit. When you're in shape, your body endures all manner of impacts and physical demands more effectively. If you tackle a big move, or have to take a staunch tumble, or make your way back from a long way out after a big bail, it really helps to be toughened up a little. If you can just waltz up to top of anything, dad-bod-a-flopping (I can't judge:) there's a good chance you're more at risk for a crappy experience. I don't care much about how it may look or how a person thinks of their self, but I really hope none of those welcome-back-soft-bods don't get themselves into a big mess.


 Last edited by: cerealkilla_ on March 31, 2019, 9:25 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
April 1, 2019, 6:17 a.m.
Posts: 39
Joined: Nov. 14, 2017

Lazy and out of shape is not a disability.

April 1, 2019, 6:23 a.m.
Posts: 2058
Joined: April 2, 2005

Posted by: Brocklanders

Posted by: grambo

Posted by: shoreboy

I thought PB was trying to adopt a 'no e-bike content' policy? If it is the same press release that is posted up here, I am not surprised the PB collective went to town on it.

Nope, it's still there: https://www.pinkbike.com/news/yt-enters-the-e-mtb-market-with-decoy.html

What Pinkbike is doing is using geo-locating to not display ebike related content to North American IP's both on the website and their social media feeds. If you direct link or search for that content you can see it from North America but it doens't display on the main page. They are trying to have it both ways because they need the advertising dollars for the Euro crowd where ebikes have already been accepted. I don't blame them from a business perspective but the cognitive dissonance is hilarious.

It appears the Brits have a huge chubby for these things. Which is strange due to the lack of long steep climbs on most of the island.

name one british bikepark with lift access.

the discussion here is quite interesting. so far

driving your gas guzzler up to the parking spot to ride your bike there = good
shuttling with your gas guzzler up the mountain to ride down with your bike = good
riding your e-bike partially powered by electricity up and down the same mountain = bad

why is using one kind of vehicle that destroys the environment to enjoy your sport considered OK but the one that could be powered with renewable energy considered bad (for whom?)


 Last edited by: Sethimus on April 1, 2019, 6:26 a.m., edited 2 times in total.
April 1, 2019, 8:36 a.m.
Posts: 1250
Joined: Feb. 26, 2015

Posted by: Sethimus

Posted by: Brocklanders

Posted by: grambo

Posted by: shoreboy

I thought PB was trying to adopt a 'no e-bike content' policy? If it is the same press release that is posted up here, I am not surprised the PB collective went to town on it.

Nope, it's still there: https://www.pinkbike.com/news/yt-enters-the-e-mtb-market-with-decoy.html

What Pinkbike is doing is using geo-locating to not display ebike related content to North American IP's both on the website and their social media feeds. If you direct link or search for that content you can see it from North America but it doens't display on the main page. They are trying to have it both ways because they need the advertising dollars for the Euro crowd where ebikes have already been accepted. I don't blame them from a business perspective but the cognitive dissonance is hilarious.

It appears the Brits have a huge chubby for these things. Which is strange due to the lack of long steep climbs on most of the island.

name one british bikepark with lift access.

the discussion here is quite interesting. so far

driving your gas guzzler up to the parking spot to ride your bike there = good
shuttling with your gas guzzler up the mountain to ride down with your bike = good
riding your e-bike partially powered by electricity up and down the same mountain = bad

why is using one kind of vehicle that destroys the environment to enjoy your sport considered OK but the one that could be powered with renewable energy considered bad (for whom?)

The Whataboutism is strong in this post.

How about one is cycling, the other is motorsport.

This pic was taken at the outdoor/bikeshow in Vancouver a few weeks ago. Although no pendelec crankset, just add one? Volia!

https://vimeo.com/276882064


 Last edited by: Brocklanders on April 1, 2019, 3:46 p.m., edited 3 times in total.
April 1, 2019, 9:21 a.m.
Posts: 188
Joined: June 28, 2011

That looks awesome. I want one!

April 1, 2019, 1:43 p.m.
Posts: 174
Joined: Jan. 2, 2018

Posted by: Sethimus

Why is using one kind of vehicle that destroys the environment to enjoy your sport considered OK but the one that could be powered with renewable energy considered bad (for whom?)

The difference is the ebike is on the trail. The truck stays in the parking lot. If people were just using ebikes to tow their non motorized bikes to the trailhead your point would be totally valid. I think that is a perfect use for an ebike actually. I am all for ebikes on pathways built for motorized traffic. 

But between this and the fact that most people will still transport their mopeds to the trails via vehicle make this attempt at justification kinda irrelevant.

April 1, 2019, 3:39 p.m.
Posts: 1510
Joined: July 11, 2014

Had an interesting encounter yesterday morning on Seymour at the powerlines resting spot after the Old Buck/BP climb (where you ride down to Severed). I was with a buddy and there were probably 10-12 other random acoustic bikers from several groups resting and happily chatting about the amazing weather and trail conditions and general other acousticy topics. Some fit looking mid 40's dude on an S-Works Turbo Levo ($14,400CAD) comes flying up the last pitch of the climb, rides right through the middle of all the acoustic riders and immediately down the road toward Severed. Did not slow down, lift his head, make eye contact, or even say a friendly hello... No one even had time to say anything or react as the guy was moving too quickly. We all had a good laugh about this, was the guy afraid of being shit talked? Embarrassed? Feeling shame? At least slow down and say hello. If people shit talk you just kill them with kindness. Shouldn't ebike owners be setting an example to other trail users that they are a friendly open group? That's what is expected of mountain bikers with hikers (and what I do every single time, even if I get silence or snark in return). This isn't the first time I've seen this with ebikers, it seriously feels like they are just using the fast climbing ability of the bike to avoid having to interact with people who might criticize them and it doesn't look good.

There was universal dislike for ebikes amongst the 3 or 4 random groups of acoustic bikers which included some older rippers appearing to be in their 50s-60s. Surprising because the ebike marketing material has told me it's not physically possible to ride in your 60's without an ebike! One of the other people in the group mentioned this ebiker had passed them 3 times so far that day in the same manner, fast and with no greeting or warning.

April 1, 2019, 4:19 p.m.
Posts: 196
Joined: April 15, 2017

Posted by: nouseforaname

Posted by: Brocklanders

It appears the Brits have a huge chubby for these things.  Which is strange due to the lack of long steep climbs on most of the island.

It's cause they're lazy bitches.

There's nothing to the UK but drinking, shopping and screwing. Consumer culture with no appreciation for anyone else.

Also - there's very little 'builder driven' trails. Trails are usually either 1: been there for centuries, 2: trail centres where someones being paid to maintain them or 3: someone builds it and abandons it.

Huh, came for an e-bike discussion, left with racial slurs. Did you get bitten by someone from the UK as a kid?

April 1, 2019, 4:33 p.m.
Posts: 857
Joined: June 26, 2012

Posted by: grambo

Had an interesting encounter yesterday morning on Seymour at the powerlines resting spot after the Old Buck/BP climb (where you ride down to Severed). I was with a buddy and there were probably 10-12 other random acoustic bikers from several groups resting and happily chatting about the amazing weather and trail conditions and general other acousticy topics. Some fit looking mid 40's dude on an S-Works Turbo Levo ($14,400CAD) comes flying up the last pitch of the climb, rides right through the middle of all the acoustic riders and immediately down the road toward Severed. Did not slow down, lift his head, make eye contact, or even say a friendly hello... No one even had time to say anything or react as the guy was moving too quickly. We all had a good laugh about this, was the guy afraid of being shit talked? Embarrassed? Feeling shame? At least slow down and say hello. If people shit talk you just kill them with kindness. Shouldn't ebike owners be setting an example to other trail users that they are a friendly open group? That's what is expected of mountain bikers with hikers (and what I do every single time, even if I get silence or snark in return). This isn't the first time I've seen this with ebikers, it seriously feels like they are just using the fast climbing ability of the bike to avoid having to interact with people who might criticize them and it doesn't look good.

There was universal dislike for ebikes amongst the 3 or 4 random groups of acoustic bikers which included some older rippers appearing to be in their 50s-60s. Surprising because the ebike marketing material has told me it's not physically possible to ride in your 60's without an ebike! One of the other people in the group mentioned this ebiker had passed them 3 times so far that day in the same manner, fast and with no greeting or warning.

To be fair, I've seen regular bikers behave like that as well. Sometimes you don't feel like talking to people.

But yeah, being friendly and saying high is good PR. The same goes for mountain bikers interacting with other user groups.


 Last edited by: D_C_ on April 1, 2019, 4:35 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
April 1, 2019, 6:49 p.m.
Posts: 68
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

It's interesting looking at Craw's link to the article on education and cerealkilla_'s comment about meaningful discussion and comparing those to what most people against ebikes are saying. Is there any thought given to the idea that the aggro none-at-all stance is actually going to be more harmful than helpful in the near future? The notion that ebikes are suddenly going to disappear from the landscape is long gone so why ins't there a more concerted effort being put into how the two different user groups will co-exist on the limited range of recreational land available to the two activities? It seems next to impossible to have any sort of meaningful discussion on what should be done when that's exactly what needs to happen, otherwise the glacial pace of government regulation will allow ebikes to potentially take over the landscape. I initially thought that ebikes may represent 1/3 of trail users, but considering human nature and the desire to do things easier and faster maybe that number could be 2/3 of trail users?

What if there was a special tax levied on all mtb's/ebikes/products that directly went to trail org's to pay for trail crews where ebikes paid a higher fee? Is that something that could/should be part of a solution? The landscape is changing frighteningly fast and it seems with the current pace of discussion and solutions on how to handle ebikes they are going to be well established and possibly the dominant player in the marketplace before any sort of meaningful solution comes along. How many of those opposed are writing to not just municipal but provincial officials as well to press the idea that some sort of action needs to happen now?


 Last edited by: syncro on April 1, 2019, 6:56 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
April 1, 2019, 8:05 p.m.
Posts: 861
Joined: March 18, 2017

Posted by: DanL

Huh, came for an e-bike discussion, left with racial slurs. Did you get bitten by someone from the UK as a kid?

Didn’t know having shitty dental health was a racial trait. 

#britlivesmatter

April 1, 2019, 8:06 p.m.
Posts: 861
Joined: March 18, 2017

^Higher fee won’t matter splinky. I buy most of my bike stuff from those Euro-trash online.

April 1, 2019, 8:13 p.m.
Posts: 68
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: Endur-Bro

^Higher fee won’t matter splinky. I buy most of my bike stuff from those Euro-trash online.

I was thinking more for new bikes than parts; plus it's an idea that goes way back as a method to raise funds for trail orgs. I just think it's more dangerous to have no conversation and people yelling that some sort of discussion on practical solutions that could be implemented now. I know a little while back Cooper mentioned new trail signage is coming, maybe that will include directional signage as well?

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