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BC COVID Restrictions

April 21, 2021, 10:35 a.m.
Posts: 1375
Joined: Sept. 30, 2006

Posted by: UFO

Posted by: KenN

And you can still get the virus in your lungs and expel it in droplets as you exhale. Your immune system may be fighting off the virus, but it's still live.

And when an immune person passes on live virus to others, the term is 'shedding'.

This is a good summary, however we need to also consider viral load in addition to viral shedding.

The science continues to evolve all things Covid related. But there does appear to be a similar decrease in infectiousness post vaccination at a similar rate of the efficacy of the vaccine, and this doesn't appear to be surprising to specialists in the field.

Basically say your body coughs up 1000 virus particles per droplet pre vaccination, and post vaccination you can still be a carrier but you are only coughing up 100 virus per droplet. If it takes 500 virus per droplet to get overcome by Covid, even though you're still a carrier post vaccination, your risk of transmission is many times lower.

Of course this is an oversimplification with made up numbers, but it highlights why we've adopted a significantly increased (not necessarily scientifically informed or supported) gap between the 2 doses in light of a shortage in available vaccines, you could view it as a population level harm reduction approach.

^^ This is a good explanation on a overall level. A vaccine would not be effective at all if you were still able to shed the same amount of virus as you did without it. An effective vaccine will drive down the viral load you are able to shed to levels low enough that you should no longer be able to pass an infectious dose onto someone else.

April 21, 2021, 1:16 p.m.
Posts: 147
Joined: Feb. 16, 2013

Posted by: UFO

Posted by: KenN

And you can still get the virus in your lungs and expel it in droplets as you exhale. Your immune system may be fighting off the virus, but it's still live.

And when an immune person passes on live virus to others, the term is 'shedding'.

This is a good summary, however we need to also consider viral load in addition to viral shedding.

The science continues to evolve all things Covid related. But there does appear to be a similar decrease in infectiousness post vaccination at a similar rate of the efficacy of the vaccine, and this doesn't appear to be surprising to specialists in the field.

Basically say your body coughs up 1000 virus particles per droplet pre vaccination, and post vaccination you can still be a carrier but you are only coughing up 100 virus per droplet. If it takes 500 virus per droplet to get overcome by Covid, even though you're still a carrier post vaccination, your risk of transmission is many times lower.

Of course this is an oversimplification with made up numbers, but it highlights why we've adopted a significantly increased (not necessarily scientifically informed or supported) gap between the 2 doses in light of a shortage in available vaccines, you could view it as a population level harm reduction approach.

Very well said.

April 21, 2021, 2:57 p.m.
Posts: 1659
Joined: Aug. 6, 2009

April 21, 2021, 4:13 p.m.
Posts: 1612
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

seems like common sense has prevailed

https://www.citynews1130.com/2021/04/21/vancouver-coastal-fraser-health-travel/

April 21, 2021, 8:23 p.m.
Posts: 397
Joined: Jan. 2, 2018

Posted by: syncro

seems like common sense has prevailed

https://www.citynews1130.com/2021/04/21/vancouver-coastal-fraser-health-travel/

Kinda, except as was mentioned, as long as flights are basically open season it's all bullshit.

April 21, 2021, 8:38 p.m.
Posts: 1612
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Unfortunately flights are a federal responsibility.

April 22, 2021, 8:14 a.m.
Posts: 16677
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

Gods. So many people gathered maskless in large groups along Bridal Path yesterday afternoon.

We have bigger issues than someone crossing a boundary to go build a trail.

April 22, 2021, 9:29 a.m.
Posts: 16677
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-covid-19-travel-farnworth-1.5996811

B.C. Public Safety Minister Mike Farnworth says the Vancouver Coastal and Fraser health regions will be considered a single region where people will be allowed to travel freely from Burnaby to Vancouver, for example, when strict intra-provincial restrictions are finalized later this week.

"In terms of what can be best described as a CounterAttack kind of road block, they absolutely will not be set in places such as Boundary Road or the Fraser," he said. "You will not be seeing anything ... in Vancouver or in Burnaby or the Tri-Cities, for example."

April 22, 2021, 10:33 a.m.
Posts: 1198
Joined: Nov. 21, 2002

Posted by: syncro

seems like common sense has prevailed

https://www.citynews1130.com/2021/04/21/vancouver-coastal-fraser-health-travel/

I would counter that with a DBH quote, though I'm no fan of hers. 

"Just because you can, doesn't mean you should" 

Everyone should do what they feel they need to do within the confines of the rules and orders. Let your own common sense prevail, and park the YOLO for the better times.

Having said that we are in tenuous times right now, this is the Covid we were worried about last Spring when we had very real and open conversations about backing off on high risk riding/activities in anticipation of surges in hospitals, to reduce the potential workload burden on the healthcare system and staff, etc etc.

With the benefit of hindsight, we did over prepare last Spring for a surge that never materialized -- this is not a bad thing from a physical care point of view. But in these current times, we are teetering on the edge, we know the hospitals are a mess, and we have the benefit of looking to Ontario to see where we may be headed in 3-4 weeks' time.

April 22, 2021, 10:50 a.m.
Posts: 14369
Joined: Feb. 19, 2003

Posted by: UFO

With the benefit of hindsight, we did over prepare last Spring for a surge that never materialized -- this is not a bad thing from a physical care point of view. But in these current times, we are teetering on the edge, we know the hospitals are a mess, and we have the benefit of looking to Ontario to see where we may be headed in 3-4 weeks' time.

Did we overprepare last spring?  Or did people largely do the right things which ensured that we flattened the curve?  A challenge with preventative measures is when they work it seems like they were unnecessary.  

Now people are just acting like selfish assholes.

April 22, 2021, 11:45 a.m.
Posts: 13
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Posted by: UFO

Posted by: KenN

And you can still get the virus in your lungs and expel it in droplets as you exhale. Your immune system may be fighting off the virus, but it's still live.

And when an immune person passes on live virus to others, the term is 'shedding'.

This is a good summary, however we need to also consider viral load in addition to viral shedding.

The science continues to evolve all things Covid related. But there does appear to be a similar decrease in infectiousness post vaccination at a similar rate of the efficacy of the vaccine, and this doesn't appear to be surprising to specialists in the field.

Basically say your body coughs up 1000 virus particles per droplet pre vaccination, and post vaccination you can still be a carrier but you are only coughing up 100 virus per droplet. If it takes 500 virus per droplet to get overcome by Covid, even though you're still a carrier post vaccination, your risk of transmission is many times lower.

Of course this is an oversimplification with made up numbers, but it highlights why we've adopted a significantly increased (not necessarily scientifically informed or supported) gap between the 2 doses in light of a shortage in available vaccines, you could view it as a population level harm reduction approach.

Compound that with the metabolic health of most mountain bikers, where the immune system is robust, unlike the average citizen who is tetering on or fallen over the border into obesity, diabetes and metabolic syndrome, high risk viral shedding is unlikely.

April 22, 2021, 12:37 p.m.
Posts: 147
Joined: Feb. 16, 2013

Posted by: Couch_Surfer

Posted by: UFO

With the benefit of hindsight, we did over prepare last Spring for a surge that never materialized -- this is not a bad thing from a physical care point of view. But in these current times, we are teetering on the edge, we know the hospitals are a mess, and we have the benefit of looking to Ontario to see where we may be headed in 3-4 weeks' time.

Did we overprepare last spring?  Or did people largely do the right things which ensured that we flattened the curve?  A challenge with preventative measures is when they work it seems like they were unnecessary.  

Now people are just acting like selfish assholes.

One of the factors we're dealing with, that we weren't last year, is the variants. They're more easily transmitted, so they're more difficult to guard against. 60% of the current cases in BC involve variants, so sure, some of the increase is due to behavioral changes since last year, but there's more to it.

April 22, 2021, 1:23 p.m.
Posts: 16677
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

Posted by: knnn

Compound that with the metabolic health of most mountain bikers, where the immune system is robust, unlike the average citizen who is tetering on or fallen over the border into obesity, diabetes and metabolic syndrome, high risk viral shedding is unlikely.

I wouldn't count on that, though. Bear in mind that there are a lot of fairly fit people with underlying issues. For example, asthma, which has been linked to poor COVID outcomes. People can be very fit but still have asthma.

April 22, 2021, 3:15 p.m.
Posts: 391
Joined: Aug. 10, 2012

Posted by: shoreboy

What does 'take into account' mean? Some of the vaccines have been shown to be equally as effective against variants, others less so. Again, the science is still evolving on this subject.

To paraphrase (with irony) a certain Trekker... "Dammit Jim, I'm a mountain biker, not a doctor"...it means exactly how it reads...that there are (and will be more) variants for which the current vaccines were not considered.


 Last edited by: mudrunner on April 22, 2021, 3:26 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Dangling participles
April 22, 2021, 8:20 p.m.
Posts: 1198
Joined: Nov. 21, 2002

Posted by: Couch_Surfer

Did we overprepare last spring?  Or did people largely do the right things which ensured that we flattened the curve?  A challenge with preventative measures is when they work it seems like they were unnecessary.  

Now people are just acting like selfish assholes.

100% 'we' over reacted / over responded.  But with what little we knew at the time, it was justified. 

The upcoming postponement of non-emergency surgeries announced today was done last Spring without basically a 2nd thought. Schools were shut down which led to basically every restaurant / business was shut down or operating at significantly reduced capacity. The entire world more or less entirely shut down simultaneously for a stretch of 6-8 weeks, which is the biggest explanation to me that Covid cannot be a global conspiracy -- that the whole world can coordinate this to this degree, give me a break.

And people were genuinely scared, which speaks to more people on board to do the 'right things' as opposed to seeking out loopholes amd technicalities to justify their actions.

And as mentioned above the variants we are dealing with now are more infectious and contagious than the og Covid, and combine that with the fact that we have roughly 10x the caseload of last Spring. The cherry on top is people are just rightfully fatigued, 18 months into this ordeal.

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