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2014 NSMBA Toonie - Feedback

Sept. 11, 2014, 4:17 p.m.
Posts: 8935
Joined: Dec. 23, 2005

Okay folks, hit me with how you felt things went this year?

Changes you want to see? How can it make it better?

Why did we have a lower turnout after the first few?

Cram more of them in early season? Or keep them spread out?

I've got ideas on a big change for next year, but want to hear feedback before I toss it out discussion.

Sept. 11, 2014, 6:13 p.m.
Posts: 481
Joined: May 8, 2010

after parties were all amazing

trail selection seemed to start out easy then get harder, which probably effected numbers. my own personal feelings aside, not many people want to race pipeline…. or ladies for that matter. at the same time, trying to have varied courses every time, you're going to end up racing those, so there's really no choice on that. There's only so many trails on Fromme. Maybe do a XC course in the LSCR to change it up? Circuit8/JT stage and RJ stage? And then the Seymour days too.

maybe spread them out more? mid weeks during the summer, some weekend ones in the fall and spring?

there was definitely progression this year, there was a lot of improvement.

Sept. 12, 2014, 9:06 a.m.
Posts: 838
Joined: June 26, 2012

I agree, the afterparties were awesome. Some sponsors really stepped it up (i.e. provided beer), and the fun increased accordingly.

You guys, the organizers, also seemed a lot more relaxed than the previous year. I'd imagine you're getting things dialled and that's nice to see.

I think once summer rolls around, people start going away or get busy with the race season, which is probably why attendance drops. The spring races serve as a tune-up following the winter which could explain their popularity. But it seems a lot of the best of the racers stop coming as the summer goes on. One possible option is to keep the spring dates, take a break in the summer and resume in the fall. I'd bet races right now would be quite popular since the calendar is pretty quiet (though you're fighting daylight). Maybe consider weekend mornings when the days are shorter.

I also thought having the races every 2 weeks was better, though I was bummed when I had to miss one knowing it would be a full month between races for me.

The courses were great, but the Stairs to Despair BP stage could be used more sparingly (though I could rip it with my eyes closed now having raced it so often). I think some people were scared off by some of the harder stages (like Ladies), but it is fun to have the opportunity to race those. I'd also like to see more longer stages, like a full 7th-Leppard-Crinkum-Kirkford-Griffin to go along with Ex-Dreamweaver. Also, the Seymour dates were fun and more races there would be great, maybe split evenly with Fromme (which would help with avoiding Stairs to Despair).

Overall, I had a great time this season and apprecated all the hard work. I'm looking forward to next year.

Sept. 12, 2014, 9:31 a.m.
Posts: 628
Joined: March 25, 2011

Longer top to bottom stages on occasion would be fun, as well as don't be afraid to have a little finish straight uphill kick on the road. Planing longer stages could open up different trail combinations, especially on the DW side, and especially especially when the new climb trail is finished!

Alternate endings, in fact on some days complete surprise endings, with finishes announced at sign up. The oil can stage this year was a great example, and added a nice twist.

I say keep it Shore. The trails can be awkward and weird at times, so why not the stages. Maybe we need to pull back from all out balls out World Cup sprints.

If allowed, more trail options on Seymour. Example of longer stage with good variety there: Foerever After into (all of)High School

Sept. 12, 2014, 9:33 a.m.
Posts: 141
Joined: July 31, 2009

I'd like to see more average rides show up so I don't seem so slow ;)

Maybe mix it up a bit and throw 1 or 2 XC/All Mountain single stage loops in there.

Sponsors did a good job this year with the after parties. The ones at their offices/stores with beer were awesome!

Sept. 12, 2014, 11:49 a.m.
Posts: 8935
Joined: Dec. 23, 2005

Good info guy.

Yes Ladies has been the lowest turnout two years running and I've heard that many people skip specifically because of that trail. So sadly it will get the axe (omg dumming down the Toonies).

Next year I want to shake up the trail choices and combinations. Having the apres off the mountain helps open that up as not needing to route riders back to the Water Towers can remove that BP/Stairs of Despair section.

I'd love to run them in September but day light is tough. Sun sets Sept 1st at 7:55pm.

Sept. 12, 2014, 1:08 p.m.
Posts: 481
Joined: May 8, 2010

a different ending would be good, as far as getting rid of stairs of dispair. you just need the volley at the end of the last stage to collect all the timing chips.

Sept. 12, 2014, 1:36 p.m.
Posts: 8935
Joined: Dec. 23, 2005

On the final one this season that is what we did.

So that big change I want to make next year………$5 per night. Option to pre-reg for them all and save $5 or $10.

Would need a new name, can't be the Toonie's when we're charging a fiver.

If enough sponsors aim for ten events. We had six the first year, and eight this year.

I want to see them generate some real money to give back to the trails on top of being a great social night. It's a big jump more than double the entry fee but if they can pull in 4-5K over the course of the series that goes towards a lot of paid dedicated trail work.

Sept. 12, 2014, 2:12 p.m.
Posts: 481
Joined: May 8, 2010

FVMBA did it no problem a few years ago, went from like $10 for 4 races to like $30 (pre-reg), and their numbers still increased.

If your event is good it doesn't matter. And when a lot of races cost $60+ and are run in a similar way people will see the value.

Sept. 12, 2014, 2:36 p.m.
Posts: 133
Joined: Nov. 19, 2002

On the final one this season that is what we did.

So that big change I want to make next year………$5 per night. Option to pre-reg for them all and save $5 or $10.

Would need a new name, can't be the Toonie's when we're charging a fiver.

If enough sponsors aim for ten events. We had six the first year, and eight this year.

I want to see them generate some real money to give back to the trails on top of being a great social night. It's a big jump more than double the entry fee but if they can pull in 4-5K over the course of the series that goes towards a lot of paid dedicated trail work.

WORCA's AGM is next week, I've already lobbied for an increase in our thursday events and will continue to make that argument. $2 is barely covering costs and we aren't raising nearly enough for the trails program right now. You should definitely go for 5, because that's even really cheap for what we get.

Sept. 12, 2014, 2:38 p.m.
Posts: 4834
Joined: Nov. 25, 2002

yep. $50 for 10 kickass events is a bargain.

Sept. 12, 2014, 2:49 p.m.
Posts: 838
Joined: June 26, 2012

The price increase is definitely reasonable, but I think it would be good to very clearly and repeatedly advertise what the fees are funding. I know I feel better paying race fees when I know proceeds are going toward the trails. Just make sure that is clear to people.

Sept. 12, 2014, 2:49 p.m.
Posts: 17760
Joined: Oct. 28, 2003

Don't burn out yourself and vollies with too many events. 8-10 traildays/year run by only a few vollies was too much back in the day. If you've got a sustainable plan for the vollies, go for more events.

Sept. 12, 2014, 3:04 p.m.
Posts: 8935
Joined: Dec. 23, 2005

Don't burn out yourself and vollies with too many events. 8-10 traildays/year run by only a few vollies was too much back in the day. If you've got a sustainable plan for the vollies, go for more events.

I got a plan for that also. :)

Sept. 12, 2014, 3:06 p.m.
Posts: 10077
Joined: Nov. 19, 2002

From a volunteer perspective, when you are setting up a schedule avoid having races in the week prior to a long weekend.
Like most bikers we do road trips on long weekends so the evenings that week are taken up with road trip prep.
I know Ina [HTML_REMOVED] I missed volunteering at a couple of races because of that.
Might be the same issue with the racers too.

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