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pending teachers strike, BCTF and the gov't

May 23, 2014, 1:29 p.m.
Posts: 1767
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

surprised not to see a thread on this yet, any opinions on the current situation? thoughts on whether the education system is doing a good job or could be improved? is there equal blame to go around for all parties? do the teachers get a good enough compensation package as it is for the work they do and how many hours they put in?

previous related/relavent threads:

bb.nsmb.com/showthread.php?t=147425

bb.nsmb.com/showthread.php?t=138461

i think teachers total compensation package is pretty fair on the upper end, not so starting off. but i also think there should be more of a graduated system between teacher training to being in the classroom. i also think there should be greater accountability for teachers and the work they do; ie if they're not doing a good job they should be subject to potential job discipline or even dismissal. there's lots of blame to go around, but who carries the greater burden of the disfunction that does exist? the gov't? the union - bctf? teachers themselves?

Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity ~ Seneca

May 23, 2014, 1:33 p.m.
Posts: 642
Joined: June 8, 2005

It's those damn kids fault. Who else could be to blame.

Oh wait, we are doing this for the kids, I forgot.

May 23, 2014, 1:56 p.m.
Posts: 3564
Joined: May 23, 2006

This is entirely of the govt.'s own making for starving the system and giving themselves raises.

Teachers are not over compensated and spend a lot of un-paid time doing preparation up to and including spending their own $ for teaching supplies.

Freedom of contract. We sell them guns that kill them; they sell us drugs that kill us.

May 23, 2014, 1:59 p.m.
Posts: 11913
Joined: June 4, 2008

A lot of teachers should be fired.

Some teachers should be making $150,000+ a year.

May 23, 2014, 1:59 p.m.
Posts: 712
Joined: Aug. 10, 2010

I think christy got thatcher s biography for Xmas and the bctf are her num.

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Shredding hypothetical gnarr

May 23, 2014, 2:08 p.m.
Posts: 0
Joined: May 28, 2009

All I seem to hear is the teachers saying they want smaller class sizes and more support for special needs. Then it always boils down to they want a pay raise. The two statements don't equate for me.

The part I'd really like to understand is how the school districts are managed (or not). Seems some school districts do OK and others suffer. Is it due to changes in the number of kids per district? Is funding based on that and that alone?

In the end, both sides act like school yard bullies and regardless of anything they say, neither party is putting the kids' needs first.

May 23, 2014, 2:18 p.m.
Posts: 1767
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

All I seem to hear is the teachers saying they want smaller class sizes and more support for special needs. Then it always boils down to they want a pay raise. The two statements don't equate for me.

The part I'd really like to understand is how the school districts are managed (or not). Seems some school districts do OK and others suffer. Is it due to changes in the number of kids per district? Is funding based on that and that alone?

In the end, both sides act like school yard bullies and regardless of anything they say, neither party is putting the kids' needs first.

i wonder what would happen if the gov't said:

ok, we have more money for you, but not enough to give you everything you want so you have to make a choice. either smaller class sizes and more support or an increase in wages. you get one or the other. just decide what you want and let us know.

Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity ~ Seneca

May 23, 2014, 2:23 p.m.
Posts: 0
Joined: Oct. 9, 2009

The BCTF loves to say they're fighting for the kids. But lets get real, they are fighting for themselves. Teacher contracts shouldn't be where class sizes and other things are decided IMO.

From what I've seen of younger people trying to get into the job the system kind of sucks. It could easily be improved. There's also absolutely no shortage of entry level applicants for these jobs, so why should wages be improved across the board?

May 23, 2014, 2:30 p.m.
Posts: 16697
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

Gee whiz. Two decades of ever-increasing tax cuts, and we're surprised that we can't fund the things most important to us. Health care, education and senior's care.

Go figure.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity.

When many people suffer from a delusion, it is called religion.

May 23, 2014, 2:32 p.m.
Posts: 642
Joined: June 8, 2005

This is entirely of the govt.'s own making for starving the system and giving themselves raises.

Teachers are not over compensated and spend a lot of un-paid time doing preparation up to and including spending their own $ for teaching supplies.

Some of this is quite true. As a parent I see the number of times kids come home with request for $$$ for supplies or field trips or what ever.

I also see the ever increasing number of days off; Christmas break is now 3 weeks, Easter break 2 weeks, a number of long weekends are now 4 days from 3 … This is the response to continue to fund the education system with the same or less money year over year as salaries and other line items in operation of schools increase.

That said I do know a number of teachers that have 15+ years in teaching and make close to what I make, but have way more time off and will look forward to a pretty damn good pension. This is much better than most folks working in private enterprise. Not saying teachers don't deserve it or more, just a comparison. Perhaps most workers in all other sectors should have much better benefits and have twice as much time off as well. Works for me.

NOTE: The comment on salaries increasing is not to state that teachers are getting vast increases in their salary, but to simply state costs to operate the schools are increasing. As we see our power, gas and property taxes increase year over year by 5 to 10+% and wages going up by 1-2% at best for most sectors it appears to be a losing battle for most.

The only ones getting the gravy raises are bank execs and CEOs of large companies. I can just see the justification of the CEO. I had to wait until noon of the first workday before I made what most of my employees make for the whole year. I should make what my employees make before my coffee break.:nono:

May 23, 2014, 2:47 p.m.
Posts: 0
Joined: Nov. 21, 2002

i also think there should be greater accountability for teachers and the work they do; ie if they're not doing a good job they should be subject to potential job discipline or even dismissal.

A good idea, but very difficult to implement properly. Teaching is a lot more than students' letter grades and standardized test results, so how do we create effective and fair job performance standards?

May 23, 2014, 3:07 p.m.
Posts: 16697
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

Yes, and it's already be tried and failed in the US. Standardized testing as a way to evaluate both teachers and students results in "teaching to the test". That is, the teaching focuses only on passing the test to the exclusion of everything else. And since we all know that life has many more important things than a few questions on a grade school test, everybody loses in the end.

When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity.

When many people suffer from a delusion, it is called religion.

May 23, 2014, 3:11 p.m.
Posts: 7594
Joined: July 25, 2007

Yes, and it's already be* tried and failed in the US. Standardized testing as a way to evaluate both teachers and students results in "teaching to the test". That is, the teaching focuses only on passing the test to the exclusion of everything else. And since we all know that life has many more important things than a few questions on a grade school test, everybody loses in the end.

been*

May 23, 2014, 3:25 p.m.
Posts: 16697
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

been*

When one person suffers from a delusion, it is called insanity.

When many people suffer from a delusion, it is called religion.

May 23, 2014, 3:33 p.m.
Posts: 11508
Joined: June 29, 2006

been*

Oh snap. That shit is going to bug him all night. Tossing and turning "how could I be so cavalier?"

The teaching debate has been done to death but I think it is grid lock in all directions and blowing it all up somehow is the only way out.

The BCTF is too powerful and like many unions caters to the lowest common denominator. I know that many teachers would love to see the slackers disappear, but the union doesn't fight for them.

The government (and those that support them) have no interest in raising taxes to pay for what is needed, they just want to starve the beast so the school boards have nothing to work with.

The process for hiring administrators seems to have no basis is finding out how well any of the applicants are at management. "Oh, you taught science for 20 years? Cool, run this high school."

BCTF doesn't seem to have either the backbone or the funds to make sure the accredited programs are actually training good quality teachers. When my wife was in the program at SFU the passing rate was pretty much 100% and she knows people that passed that barely spoke English. They spent absolutely no time learning the latest science in teaching. It was a joke.

And the parents take very little responsibility for the little bastards that ruin the experience for the rest of the kids.

Nuke it all.

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