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NON-12 step (religion based) addiction programs in B.C.??

Sept. 14, 2010, 6:27 a.m.
Posts: 1092
Joined: Aug. 8, 2008

take your bro on a tour of the dtes last wednesday of the month.

He's been there…

He knows the concequences of his actions and where it will get him. We have spoke recently of one Uncle who is an addict that is in jail for a number of offences realted to drugs… and another that almost died in a holding cell from a siezure from alcohol withdrawal… and eventually died in a back ally.

He's not denying he has a problem and knows the consequences….at least that what he says after a year of talking it through with him. The issue is finding a program/treatment center to help him that doesn't contain any type of religion. As has been mentioned, perhaps the religion thing is his cop-out. The fact his wife (who has always been sober) says that she has sat in on these meetings and confirmed that it ends up in religion is what was concerning to me…perhaps they have just found the wrong 12-step based programs. They are in a small town currently so their options are limited. That is one reason why we are looking B.C. wide for a program….cost is not an issue…

Sept. 14, 2010, 7:06 a.m.
Posts: 14564
Joined: Dec. 16, 2003

I'm going to give you a harsh reality here and I'm not doing it to be a dick. For what it's worth I lived this so I know all about the excuses, I made them for years.

If he is truly at a point where he wants to quit, he will quit and these issues with the meetings won't matter. His wife sitting in on these meetings aren't helping. She becomes an enabler, helping him out with the excuses. In fact she's likely been an enabler throughout his addiction. He needs to man up and quit, using whatever means necessary, and if that means listening to a little god talk, so be it, suck it up. If he's not willing to do it, he doesn't want to quit that bad. Most addiction programs also have resources for the families of people with addictions. There's Al-Anon and places like Edgewood offer a 6 day program called Insite. I took the Insite program after being sober for 2 years, I can honestly say it's a big reason I'm still sober 17 years later.

You're going to find that being sympathetic and supporting your brother is only going to take you so far, in the end it becomes another enabling factor. At some point you're going to have to give him some tough love, kick him in the ass and tell him to make a choice. Honestly, that could be the rock bottom that he needs, when his family says "we're done"

If he can't stand the meetings, then just quit cold turkey. If he can't do that then go to the meetings. If he can't do either, then he's made the choice that his addiction is more important than his life and family. There's only one end result of that choice and it's not good.

that's all I have from the nsmb life choices forum

Sept. 14, 2010, 7:56 a.m.
Posts: 0
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

Check out Pacifica, It's a 30 day progrma and it is not 12 step based. They do make you go to AA meetings and stuff but they dont force the steps on you or make you learn them. I went there in 2008 and it was the best thing I have ever done for myself.

Sept. 14, 2010, 8:32 a.m.
Posts: 1584
Joined: June 20, 2003

If money is not an object, I highly suggest that you and his wife go to Insite at Edgewood. You will learn a lot and will become a better support for your brother. You may learn that what you think is helping, really isn't. It will also help you deal with your own issues and the effect that his addiction has on you.

For what its worth, I've been exactly where you are as a sibling to an addict. Best wishes to the whole family.

Sept. 14, 2010, 8:36 a.m.
Posts: 814
Joined: Feb. 4, 2005

You're going to find that being sympathetic and supporting your brother is only going to take you so far, in the end it becomes another enabling factor. At some point you're going to have to give him some tough love, kick him in the ass and tell him to make a choice. Honestly, that could be the rock bottom that he needs, when his family says "we're done"

If he can't stand the meetings, then just quit cold turkey. If he can't do that then go to the meetings. If he can't do either, then he's made the choice that his addiction is more important than his life and family. There's only one end result of that choice and it's not good.

that's all I have from the nsmb life choices forum

Listen to Dave. He just gave you all the information you need. It took my family to walk away from me to make me get help.

The 'higher power' thing is a way to help a lot of addicts draw on something other then themselves to get through the tough times. Addicts have low self esteem and very little faith in their own ability to recover, this 'higher power' allows the separation needed.

hol-ee shit but that's a big hole :eek:

Sept. 14, 2010, 9:45 a.m.
Posts: 13934
Joined: March 15, 2003

davem steps up to the plate - well said my man. i did a few years of AA meetings with one of my bosses. my condition for working with him was that i had to stay sober as he was 17 years dry and still going to meetings. our group never brought god talk into the discussions.

Sept. 14, 2010, 10:06 a.m.
Posts: 11502
Joined: June 29, 2006

http://www.wired.com/magazine/2010/06/ff_alcoholics_anonymous/

I read this article a little while back in Wired and it is a pretty solid read if you want to look deeper into AA. Even AA's success rate is only 30% because in the end, the addict has to really want to make a change. I have a few friends that went to AA with some success including a few that have been sober over 10 years and counting. Oddly the ones that never drank again still smoke weed on a regular basis.

Sept. 14, 2010, 11:36 a.m.
Posts: 43
Joined: Aug. 6, 2004

Dave is right on the money with every post in this thread.

He will quit only when he has backed himself into a corner with no where to go because of his addictions.

His wife is enabling and needs to step up and lay down the ultimatum and then follow through if he breaks the rules.

Only when he really wants to quit the booze / drugs will he seek real help and not just provide lip service [HTML_REMOVED] excuses.

Its how it worked with me.

Sept. 14, 2010, 12:01 p.m.
Posts: 26382
Joined: Aug. 14, 2005

I'm going to give you a harsh reality here and I'm not doing it to be a dick. For what it's worth I lived this so I know all about the excuses, I made them for years.

If he is truly at a point where he wants to quit, he will quit and these issues with the meetings won't matter. His wife sitting in on these meetings aren't helping. She becomes an enabler, helping him out with the excuses. In fact she's likely been an enabler throughout his addiction. He needs to man up and quit, using whatever means necessary, and if that means listening to a little god talk, so be it, suck it up. If he's not willing to do it, he doesn't want to quit that bad. Most addiction programs also have resources for the families of people with addictions. There's Al-Anon and places like Edgewood offer a 6 day program called Insite. I took the Insite program after being sober for 2 years, I can honestly say it's a big reason I'm still sober 17 years later.

You're going to find that being sympathetic and supporting your brother is only going to take you so far, in the end it becomes another enabling factor. At some point you're going to have to give him some tough love, kick him in the ass and tell him to make a choice. Honestly, that could be the rock bottom that he needs, when his family says "we're done"

If he can't stand the meetings, then just quit cold turkey. If he can't do that then go to the meetings. If he can't do either, then he's made the choice that his addiction is more important than his life and family. There's only one end result of that choice and it's not good.

that's all I have from the nsmb life choices forum

^^This.

I know of a few people who are former addicts who didn't as much do the 12 steps as replace the activity. 2 people I knew in Toronto run Ultra's now- for them it's either exercise or the drugs. They prefer the exercise.

www.thisiswhy.co.uk

www.teamnfi.blogspot.com/

Sept. 14, 2010, 12:12 p.m.
Posts: 7306
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

i think most good rehab centers, although recommending exercise, do not allow vigorous exercise as it just replaces one addiction with another.One could certainly argue that it is ultimately a better addiction….but still a addiction(i'm sure it's a little more complex then that)

Sept. 14, 2010, 12:18 p.m.
Posts: 2
Joined: March 12, 2009

I have 2 nephews that went to rehab, one in the sunshine coast and one in cranbrook. NOT cheap places and AA is part of it. I second what Dave said about the higher power thing being an excuse and I have 2 friends relapses in to very serious addiction to back it up. They were clean for about a year and a half and stopped going to AA and NA because they decided that they didn't like the religious aspect and they didn't like being told that they have a lifelong disease (they decided they have a problem, but that some 'former' users can handle having just one glass of wine or one beer). Well, within a couple months of deciding that, rent money was going to booze and drugs. You gotta call bullshit on that kind of talk. If he wants to quit he will, if he doesn't he won't.

My nephews are still clean. I'll try to find the names of those rehab centers for you. Working out was a big part of their recovery at both centers, so it's good that he's into that kind of thing.

Sept. 14, 2010, 12:22 p.m.
Posts: 2
Joined: March 12, 2009

Ok, the Cranbrook one is Top of the World Ranch and the other one was the Sunshine Coast Health Center. The nephew with the worst problem went to the sunshine coast. I thing it might have been more intensive, but I can't be sure.

Sept. 14, 2010, 12:25 p.m.
Posts: 6024
Joined: Dec. 17, 2002

check out daytox. that's the program we use at work if any employees have problems. non religious and they use the s.m.a.r.t program. apparently smart has a higher success rate then any 12 step program. anyway daytox is a 6 week out-patient program and the people that attend it still come to work everyday so no time is lost without having an income
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Sept. 14, 2010, 12:27 p.m.
Posts: 7306
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

interesting, at edgewood, no running or weightlifting, daily walks mandatory

Sept. 14, 2010, 12:32 p.m.
Posts: 2
Joined: March 12, 2009

My friends that relapsed started with daytox.. I'm very skeptical in out patient programs if someone will be experiencing withdrawal.

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