No More Cheap Hydro?

The bottom line is that we are one of the worst polluters/ users of water and power in the World. We relish in this glory that we are so "Super Natural" and yet we are not.

There are ways to reduce consumption so that say that the rate increase does come… it won't be as much of a burn.

Ride your bike more and drive less!

per capita canadians are the worst energy and resource consumers and waste producers in the world. we should all be ashamed.

Those are positive ideas and worth doing. But the problem is now we have a govt more interested in its friends in the private sector then the public. If they stay that course other things will cost more which won't be so easily remedied by a green slogan.

It's hard to say, since that article didn't provide any real hard numbers that I could see (I admit to skimming though, so feel free to decimate my argument by quoting something I missed).

Could it be possible that a higher initial rate was offered, however the rate of growth is under what the anticipate national average is, so that at the end of the term we're paying under the average yearly rate?

sure, a real hippie couldn't go through all that effort…I mean they feed hippies
I wonder what Boykake thinks

sad as it is there are fewer hippies and more gangsters in the biz than 15 yrs ago. on that note anybody got hooks here on the ssc?it takes me 7 days to score a $50 sack. and Im not happy.

per capita canadians are the worst energy and resource consumers and waste producers in the world. we should all be ashamed.

Iceland beat Canada (in 2001 at least). But, for developed countries a lot of it is weather related. So comparing Canada (7,999.5) to say Sweden (5,762.3), it doesn't look so good. As far as Vancouver goes, we should be closer to Italy (2,990.2) than Sweden *edit: [source

](http://earthtrends.wri.org) Country
Albania ALB 549.3
Armenia ARM 743.8
Australia AUS 5,974.9
Austria AUT 3,789.9
Azerbaijan AZE 1,408.0
Belarus BLR 2,444.9
Belgium BEL 5,743.3
Bosnia and Herzegovina BIH 1,071.8
Bulgaria BGR 2,424.5
Canada CAN 7,999.5
Croatia HRV 1,778.2
Czech Rep CZE 4,035.9
Denmark DNK 3,706.1
Estonia EST 3,471.5
Finland FIN 6,517.9
France FRA 4,458.6
Georgia GEO 461.9
Germany DEU 4,263.5
Gibraltar GIB 6,148.1
Greece GRC 2,622.1
Hungary HUN 2,542.1
Iceland ISL 11,800.0
Ireland IRL 3,876.1
Israel ISR 3,432.6
Italy ITA 2,990.2
Japan JPN 4,091.5
Kazakhstan KAZ 2,596.0
Kyrgyzstan KGZ 447.4
Latvia LVA 1,827.7
Lithuania LTU 2,302.8
Luxembourg LUX 8,693.9
Macedonia, FYR MKD 1,281.6
Malta MLT 1,887.5
Moldova, Rep MDA 734.3
Netherlands NLD 4,831.3
New Zealand NZL 4,795.3
Norway NOR 5,920.6
Poland POL 2,343.3
Portugal PRT 2,465.1
Romania ROU 1,642.0
Russian Federation RUS 4,288.8
Serbia and Montenegro YUG 1,523.1
Slovakia SVK 3,470.0
Slovenia SVN 3,439.6
South Africa ZAF 2,425.7
Spain ESP 3,116.4
Sweden SWE 5,762.3
Switzerland CHE 3,906.2
Tajikistan TJK 494.1
Turkmenistan TKM 3,243.4
Ukraine UKR 2,872.3
United Kingdom GBR 3,993.8
United States USA 7,920.9
Uzbekistan UZB 2,000.9

per capita canadians are the worst energy and resource consumers and waste producers in the world. we should all be ashamed.

:lol: when this is coming from people with 7800, 7500, 4500, 1300, 3800, 1100 posts. Turn off your goddam computers sometime, that might save a bit of power! oh and get a life.

Some stuff from the other side to think about: BC has a huge power deficit. We are a net importer of electricity, and have been for years (this really suprised me). The public won't stand for more gas-fired plants being built (Nanaimo), and it's no longer acceptable to flood hundreds of acres for dams and hydro-electric powerplants. So we have a problem:

- electricity generation staying constant
- demand rising dramatically

One of the ways to meet our energy needs is smaller generation facilities with lower environmental impacts. Run-of-river and micro-hydro plants could HELP offset some of the demand we're seeing. BC Hydro just isn't suited to managing this style of generation.

Soooooooo the government provides incentives for private businesses to do this. One of these incentives is buying the power at HIGHER than market rates to get the infrastructure in place. Right now there is little to no money in power generation. Nobody wants to invest their money for so little return. So what happens if nothing gets built? 20 years from now we're totally screwed because we're totally reliant on Washington or Alberta energy imports.

I'm not saying the article is wrong, but you can spin a story many different ways.

- We are buying power from 3rd (commercial) parties in order to make up the difference and make sure everyone's drilldo's remain charged

Isn't that what batteries and a good Genny is for?

:lol: when this is coming from people with 7800, 7500, 4500, 1300, 3800, 1100 posts. Turn off your goddam computers sometime, that might save a bit of power! oh and get a life.

tough talk for a milkman. the thought of saving power curdle your cream?

:lol: when this is coming from people with 7800, 7500, 4500, 1300, 3800, 1100 posts. Turn off your goddam computers sometime, that might save a bit of power! oh and get a life.

sigh

from where i sit my life is actually pretty good. i can only hope the same for you my angst riddled friend.

ok, does everyone of shranky's multiple personalities have to have an account.
:lol:

play nice disco skranky has been a good boy lately and has had positive impact in the last posts i have seen from him. he is adding to the convo of this thread unlike you and I.

Some stuff from the other side to think about: BC has a huge power deficit. We are a net importer of electricity, and have been for years (this really suprised me). The public won't stand for more gas-fired plants being built (Nanaimo), and it's no longer acceptable to flood hundreds of acres for dams and hydro-electric powerplants. So we have a problem:

- electricity generation staying constant
- demand rising dramatically

One of the ways to meet our energy needs is smaller generation facilities with lower environmental impacts. Run-of-river and micro-hydro plants could HELP offset some of the demand we're seeing. BC Hydro just isn't suited to managing this style of generation.

Soooooooo the government provides incentives for private businesses to do this. One of these incentives is buying the power at HIGHER than market rates to get the infrastructure in place. Right now there is little to no money in power generation. Nobody wants to invest their money for so little return. So what happens if nothing gets built? 20 years from now we're totally screwed because we're totally reliant on Washington or Alberta energy imports.

I'm not saying the article is wrong, but you can spin a story many different ways.

A few things to consider.

You state that BC has a huge power deficit? Interesting considering BC Hydros own website shows that their installed Generation is 11.3 Gigawatts and that the peak one hour demand last year was 9.6 Gigawatts.

Yes BC is a net importer of power. But what the news fails to mention is why. In BC our electricity is basically all from Hydro dams. Our neighbours generate most of theirs from Thermal plants. Why is this important?
Well the beauty of Hydro is you can shut it off and store the saved energy in the form of water behind a dam.
A Thermal unit can not be shut down during low load periods and started back up the next morning. So what this allows BC to do is to shut off the Hydro generators at night and import power when the market price is cheap, thus allowing us to save the water behind the dams. The next day when the peak hits and the market prices are high, that water can be used to make power that can be sold back to our neighbours at a higher rate, thus making us $$$$$.

You state that BC Hydro is not suited to manage this style of Generation. I fail to see how a company that built facilities of all different shapes and sizes all over the province is not capable of building and managing some small Run of the River plants. In fact if you look at BC Hydro's website it looks like they already have some small plants that they seem to be managing ok.

One thing I do agree with you on is that we need to conserve power and that new Generation must be built. Demand is going up and we need to stay on top of it. What I don't see is why we are giving sweet heart deals to there companies when we have cheaper alternatives available.

sure, a real hippie couldn't go through all that effort…I mean they feed hippies
I wonder what Boykake thinks

well here's the thing, I've never met a grower who stole power, it is often uneccessary to steal power. Most growers simply use as much hydro as they want and pay the large bills every two months(they have the money snce they're growing)and nothing really happens because bc hydro is making money and won't point the finger if they can avoid it.

The only challenges facing growers today is making your op so discreet you don't have to deal with a home invasion during harvest, this the growers primary concern

having said that many hippies are excellent growers and actually do posess the ability to do physical work and grow ops make good consumers out of people who would otherwise be making minimum wage or on welfare.

I'll bet gw and gooch have sold properties purchased for the purpose of growing. There are thousands of them a couple hour drive from the city.

as for the topic of bc hydro's new policy's I agree with shrank

well here's the thing, I've never met a grower who stole power, it is often uneccessary to steal power. Most growers simply use as much hydro as they want and pay the large bills every two months(they have the money snce they're growing)and nothing really happens because bc hydro is making money and won't point the finger if they can avoid it.

The only challenges facing growers today is making your op so discreet you don't have to deal with a home invasion during harvest, this the growers primary concern

having said that many hippies are excellent growers and actually do posess the ability to do physical work and grow ops make good consumers out of people who would otherwise be making minimum wage or on welfare.

I'll bet gw and gooch have sold properties purchased for the purpose of growing. There are thousands of them a couple hour drive from the city.

as for the topic of bc hydro's new policy's I agree with shrank

Bet there will be a alot of Grow op positions after 2010 as a whole bunch will be able to retire and live in a manner they can quickly become accustomed to.