How much do you know about the history of Indigenous people under Canadian rule?

**Posted by: chupacabra

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**

But the process is entirely based on what people want. It would not even be happening without Indigenous people fighting for what they believe in, the courts are just the system they are using to achieve it as they have been ignored by governments for centuries. You may think I'm naive here, but I don't get why you're so hung up on the guest/settler thing. Also, how/why are you so certain that Indigenous people won't share the land if/when they win in court?  The reason I keep bringing up the importance of land is that Indigenous people do not look at the land like a resource to be exploited or something that is owned in the same way that Euro-Western society does. I like your part about conciliation, but that includes understanding Indigenous culture. That's why I keep returning to the point of how Indigenous people view the land. Saying land is important to everyone dismisses the idea of why it's important to Indigenous people. This is why I brought up the BLM analogy.

Posted by: syncro

**Posted by: chupacabra

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**

But the process is entirely based on what people want. It would not even be happening without Indigenous people fighting for what they believe in, the courts are just the system they are using to achieve it as they have been ignored by governments for centuries. You may think I'm naive here, but I don't get why you're so hung up on the guest/settler thing. Also, how/why are you so certain that Indigenous people won't share the land if/when they win in court?  The reason I keep bringing up the importance of land is that Indigenous people do not look at the land like a resource to be exploited or something that is owned in the same way that Euro-Western society does. I like your part about conciliation, but that includes understanding Indigenous culture. That's why I keep returning to the point of how Indigenous people view the land. Saying land is important to everyone dismisses the idea of why it's important to Indigenous people. This is why I brought up the BLM analogy.

I am only hung up on the guest/settler thing because A) I feel I have the right to say that I don't want to be called that just like anyone else and B) it is emotive imagery that manipulates public opinion whether it was purposeful or not.  Go to Google image search and type in "settler".  That is what a settler is.  

I am not saying natives won't share the land, I am saying they won't have to and I really don't see why they would or should.  I am OK with that.  I think that is what conciliation and giving up our privilege looks like.  

The reason I keep bringing up the importance of land is that Indigenous people do not look at the land like a resource to be exploited or something that is owned in the same way that Euro-Western society does.

That is a gross generalization of both cultures.  Have you ever seen the Sechelt gravel pit?  People are people.

I am not discounting the cultural importance of the land to native peoples.  They should get back ownership of most of their traditional land and do with it as they see fit.  

At the end of the day I am driven by a few beliefs.

1 - First Nations must be compensated by the government.  
2 - That Canada is legitimate and must weigh the needs all of people equally as a democracy.
3 - Any special status or privilege must have a sunset.

The last one is probably the most controversial, but how long can it be maintained considering that even now status can be obtained through marriage or a small amount of ancestry.  This will only get more complicated as time rolls on.  If we make it another 200 years I would rather Canada only has one status of citizen.

https://www.durangotelegraph.com/opinion/la-vida-local/stolen-children-and-abandoned-justice/

I've heard Canadian FN talk on the CBC  and they might  say something along the lines of "I'm  Anisshnabe from treaty 8  " or whatever tribe & treaty  they are from but you won't hear that from most BC natives cuz no treaty,

it would have been a lot cheaper to buy BC back in the late 1800's

kind of like buying a house in Vancouver 60 yars ago

Cool investigation into how smart West Coast Indigenous peoples are. Over a millennium ago they were building advanced fish traps to feed their people.

https://comoxvalley.news/amazing-1300-year-old-technology-found-hidden-in-comox-harbour/

Posted by: syncro

Cool investigation into how smart West Coast Indigenous peoples are. Over a century ago they were building advanced fish traps to feed their people.

https://comoxvalley.news/amazing-1300-year-old-technology-found-hidden-in-comox-harbour/

That would be a millenia...

Splinky....so woke right now. I guess you had never seen the wiers on the cap and seymour rivers. Traditionally made of cedar baskets, but mor recently, turned over shopping carts were used.

Posted by: three-sheets

Posted by: syncro

Cool investigation into how smart West Coast Indigenous peoples are. Over a century ago they were building advanced fish traps to feed their people.

https://comoxvalley.news/amazing-1300-year-old-technology-found-hidden-in-comox-harbour/

That would be a millenia...

Splinky....so woke right now. I guess you had never seen the wiers on the cap and seymour rivers. Traditionally made of cedar baskets, but mor recently, turned over shopping carts were used.

haha - yes typo on millenium

no haven't see the weirs on cap and seymour rivers

so woke? meh. it's an article I saw that I found interesting and figured it would be good for this thread. I didn't think it would be worthy of a pejorative woke comment tho.

Two years ago I made a post of FB about climate change, looking for honest opinions from the people I know. I replied to it again today I see the issue of climate change being directly tied to today, our first National Day for Truth and Reconciliation and also Orange Shirt day. 

A central component of Indigenous culture, maybe even the core, is the concept of Relationality. What does that have to do with climate change and Orange Shirt Day you ask? Relationality is about connectedness, our connection to each other, all other life forms that share this planet, and most importantly the land itself. For Indigenous people, their connection to the land is sacred and forms their spirituality.

Indigenous people exist in unison with the land. The land is not something to be managed, controlled, manipulated or some thing to be used to satisfy us. The land does not belong to us, we belong to the land.

So when we think about Orange Shirt Day, and think about Reconciliation, we also have to think about Relationality - our connection to each other and our connection to the land. If we want to move forward with Reconciliation then we also have to move forward with Relationality as both ideas are bound up together. We have to change the way we be, change what our relationships are. We have to become comfortable with being uncomfortable, with doing things that are not easy in mind, body or spirit.

In Indigenous author Shawn Wilson's book Research Is Ceremony - Indigenous Research Methods he talks about the way Indigenous researchers look at the world. It is not a stuffy academic book and is a good book to read if you're curious about the Indigenous worldview or the perspective Indigenous people have of the world. There is a whole chapter on Relationality, and it is worth reading a few times. I think for most people it will take reading a few times anyway to begin to understand and appreciate this concept of Relationality. In writing about Relationality, Wilson quotes his friend Lewis who says:

"The land is paramount for all Indigenous societies. Their relationship to that land, their experience on that land shapes everything that is around them... land is another word for place, environment, your reality, the space you're in." Lewis goes on to say that "Indigenous peoples and their traditions and customs, they are shaped by the environment, the land, their relationship; their spiritual, emotional and physical relationship to that land. It speaks to them; it gives them their responsibility for stewardship."

Today, and tomorrow, and every day into your future, think about Relationality and your connection to this place we all share together. Think about stewardship.

This following link is an absolutely fantastic page for learning more about Truth and Reconciliation. Probably the best place to start is with their about page.

https://nctr.ca/about/

Canada has a climate double standard. While land and water defenders face serious criminalization, repression, and police brutality, we’re continuing to witness in Wet’suwet’en territory, corporations – backed by the RCMP – get away with breaking the law with impunity.

The realities of this double standard have been highlighted by a groundbreaking report by the Yellowhead Institute on the use of injunctions. Yellowhead researchers found that 76 per cent of injunctions filed against First Nations by corporations were granted. Meanwhile, 81 per cent of injunctions filed by First Nations against corporations and 82 per cent of those filed against the government by First Nations were denied.

As the researchers write, “this means that 4 times out of 5, the courts side with corporations and government rather than Indigenous claimants on land use cases.”

Today, Coastal GasLink continues to break the law with impunity. Even though it still lacks a key environmental authorization, the corporation is proceeding with the pipeline anyway. What’s more, Coastal GasLink has been evicted from the territory in accordance with Wet’suwet’en law, but they refuse to leave.

https://canadians.org/analysis/rcmp-serves-and-protects-fossil-fuel-ceos

think Christy Clark said she would get CGL past the point of no return and she did

Posted by: chupacabra

Posted by: syncro

**Posted by: chupacabra

.............
**

But the process is entirely based on what people want. It would not even be happening without Indigenous people fighting for what they believe in, the courts are just the system they are using to achieve it as they have been ignored by governments for centuries. You may think I'm naive here, but I don't get why you're so hung up on the guest/settler thing. Also, how/why are you so certain that Indigenous people won't share the land if/when they win in court?  The reason I keep bringing up the importance of land is that Indigenous people do not look at the land like a resource to be exploited or something that is owned in the same way that Euro-Western society does. I like your part about conciliation, but that includes understanding Indigenous culture. That's why I keep returning to the point of how Indigenous people view the land. Saying land is important to everyone dismisses the idea of why it's important to Indigenous people. This is why I brought up the BLM analogy.

I am only hung up on the guest/settler thing because A) I feel I have the right to say that I don't want to be called that just like anyone else and B) it is emotive imagery that manipulates public opinion whether it was purposeful or not.  Go to Google image search and type in "settler".  That is what a settler is.  

I am not saying natives won't share the land, I am saying they won't have to and I really don't see why they would or should.  I am OK with that.  I think that is what conciliation and giving up our privilege looks like.  

The reason I keep bringing up the importance of land is that Indigenous people do not look at the land like a resource to be exploited or something that is owned in the same way that Euro-Western society does.

That is a gross generalization of both cultures.  Have you ever seen the Sechelt gravel pit?  People are people.

I am not discounting the cultural importance of the land to native peoples.  They should get back ownership of most of their traditional land and do with it as they see fit.  

At the end of the day I am driven by a few beliefs.

1 - First Nations must be compensated by the government.  
2 - That Canada is legitimate and must weigh the needs all of people equally as a democracy.
3 - Any special status or privilege must have a sunset.

The last one is probably the most controversial, but how long can it be maintained considering that even now status can be obtained through marriage or a small amount of ancestry.  This will only get more complicated as time rolls on.  If we make it another 200 years I would rather Canada only has one status of citizen.

one of the sharpest posts i've ever seen here. 

"that is a gross generalization of both cultures".   obscenely gross, and moronic.

Posted by: syncro

Cool investigation into how smart West Coast Indigenous peoples are. Over a millennium ago they were building advanced fish traps to feed their people.

https://comoxvalley.news/amazing-1300-year-old-technology-found-hidden-in-comox-harbour/

you seem surprised. why wouldn't they be 'smart', resourceful, intelligent, etc.? they are no different than humans across the globe in regards to intelligence. it's how they migrated here and prospered for millennia.

Posted by: chupacabra

That is a gross generalization of both cultures.  Have you ever seen the Sechelt gravel pit?  People are people.

Generalization yes, but far more accurate than gross. The western's world rape and pillage of planet earth in the name of profit is quite well documented; logging in BC, orphaned wells and the oil sands in Alberta are another, over-fishing on the East Coast and similarly here on the West, Mount Polley, and our abusive mining record in underdeveloped nations is well documented. Resource companies in Canada are doing better, but it's not because they want to, it's because it's ether regulated or in the rare instance where it becomes financially beneficial. I'm not necessarily speaking to all Indigenous cultures everywhere, but generally Indigenous peoples have a much better relation with nature due to the significance it has in their culture which is not only spiritually based, but based on survival based. I think reef net fisheries provide the best example of this.

I think what's missing from your Sechelt gravel pit example (and other similar ones that get drawn such as Fairy Creek) is taking into account how colonization destroyed Indigenous societies through legal and social means and left them with little opportunity for survival in many instances. That's not to say that everything in the Indigenous world is perfect, but there is a very distinct difference between the how Indigenous peoples and Westerners view their relationship with the planet.