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Dirtiest Oil on Earth

May 11, 2014, 11:18 a.m.
Posts: 3643
Joined: May 23, 2006

No but it's not like anyone refused to buy it either.

No but it's not like "anyone" got much of a choice since the class owning production here shipped production there and with it the jobs "anyone" used to have so now robbed of their (relative) wealth "anyone" are compelled to go to Walmart and buy that "Made in China" crap, eh?

Freedom of contract. We sell them guns that kill them; they sell us drugs that kill us.

May 11, 2014, 9:42 p.m.
Posts: 15598
Joined: May 29, 2004

No but it's not like "anyone" got much of a choice since the class owning production here shipped production there and with it the jobs "anyone" used to have so now robbed of their (relative) wealth "anyone" are compelled to go to Walmart and buy that "Made in China" crap, eh?

Truest thing you've ever posted here

May 11, 2014, 10:07 p.m.
Posts: 12863
Joined: Jan. 27, 2003

It's also pretty dumb to say China's polluted because of all the "cheap wal-mart crap".

Most of our expensive, quality items are made there (and recycled/disposed of/incinerated there) too. Zomg 5000 dollar mountain bikes that would cost 50 000 dollars if there was no polluted China. They want our bitumen so we may as well give it to them, it's only fair.

www.natooke.com

May 11, 2014, 10:25 p.m.
Posts: 0
Joined: July 5, 2012

It's also pretty dumb to say China's polluted because of all the "cheap wal-mart crap".

Most of our expensive, quality items are made there (and recycled/disposed of/incinerated there) too. Zomg 5000 dollar mountain bikes that would cost 50 000 dollars if there was no polluted China. They want our bitumen so we may as well give it to them, it's only fair.

But can't we find a better way to give it to them? The northern gateway pipeline ends in one of the most pristine parts of the planet and something is bound to fuck up eventually. That part of BC should be protected.

I ride bikes for nsmb.com, chromag, dissent labs, and I like to have fun! http://instagram.com/markymath

May 11, 2014, 10:45 p.m.
Posts: 33721
Joined: Nov. 19, 2002

It is pretty hypocritical for insulated Canadians to protest things like pipelines.
Half of China has turned into industrial wasteland so we can have our cakes and eat it too constantly offshoring our damage.

Then we cry about a pipeline…

That was the theme of a TED talk one of the NSMB members did (rewoga? - one of the Courtenay crew). Very good talk. Great point about taking ownership of producing goods that create a lot of pollution.

It is easy to dodge our responsibilities, but we cannot dodge the consequences of dodging our responsibilities.
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May 11, 2014, 10:52 p.m.
Posts: 12863
Joined: Jan. 27, 2003

But can't we find a better way to give it to them? The northern gateway pipeline ends in one of the most pristine parts of the planet and something is bound to fuck up eventually. That part of BC should be protected.

Well last i checked portals don't exist yet and sending it in trucks or on trains has already been proven to not be safe or reliable.

Yeah it is one of the most pristine parts of the planet. Have you seen what Canadian mining companies have done to pristine parts of other countries? Or what paramiltary groups do that they have turned a blind eye to so they could have access to these places?

I don't like it anymore than you do but this is the world we live in and as shitty as a pipeline going through BC is and with all the faults you can think of it will still have more oversight than the places we usually extract our resources.

www.natooke.com

May 12, 2014, 12:53 a.m.
Posts: 3643
Joined: May 23, 2006

It's also pretty dumb to say China's polluted because of all the "cheap wal-mart crap".

China's polluted because corruption and bribery are so ingrained in Chinese culture :greedy: the "party" is powerless to stop it. I hear the mayor of Beijing has been promised a bullet in the back of the head :dead: if'n he don't clear the skis of pollution by some fast approaching date in time.

Canadas $207,000 oil sands ad: Putting a price on deception

Freedom of contract. We sell them guns that kill them; they sell us drugs that kill us.

May 12, 2014, 6:16 a.m.
Posts: 15598
Joined: May 29, 2004

But can't we find a better way to give it to them? The northern gateway pipeline ends in one of the most pristine parts of the planet and something is bound to fuck up eventually. That part of BC should be protected.

Kitimat is pristine?

It's a smelter town ffs.

May 12, 2014, 9:27 a.m.
Posts: 4297
Joined: June 1, 2009

. Have you seen what Canadian mining companies have done to pristine parts of other countries?

I don't like it anymore than you do but this is the world we live in and as shitty as a pipeline going through BC is and with all the faults you can think of it will still have more oversight than the places we usually extract our resources.

Kitimat is pristine?

It's a smelter town ffs.

So just to see if I have this straight, your argument is, "Its already happening, or it already sucks, so who gives a sh*t if gets worse?". Nice. You two may as well be co-PMs.

May 12, 2014, 9:48 a.m.
Posts: 15228
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

Kitimat is a very small area of the north coast which is for the most part pristine, the 1st nations issue is still and has always been the project killer, they still gotta get thru the Wetsuetin, the Haisla and the Gitgat … this ain't anywhere close to over

May 12, 2014, 9:57 a.m.
Posts: 3
Joined: July 4, 2003

So just to see if I have this straight, your argument is, "Its already happening, or it already sucks, so who gives a sh*t if gets worse?". Nice. You two may as well be co-PMs.

No.

The point is that alternatives to getting this oil shipped are even more dangerous to the environment.

The real solution as mentioned before is to reduce the need for this oil in the first place, but to do that is nearly an impossible task.

Unless we collectively figure out a way to make most products locally, using recycled materials, and renewable energy to power the industries we need to focus on getting this product to market as efficiently and safely as possible.

If I had it my way we would turn everything off and reset from scratch. People, myself and those around me included, need a good reminder what its like when the lights and heat go out.

Focusing on realistic solutions, I think, is key.

May 12, 2014, 11:53 a.m.
Posts: 4297
Joined: June 1, 2009

The real solution as mentioned before is to reduce the need for this oil in the first place, but to do that is nearly an impossible task.

Unless we collectively figure out a way to make most products locally, using recycled materials, and renewable energy to power the industries we need to focus on getting this product to market as efficiently and safely as possible.

If I had it my way we would turn everything off and reset from scratch. People, myself and those around me included, need a good reminder what its like when the lights and heat go out.

Focusing on realistic solutions, I think, is key.

I agree with the bulk of this.. maybe not some of the details, but yes, over-dependence on oil is bad.. whether its for consumption or as income.

No.

The point is that alternatives to getting this oil shipped are even more dangerous to the environment.

This I dont agree with.. at least not fully. I understand the transportation alternatives aren't great. But the Enbridge pipeline is not a realistic solution to the problem. Im not against pipelines as a rule, but in that terrain, with the consequences that come with a spill, be it the pipeline or a tanker. Its absolutely absurd.

May 12, 2014, 1 p.m.
Posts: 15228
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

I think the kindermorgan alternative is more likely to happen cuz there is already an existing pipline there

May 12, 2014, 3:34 p.m.
Posts: 11540
Joined: June 29, 2006

It's also pretty dumb to say China's polluted because of all the "cheap wal-mart crap".

Most of our expensive, quality items are made there (and recycled/disposed of/incinerated there) too. Zomg 5000 dollar mountain bikes that would cost 50 000 dollars if there was no polluted China. They want our bitumen so we may as well give it to them, it's only fair.

I get your point, but as a Canadian/BC citizen my power mainly lies within my borders, so a pipeline that travels across BC is something I actually have a small amount of impact on. For some they don't want to risk a spill, for others like myself I don't want to expand the oil sands more than we already have. I believe at the end of the day the powers that be will likely find one way or another to get the oil the Asia, but maybe the Chinese need to learn to fight for their back yards more.

At a billion people I bet China also buys a lot of their own products.

May 12, 2014, 5:57 p.m.
Posts: 26382
Joined: Aug. 14, 2005

Well last i checked portals don't exist yet and sending it in trucks or on trains has already been proven to not be safe or reliable.

Yet based on what I have observed in the last year on the CN line…there is a increase in the number of tanker cars in use. And compared to almost 2 years ago there are more freight trains coming through that consist of only tanker cars.

But who cares if a couple of small towns get obliterated as long as we ban pipelines.

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