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Convoy

Feb. 10, 2022, 10:21 a.m.
Posts: 14924
Joined: Feb. 19, 2003

Posted by: chupacabra

Posted by: tashi

These people are sitting in the theater while the credits are running yelling about how it’s too dark. FFS, the lights are just about to come on people, have you never been to a movie before?

Exactly.  And when the lights come on they are going to high five each other and wonder why everyone isn't thanking them.

Counterpoint - and here's where I can be for the removal of restrictions, but against the domestic terrorist encampment - I think the lights have come on, and we're being slow to acknowledge it.

Feb. 10, 2022, 10:34 a.m.
Posts: 12259
Joined: June 29, 2006

Posted by: Couch_Surfer

Posted by: chupacabra

Posted by: tashi

These people are sitting in the theater while the credits are running yelling about how it’s too dark. FFS, the lights are just about to come on people, have you never been to a movie before?

Exactly.  And when the lights come on they are going to high five each other and wonder why everyone isn't thanking them.

Counterpoint - and here's where I can be for the removal of restrictions, but against the domestic terrorist encampment - I think the lights have come on, and we're being slow to acknowledge it.

I think it is coming, but we had 18 deaths just yesterday in BC.  We have a learned a lot of lessons in the last 2 years and one of them has to be 'don't jump the gun'.  Talking to people about COVID recently there is a real sense of optimism that getting back to business as usual is just around the corner so dropping everything now just seems premature.  Festivals are being planned for the summer again and all of the health ministers have indicated this will be the case as well. 

I think we are likely past any new spikes in cases and Alberta and Saskatchewan will be the guinea pigs to let us know how quickly we can re-open.

Feb. 10, 2022, 11 a.m.
Posts: 14924
Joined: Feb. 19, 2003

^^ 18 deaths isn't a particularly useful measurement anymore in my mind. were those people vaccinated or not and what was their general state of health ignoring Covid as a factor.

I don't want to type out a whole big thing about vaccines, the unvaxxed, risk, masks etc. Because we've all gone through it at this point. But if you have some time and some inclination, I found this discussion https://peterattiamd.com/covid-part2/ very interesting, and it certainly challenged some of the thoughts I've had to this point on the topic. They structure their conversation on "what is the data, what are our opinions from that" which I found a particularly useful framing. I think you would find it an interesting listen.


 Last edited by: Couch_Surfer on Feb. 10, 2022, 11 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Feb. 10, 2022, 11:04 a.m.
Posts: 3834
Joined: May 23, 2006

Belligerent men in big trucks given keys to nation’s capital | The Star

Feb. 10, 2022, 11:43 a.m.
Posts: 3158
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: Couch_Surfer

I don't want to type out a whole big thing about vaccines, the unvaxxed, risk, masks etc. Because we've all gone through it at this point. But if you have some time and some inclination, I found this discussion https://peterattiamd.com/covid-part2/ very interesting, and it certainly challenged some of the thoughts I've had to this point on the topic. They structure their conversation on "what is the data, what are our opinions from that" which I found a particularly useful framing. I think you would find it an interesting listen.

Tune in to the late news to see the story of a brave soul as they step into the abyss called nuance and moves away from the apparently lush green fields of mainstream acceptability. Will others follow?

Film at 11.

Feb. 10, 2022, 11:45 a.m.
Posts: 209
Joined: Feb. 2, 2021

Posted by: chupacabra

I think it is coming, but we had 18 deaths just yesterday in BC. We have a learned a lot of lessons in the last 2 years and one of them has to be 'don't jump the gun'. Talking to people about COVID recently there is a real sense of optimism that getting back to business as usual is just around the corner so dropping everything now just seems premature. Festivals are being planned for the summer again and all of the health ministers have indicated this will be the case as well.

I think we are likely past any new spikes in cases and Alberta and Saskatchewan will be the guinea pigs to let us know how quickly we can re-open.

Yep, I get that we're all tired and chomping at the bit for some return to normalcy. Yes, case counts are dropping Provincially. I'm optimistic, and definitely looking forward to spring and summer! It's easy to forget though that there is a lot of Province outside of the lower mainland. When Omicron became the predominant variant Provincially, Delta was still plaguing rural communities, which sometimes lag weeks behind more densely populated regions. In our local hospital, 7 of the 8 available ICU beds are currently occupied by COVID positive patients, and we're still currently grappling with the Omicron surge. Our daughter's daycare was slammed by it mid-January, our whole household, daycare staff and families are just recovering now. I'm not a public health expert by any means, but I'm hoping to see a conservative, region by region approach to restriction removal.


 Last edited by: Schnickelfritz on Feb. 10, 2022, 11:49 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Reason: formatting
Feb. 10, 2022, 11:50 a.m.
Posts: 3158
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: Schnickelfritz

Yep, I get that we're all tired and chomping at the bit for some return to normalcy. Yes, case counts are dropping Provincially. I'm optimistic, and definitely looking forward to spring and summer! It's easy to forget though that there is a lot of Province outside of the lower mainland. When Omicron became the predominant variant Provincially, Delta was still plaguing rural communities, which sometimes lag weeks behind more densely populated regions. In our local hospital, 7 of the 8 available ICU beds are currently occupied by COVID positive patients, and we're still currently grappling with the Omicron surge. Our daughter's daycare was slammed by it mid-January, our whole household, daycare staff and families are just recovering now. I'm not a public health expert by any means, but I'm hoping to see a conservative, region by region approach to restriction removal.

This is incredibly important to recognize and the PHO has made some moves towards having different regs for different regions. Unfortunately that presents a set of problems that some people won't agree with or will have trouble rationalizing. Besides the virus itself, there is also a battle against psychology going on.

Feb. 10, 2022, 11:59 a.m.
Posts: 548
Joined: Feb. 16, 2013

Posted by: syncro

Besides the virus itself, there is also a battle against psychology going on.

Bang-on, and has been the case since the very beginning of the pandemic.

Feb. 10, 2022, noon
Posts: 209
Joined: Feb. 2, 2021

Posted by: syncro

Posted by: Schnickelfritz

Yep, I get that we're all tired and chomping at the bit for some return to normalcy. Yes, case counts are dropping Provincially. I'm optimistic, and definitely looking forward to spring and summer! It's easy to forget though that there is a lot of Province outside of the lower mainland. When Omicron became the predominant variant Provincially, Delta was still plaguing rural communities, which sometimes lag weeks behind more densely populated regions. In our local hospital, 7 of the 8 available ICU beds are currently occupied by COVID positive patients, and we're still currently grappling with the Omicron surge. Our daughter's daycare was slammed by it mid-January, our whole household, daycare staff and families are just recovering now. I'm not a public health expert by any means, but I'm hoping to see a conservative, region by region approach to restriction removal.

This is incredibly important to recognize and the PHO has made some moves towards having different regs for different regions. Unfortunately that presents a set of problems that some people won't agree with or will have trouble rationalizing. Besides the virus itself, there is also a battle against psychology going on.

For sure, last spring when we were dealing with varying restrictions region by region, there was definitely noticeable confusion and frustration locally. Saw more than a few 'I'm not wearing a mask, those restrictions have been lifted, you can't make me'.

Feb. 10, 2022, 12:19 p.m.
Posts: 2539
Joined: April 25, 2003

Posted by: Couch_Surfer

Posted by: chupacabra

Posted by: tashi

These people are sitting in the theater while the credits are running yelling about how it’s too dark. FFS, the lights are just about to come on people, have you never been to a movie before?

Exactly.  And when the lights come on they are going to high five each other and wonder why everyone isn't thanking them.

Counterpoint - and here's where I can be for the removal of restrictions, but against the domestic terrorist encampment - I think the lights have come on, and we're being slow to acknowledge it.

For this analogy the movie is the COVID wave, the low lights are the restrictions.

The early adopters will likely show us if this it the right time (for their locations) or if they miss out on a sick end credit scene (infection spike).

Feb. 10, 2022, 12:25 p.m.
Posts: 3158
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: Schnickelfritz

For sure, last spring when we were dealing with varying restrictions region by region, there was definitely noticeable confusion and frustration locally. Saw more than a few 'I'm not wearing a mask, those restrictions have been lifted, you can't make me'.

Even though I believe Dr Henry has made some mistakes along the way, I also believe her most difficult task has been weighing what info to give and how to give it as there are enough more than enough people with mistrust of the government that they will take what the govt says and spin it up into a conspiracy. We've seen that on the board here and like you say in certain places that sense of frustration was even more noticeable. It's been a balance of giving enough of just the right info to get the vast majority of people to do the right things to minimize disruptions and death. For people who have post secondary education, including crackerjack box exercise science degrees, ;) they have a better understanding of the underlying science so it's much easier for them to accept the public health messaging. For people that don't it all comes down to trust and that level of trust is in direct competition with their own level of personal discomfort. That's probably the one thing I've come to value the most in doing my BSW, being able to gain a better appreciation for how and why other people see the world differently. "Lived experience" has been a social justice buzzword for a while, but it's incredibly important to try and understand where someone is at and how they got they in order to get a sense of why they think the way they do.

In. 10-15 years it will be easy to sit back and say what should have been done differently, but I appreciate that health authorities have generally chosen to err on the side of caution instead of being more risky. We've see how that plays out in AB, SK and MB. Whether we realize it or not, the pandemic has affected all of us in the way that we think. Who knows, maybe in that same 10-15 years when the reflections are done this whole exercise will end up being a net positive for our society.

Feb. 10, 2022, 12:33 p.m.
Posts: 14924
Joined: Feb. 19, 2003

Posted by: syncro

Tune in to the late news to see the story of a brave soul as they step into the abyss called nuance and moves away from the apparently lush green fields of mainstream acceptability. Will others follow?

Film at 11.

LOL

Yeah - I'm at a point where I'll let everyone be where they want to be on this.  I can't change any restrictions, so no need in getting all wound up about it.  Anyway, for anyone that likes listening to smart people discuss/debate a topic, I found that particular podcast to be a good listen.  YMMV.

Feb. 10, 2022, 12:35 p.m.
Posts: 14924
Joined: Feb. 19, 2003

Posted by: tashi

For this analogy the movie is the COVID wave, the low lights are the restrictions.

The early adopters will likely show us if this it the right time (for their locations) or if they miss out on a sick end credit scene (infection spike).

I'm all for torturing metaphors.  Well done.  ;)

Feb. 10, 2022, 1:33 p.m.
Posts: 2539
Joined: April 25, 2003

Posted by: Couch_Surfer

Posted by: tashi

For this analogy the movie is the COVID wave, the low lights are the restrictions.

The early adopters will likely show us if this it the right time (for their locations) or if they miss out on a sick end credit scene (infection spike).

I'm all for torturing metaphors.  Well done.  ;)

This one is holding up surprisingly well!

Feb. 10, 2022, 2:58 p.m.
Posts: 18790
Joined: Oct. 28, 2003

NY State lifted mask mandates today.  Do I go out for dinner and risk a positive next week before coming home?  

Or do I get in the convoy with my rental?   

FML.  The tuckers better not truck up my border.

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