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Are we screwed? Is Humanity Doomed?

March 3, 2019, 12:39 p.m.
Posts: 938
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: Hepcat

I was talking way more basic, like accepting basic scientific fact.

Sadly that appears to be a big step for a large number of us.

I believe that knowledge is our only path to making it, though a lot of good that does when after 12 years of education someone decides the earth is flat. 😬

I agree that knowledge/education is the first step and imo the first step to solving most of humanities issues. I also think that the sooner we all act the greater the chance that we can pull ourselves back from the abyss. However, when much of the world's population is focused on day to day survival and the rest are enjoying comfortable lifestyle they're probably not willing to give up or alter too much the idea of saving ourselves seems like an impossible task. 

Maybe a better question is what are we willing to give up and can it make enough of a difference. For example, pretty much any talk of road pricing to try and decrease auto usage is typically met with significant backlash. Or how some sort of taxation policy on meat and processed food products? The meat industry is responsible for more GHG emissions that the auto industry yet when it comes to climate change the meat industry rarely seems to figure into the equation. On a smaller scale what would you (or I) give up to help "save humanity"? Drive only 1-2 times per week? Eat meat maybe 1-2 times per month? Reuse items such as clothing, housewares, furniture or even mobile phones more often? It seems that there are a lot of ways to reduce one's own ecological footprint yet our societal obsession with image seems to make those things a non-starter for a lot of people.

March 3, 2019, 12:41 p.m.
Posts: 938
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

Posted by: JBV

those that will be in the largest number, don't presently share the concerns of the kind of people reading this website (more assumptions...). your kids kids will probably be their slaves or just killed off.

yeah similar thoughts have crossed my mind. while we may be able to change the value system of our own society how do we do that for other societies?

March 3, 2019, 1:44 p.m.
Posts: 14430
Joined: Dec. 30, 2002

Posted by: syncro

Posted by: JBV

those that will be in the largest number, don't presently share the concerns of the kind of people reading this website (more assumptions...). your kids kids will probably be their slaves or just killed off.

yeah similar thoughts have crossed my mind. while we may be able to change the value system of our own society how do we do that for other societies?

I had typed this before reading page 2 and seeing whats quoted..,

In the broad sense as a species, not yet.
In a more localized sense, western way of life is yes.

ie: talk to anyone with international house mates and see if they even care to recycle.

March 3, 2019, 6:10 p.m.
Posts: 34237
Joined: Nov. 19, 2002

Time to get smarter every day.

https://youtu.be/qOTYgcdNrXE

March 3, 2019, 7:29 p.m.
Posts: 1225
Joined: May 23, 2006

Posted by: syncro

For example, pretty much any talk of road pricing to try and decrease auto usage is typically met with significant backlash. Or how some sort of taxation policy on meat and processed food products? The meat industry is responsible for more GHG emissions that the auto industry yet when it comes to climate change the meat industry rarely seems to figure into the equation. On a smaller scale what would you (or I) give up to help "save humanity"? Drive only 1-2 times per week? Eat meat maybe 1-2 times per month?

If we had enlightened leadership with any kind of balls (or ovaries) they'd declare a "national emergency" (sound familiar?) and mandate that all, all vehicles in use would have to be hybrid ICE/EV within say, five years, that right there would halve vehicular emissions.

We need a new car I wanted a Golf Sportwagon so I could take along a winter fartsack and be a dirtbag skier but the wife called it a gaz guzzler so we buying an Ioniq. Yes dear.

I also read that grazing fees in the states on public land is about one sixth of what it should be. ( https://www.counterpunch.org/2019/02/25/cowboy-welfare/ ) .

They should fix that or better ban grazing on public lands altogether that would drive up prices reducing consumption. Send out a posse and hang any c/b on sight who cheats. http://www.cowspiracy.com/facts

The rancher is a man who strings barbed wire all over the range; drills wells and bulldozes stock ponds; drives off elk and antelope and bighorn sheep; poisons coyotes and prairie dogs; shoots eagles, bears, and cougars on sight; supplants the native grasses with tumbleweed, snakeweed, povertyweed, cowshit, anthills, mud, dust, and flies. And then leans back and grins at the TV cameras and talks about how much he loves the American West.

Cowboys are also greatly overrated. Consider the nature of their work. Suppose you had to spend most of your working hours sitting on a horse, contemplating the hind end of a cow. How would that affect your imagination? Think what it does to the relatively simple mind of the average peasant boy, raised amid the bawling of calves and cows in the splatter of mud and the stink of shit.

- Edward Abby

I ain't eaten beef or pork in over 10 year. Chicken, fish and bision only animal protein I chew. And not ever day.


 Last edited by: tungsten on March 3, 2019, 7:34 p.m., edited 2 times in total.
March 3, 2019, 8:38 p.m.
Posts: 152
Joined: March 6, 2017

Posted by: CB-Spoolmak

Posted by: Sethimus

that's the reason i don't have kids (also not liking them)

Agreed, I also did my part, no offspring. However, my younger sibling has 3 so totally negates my efforts. 

I think humanity is equivalent to the cockroach now, too worthless to vanish completely even when faced w/an extinction level event.

I have 2 boys and a vasectomy so myself and wife are breaking even. This whole 'I'm not having kids so you're welcome' mentality is flawed imo. If some disease spread through humanity and made everyone sterile there would be chaos on this planet. Kim Jong would fire off his nukes, we'd shoot back etc etc eventually destroying the earth anyway. Having future generations is important to keep the planet inhabitable. So you're welcome for trying to keep the planet healthy for my kids for you to live in.

March 4, 2019, 4:37 a.m.
Posts: 2015
Joined: April 2, 2005

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: CB-Spoolmak

Posted by: Sethimus

that's the reason i don't have kids (also not liking them)

Agreed, I also did my part, no offspring. However, my younger sibling has 3 so totally negates my efforts. 

I think humanity is equivalent to the cockroach now, too worthless to vanish completely even when faced w/an extinction level event.

I have 2 boys and a vasectomy so myself and wife are breaking even. This whole 'I'm not having kids so you're welcome' mentality is flawed imo. If some disease spread through humanity and made everyone sterile there would be chaos on this planet. Kim Jong would fire off his nukes, we'd shoot back etc etc eventually destroying the earth anyway. Having future generations is important to keep the planet inhabitable. So you're welcome for trying to keep the planet healthy for my kids for you to live in.

so what are you telling them when you have "the talk" about why we fucked up their future?

March 4, 2019, 7:15 a.m.
Posts: 328
Joined: Nov. 6, 2006

Tell them it started long before us. Now we are handing you the torch, good luck. Sorry we didn’t do something sooner.

If we’re going with the “other talk), I wish I had done a better job warning my boys about high maintenance women.

March 4, 2019, 10:36 a.m.
Posts: 9860
Joined: June 29, 2006

Posted by: CB-Spoolmak

Posted by: Sethimus

that's the reason i don't have kids (also not liking them)

Agreed, I also did my part, no offspring. However, my younger sibling has 3 so totally negates my efforts. 

I think humanity is equivalent to the cockroach now, too worthless to vanish completely even when faced w/an extinction level event.

This is the only area where the West is doing it's part as our population only increases due to immigration.  You and your brother have done your part combined (4 people create 3), so your "efforts" are not wasted.  I put it in quotes because if not having kids was actually a sacrifice on your part that you made just for the planet you could still adopt, but I am guessing you just don't want kids.

For me, I find it hard to get too worked up about plastics when CO2 is the existential threat.  The news on climate lately is filling me with dread.  I know making plastic creates CO2 but it is transportation and industry that are the biggest factors by far.  We need an energy revolution and we need it fast if we are going to have a chance.  The world's governments have done next to nothing so we need a game-changing economic incentive.  Fusion can't come fast enough.

March 5, 2019, 12:24 a.m.
Posts: 14430
Joined: Dec. 30, 2002

Posted by: chupacabra

For me, I find it hard to get too worked up about plastics when CO2 is the existential threat. The news on climate lately is filling me with dread. I know making plastic creates CO2 but it is transportation and industry that are the biggest factors by far. We need an energy revolution and we need it fast if we are going to have a chance. The world's governments have done next to nothing so we need a game-changing economic incentive. Fusion can't come fast enough.

I still think people/you should look into sulfur dioxide for your preeminate threat keeping in mind that according the Al Gore model which was based on CO2 if I'm not mistaken, we should have a drastically different globe. I'm not denying "something" isnt happening - I just see it more as climate shift than change. In my idea, we go back to typical geographic climates that are now shifting around, not runaway weather patterns based on too much carbon because I think we'd all like to be a bit warmer right now. Add to the usual argument of we dont have the historical data to truly understand what to think.

Back on topic: Why have kids if we're just going to give it all away to the Caliphate.

March 5, 2019, 5:03 a.m.
Posts: 328
Joined: Nov. 6, 2006

🙉🙈🙊

March 5, 2019, 8:55 a.m.
Posts: 9860
Joined: June 29, 2006

Posted by: aShogunNamedMarcus

Posted by: chupacabra

For me, I find it hard to get too worked up about plastics when CO2 is the existential threat. The news on climate lately is filling me with dread. I know making plastic creates CO2 but it is transportation and industry that are the biggest factors by far. We need an energy revolution and we need it fast if we are going to have a chance. The world's governments have done next to nothing so we need a game-changing economic incentive. Fusion can't come fast enough.

I still think people/you should look into sulfur dioxide for your preeminate threat keeping in mind that according the Al Gore model which was based on CO2 if I'm not mistaken, we should have a drastically different globe. I'm not denying "something" isnt happening - I just see it more as climate shift than change. In my idea, we go back to typical geographic climates that are now shifting around, not runaway weather patterns based on too much carbon because I think we'd all like to be a bit warmer right now. Add to the usual argument of we dont have the historical data to truly understand what to think.

Back on topic: Why have kids if we're just going to give it all away to the Caliphate.

I am not a scientist and have no intention into "looking into" some other cause of climate change.  I should remind you that you are also not a scientist.  We should listen to them.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/world/article-evidence-global-warming-is-man-made-hits-gold-standard-adding/

March 5, 2019, 11:31 a.m.
Posts: 14430
Joined: Dec. 30, 2002

Posted by: chupacabra

Posted by: aShogunNamedMarcus

Posted by: chupacabra

For me, I find it hard to get too worked up about plastics when CO2 is the existential threat. The news on climate lately is filling me with dread. I know making plastic creates CO2 but it is transportation and industry that are the biggest factors by far. We need an energy revolution and we need it fast if we are going to have a chance. The world's governments have done next to nothing so we need a game-changing economic incentive. Fusion can't come fast enough.

I still think people/you should look into sulfur dioxide for your preeminate threat keeping in mind that according the Al Gore model which was based on CO2 if I'm not mistaken, we should have a drastically different globe. I'm not denying "something" isnt happening - I just see it more as climate shift than change. In my idea, we go back to typical geographic climates that are now shifting around, not runaway weather patterns based on too much carbon because I think we'd all like to be a bit warmer right now. Add to the usual argument of we dont have the historical data to truly understand what to think.

Back on topic: Why have kids if we're just going to give it all away to the Caliphate.

I am not a scientist and have no intention into "looking into" some other cause of climate change.  I should remind you that you are also not a scientist.  We should listen to them.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/world/article-evidence-global-warming-is-man-made-hits-gold-standard-adding/

Since we're non scientist and we're not linking scientific journals, have a Forbes link.

We should still question everybody and not blindly follow them. Especially when billions in carbon tax and credits are being levied on both of us because of shitty greedy science.

March 5, 2019, 11:36 a.m.
Posts: 14430
Joined: Dec. 30, 2002

Chup - since neither of us are theologians, should we not discuss the Caliphate either then?

March 5, 2019, 2:38 p.m.
Posts: 9860
Joined: June 29, 2006

Posted by: aShogunNamedMarcus

Chup - since neither of us are theologians, should we not discuss the Caliphate either then?

That is politics, not religion.  

I am not saying we can't discuss climate change, I do all the time, I am saying that it is foolish to think that thousands of scientists are wrong and that either one of us is qualified to analyze their work.  There is always a new reason to doubt climate change out there, but the scientific community has not wavered on this.  It has now gotten to the point that even the deniers don't deny it is happening because we can all see it in real time.  Now they disagree on why.  

Not everything is a conspiracy.

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