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I don't think it's in your remit to decide who has a position from which to debate and who hasn't. Otherwise, we may as well shut the forum and all just email you directly.
It all comes down to what we consider the definition of "fitness", and until someone can show me a better method of measuring it than VO2 max, that's what I shall be sticking with. Otherwise it's completely unquantifiable.
I do consider athletes like Mo Farah "fit", even though their deadlifts and curls are probably a bit shit. I'd say that a boxer like Riddick Bowe was fit, even though his body composition was less than optimal and I doubt he was the most flexible athlete in the world. I considered Lance Armstrong fit, even though he had sub optimal health due to cancer (another of your fitness prerequisites). If you disagree then that's OK with me, and probably everyone else too!

I don't the that there's a reasonable argument against this, but it sticks in the throat when the followers of this craze tell us that XF people are the bestest, fittest people on the planet and that all other methods are inferior. Somehow these guys are fitter than all of the olympic athletes, pro and elite sportspersons. I don't buy it. Not even for a second.

I think the adherents and fans of any activity, whether its yoga, triathlon, swimming, XC skiing for example will tell you its the "best activity for this, that, and the other". That's their personal opinion, that's their personal experience but really, you have to take it with a grain of salt. Unless you feel pressured into transforming yourself into a cycling, ultra-running, freeweight lifting, skate-skiing yogic fish with a penchant lever-disadvanaged-bodyweight movements.

It all comes down to what we consider the definition of "fitness", and until someone can show me a better method of measuring it than VO2 max, that's what I shall be sticking with. Otherwise it's completely unquantifiable.

V02 max is not an absolute measurement. The lighter you are, the higher your VO2 max relative to your cardiovascular capacity. This is because VO2 max specifies not just the ability of your body to consume oxygen, but the ability to consume oxygen per kg of your body weight. You want a higher V02Max? Just be born short.

Muscular athletes will have a skewed lower V02max relative to very light athletes. Female distance runners have V02 max in a range superior to almost all athletes, on par with male rowers, below only male endurance athletes. Golfer's V02Max overlap with soccer and rugby players. Elite sprinters have very low V02max (on par with participants of recreational sports) because their sport is almost entirely anaerobic and the ability of their bodies to process inhaled oxygen is irrelevant. Would you consider Usain Bolt unfit?

http://www.thestrengthandconditioningblog.com/2012/07/efficiency-is-important-in-sprinting.html

I don't think it's in your remit to decide who has a position from which to debate and who hasn't. Otherwise, we may as well shut the forum and all just email you directly.
It all comes down to what we consider the definition of "fitness", and until someone can show me a better method of measuring it than VO2 max, that's what I shall be sticking with. Otherwise it's completely unquantifiable.

you've been shown what constitutes fitness and you're choosing to ignore that so it makes your argument flawed, it's like you're arguing the world is flat. what you "consider" fitness to be and what it actually is are two very different things. how have you come by that opinion? have you done any study in sport science? have you done any research into the aspects of fitness or is it simply your self arrived at opinion?

if you want to hang on to an incorrect definition that's your choice, but i'm not going to continue to debating the point with someone who refuses to recognize the accepted parameters of fitness. if you decide to change your mind on what constitutes fitnes then i'll be willing to continue the discussion.

here again are teh 5 health and 6 skill related components of fitness and they are all measureable and quantifiable.

5 health:

1.muscular strength
2.muscular endurance
3.cardiovascular endurance
4.body composition
5.flexibility

6 skill:

1. agility
2. balance
3. coordination
4. power
5. speed
6. reaction time

all of these components have definite measureable paramaters.

here's some further reading to educate yourself on what fitness is.

http://www.peandhealth.com/Physical_Fitness.html

i said it before, but search google and you'll find plenty of results to help you understand what constitutes fitness, or more specficially physical fitness.

It all comes down to what we consider the definition of "fitness",

There is nothing stopping me from defining the black disc hockey players use to play the game with the word apple.

and until someone can show me a better method of measuring it than VO2 max,

Syncro provided it a couple of times.

I can understand the appeal of reducing something as complex as the term fitness down to a single measurement but as has been pointed out by many here, it's lacking.

Oh you suggest I read it eh. The reason theres crossfit bashing is because its nothing new. Its was called cross training and its been around for a long time, I think Ive been crossfiting for thirty years for a number of sports at elite amatuer and professional level. Funny how a name is changed and people think its the latest and greatest.

sigh

I always forget your name can be translated as Aussie Battler, oh well.

I am well aware that Crossfit is nothing new under the sun - the other day I did some reading about ancient history what the historical sources say about training and competition of the wrestlers, boxers and pankratianists in ancient Greece and Rome.

Yes, I know that the idea is really, really old - and I am aware of Crossfit's shortcomings. I do not like it either, it simply is just multi-Sport Training. Back when I used to play Basketball we had sessions which were called Circuit Training.

Still, all of this does not make the article not worth being read, mate.

you seem to be taking this trhead pretty seriously but isn't T nation a web site for muscle heads?

so what do they do with their muscles, play one of the many sports that requires speed agility hand to eye coordination, do they climb a mtn, do they paddle a boat, ride a ski up/down/sideway, run?

if cross fit is a sport doesn't also that make aerobics a sport ?

you seem to be taking this trhead pretty seriously but isn't T nation a web site for muscle heads?

No. Granted, there are some bodybuilding articles but they are no more prominent than strength training, diet, mobility, human kinetics and other types of articles (some of which are sport specific).

The specific article I linked to targeted the new/infrequent trainees who thinks jogging is the route one takes to look like a sprinter.

you seem to be taking this trhead pretty seriously but isn't T nation a web site for muscle heads?

so what do they do with their muscles, play one of the many sports that requires speed agility hand to eye coordination, do they climb a mtn, do they paddle a boat, ride a ski up/down/sideway, run?

if cross fit is a sport doesn't also that make aerobics a sport ?

the question of what is a sport can be a difficult one to answer. the simplist definition though wouold be any form of competitve activity that has a measurable outcome.

so to answer your question yes, aerobics is a sport as there are competitions related to it. just because an activity doesn't seem to qualify as a sport in the immediate sense such as hockey or soccer would it doesn't mean it can't be considered sport.

so while mountain biking is a sport, would you call going out for a ride with your buddies where there is no real competition a sport?

Buddy used alot of words, he could have said if you want to get fast you need to do speed work.

Cross fit or aerobics is exercise that has been packaged by someone to make bank, good on them for making it pay and subsequently packaging it into a competition, hell you can make anything into a competition but I don't think of it as a sport, whats next crossfit at the olympics?;)

pretty much any time 2 people do anything together a competition can and more often than not will result especialy a group of buddies on mtn bikes and if there is blood you definaly got a sport

Buddy used alot of words, he could have said if you want to get fast you need to do speed work.

He could have said that, but then he should save it for an article where he's trying to get that point across as opposed to the one the article.

As for the olympics… Could you imagine if there was an event where people lifted weights? That would be stupid.

Didnt we have this argument a few years ago?

If everything got solved you would need to do actual work instead of wasting time here

Besides, I got my special exemption from the Senior NBR Administration Panel for reposting the same topic within a 36 month time span.

Didnt we have this argument a few years ago?

PCH