Wheel Builders on the shore?

I know this has come up, maybe I am just old and can't work it out, but from what I can tell the new "enhanced by google " forum search is pretty terrible. I can't tell if posts are 10 years old or 10days old. AKA,  useless.

Anyways rant off. 

I have some turbine R wheels. Hubs are awesome. Keep breaking spokes which then requires trailside surgery re-tensioning the remaining spokes to get the wheels to run straight enough to not gouge my frame. 

It's happened a few times now and I'm pretty tired of it. I'm ranting again. 

I'm thinking I should buy a WR1 union and get it laced my existing straight pull vault hub. 

I've built wheels before with aluminum dt rims i did not care much about, but I'm a little nervous to DIY a fancier rim, although I guess the process would be more forgiving..

Thoughts? I assume it'd be best to show up with a hub and rim and let the builder supply spokes and nipples. 

Thanks guys!

Posted by: Kenny

I know this has come up, maybe I am just old and can't work it out, but from what I can tell the new "enhanced by google " forum search is pretty terrible. I can't tell if posts are 10 years old or 10days old. AKA,  useless.

Sorry about that. The Google search widget is a temporary workaround. The forum software's own search never worked well and was using up resources on the server so I disabled it.

I just reconfigured the Google search widget to sort on Date by default so it should now show newest first, hope that helps.

If not, you may try an actual google search query (at google.com) prefixed by "site:nsmb.com".

I have on my todo list to look into a new search module for the forum software but I only have ~1 day per month to work on NSMB.

--

After this intermission, back on topic!

Posted by: niels@nsmb.com

If not, you may try an actual google search query (at google.com) prefixed by "site:nsmb.com".

I use this for heaps of sites with shitty native search tools. +1 Internet point to Niels for remembering to share it.

I’d build it myself if you know how to build already. I’ve only rebuilt a couple ENVE wheels but it’s no more difficult than aluminum.  Maybe easier as the rims were very flat and round. I now use a tensiometer to attain a correct even tension. You’re right to rebuild though. If I break one spoke for no obvious reason like a stick or damage from an errant chain, I will replace it. Chalk it up to being a one off. But once another one goes and then another, I figure it means the spokes are getting fatigued and are done. 

I couldn’t tell you who on the North Shore builds a good wheel but I would suggest most shops have a person that is very good at it.

I'd echo Andy's recommendation to build them up yourself, but if you want someone else to do it I highly recommend Lynn Valley Bikes.

Posted by: Kenny

I know this has come up, maybe I am just old and can't work it out, but from what I can tell the new "enhanced by google " forum search is pretty terrible. I can't tell if posts are 10 years old or 10days old. AKA,  useless.

Anyways rant off. 

I have some turbine R wheels. Hubs are awesome. Keep breaking spokes which then requires trailside surgery re-tensioning the remaining spokes to get the wheels to run straight enough to not gouge my frame. 

It's happened a few times now and I'm pretty tired of it. I'm ranting again. 

I'm thinking I should buy a WR1 union and get it laced my existing straight pull vault hub. 

I've built wheels before with aluminum dt rims i did not care much about, but I'm a little nervous to DIY a fancier rim, although I guess the process would be more forgiving..

Thoughts? I assume it'd be best to show up with a hub and rim and let the builder supply spokes and nipples. 

Thanks guys!

There’s a guy that builds wheels around Seymour Parkway and Berkley area. I’ve had a couple wheel builds from him, plus a couple of my friends have gotten wheels from him. Happy with the build,I’ve had mine for a couple’s season, still going strong. Way cheaper than the local bike shops. PM me if you’re interested and I’ll pass his contact info.

I've found it's easier to build up Carbon rims, as they're less prone to going out of true as you tension them up. A lot less tweaks required as you go along. I also use a tensiometer and proper stand, which definitely helps.

Thanks guys! Appreciate the thoughts and recommendations. 

Yeah over the past couple days I had already pretty much talked myself into just building it up myself, these comments seem to reinforce that idea. I've built a few aluminum wheels with good success and other than being carbon and straight pull, concept is the same and as has been said. If anything a little easier.

When I build wheels I'm obviously pretty careful first few rides and monitor spoke tension, feel, and sound carefully. Will just do the same. 

I played a ton of music growing up and have always had a very good sense of pitch and can get spoke tensions very very even. 

Only time this trips me up is when I bend my aluminum rims and have to re true them, since then the spoke tensions have to compensate for the fact that the rim is actually deformed (which I know is fundamentally not right to even do, but this is the only way I've been able to keep aluminum rims alive for more than a season). I'm looking forward to the carbon rim eliminating the silly rim truing dance I seem to have to constantly perform. Haha.

Id vote for doing them yourself if you have the skills and knowledge. You do need to be a careful with tension on any wheel build. Rims have a recommended maximum tension that can cause eyelet cracking if exceeded. Even though you can audibly hear the tension on the spokes, you cant ever know the absolute value of that tension without a tensiometer. So they can be even tension, but be exceeding the maximum recommended tension (I hope this makes sense). I've built up numerous aluminum and carbon rims in my time. A good stand, dishing tool, tensiometer and patience go a long way.

Good luck!

If you're going to DIY, it might be worth investing in a couple of tools. Recently I bought an Amazon tensiometer. Good investment so far - seems to be repeatable numbers from spoke to spoke. Now whether the absolute kgf is right is another thing, but for sure it seems to have helped my wheel builds a lot.

In theory: read the spoke tension on a chart from the rim supplier, convert that spoke tension to the dimensionless number marked on the tensiometer, measure spokes as you build, adjust as necessary, final true, ride. Last time I built some LB carbon rims, it also gave me the peace of mind that I wasn't going to pull a nipple through a rim.

Yep, regarding the spoke tuning fork method vs. tensiometer... I thought I used to have things under control with the spoke tuning fork method, until I bought the tensiometer. I checked actual tension values after using the tuning fork method, and they were ALL OVER THE MAP.

Yeah I have a good stand and one of the cheesy park tool style tension meters.

I use it as a double check/second opinion if something seems off, but I don't put a ton of stock into the readings honestly.

I really like this article, a very practical and realistic take on tension meters (in my wheel noob opinion):

https://www.wheelpro.co.uk/support/tensiometers/

I like the way he describes how there's a specific point where you take the slack out of the spokes and you can sense it when you get there, and that while going tighter than that does not do much, the window between where you take the slack out and where things are too tight is pretty wide. I'm not very experienced but that's definitely the feeling I've gotten putting wheels together.

Posted by: Kenny

Yeah I have a good stand and one of the cheesy park tool style tension meters.

I use it as a double check/second opinion if something seems off, but I don't put a ton of stock into the readings honestly.

I really like this article, a very practical and realistic take on tension meters (in my wheel noob opinion):

https://www.wheelpro.co.uk/support/tensiometers/

I like the way he describes how there's a specific point where you take the slack out of the spokes and you can sense it when you get there, and that while going tighter than that does not do much, the window between where you take the slack out and where things are too tight is pretty wide. I'm not very experienced but that's definitely the feeling I've gotten putting wheels together.

I have one of those park Tool tensiometers as well. I don't put too much faith in the absolute readings, but I find it very useful to make sure the tension is relatively even for all of the spokes on the same side of the wheel.

I used "The Bicycle Wheel" and a course from the wheel builder at West Point where I was working at the time to build my first pair of wheels. Went really well. One thing I learned when using a tensiometer is that spoke tension can be reduced a lot when a tight fitting tire is mounted. When I was still racing XC I was using really light Stan’s rims which recommended a max tension of 90kgf. Install a tire and tension down a lot. I wanna say down to 70kgf. Even the ENVE rims I built up lost tension. A lot less, maybe 10 kgf. Something worth checking anyway.