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sag

Feb. 10, 2018, 6:42 p.m.
Posts: 2477
Joined: May 23, 2006

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

“The best propaganda is that which, as it were, works invisibly, penetrates the whole of life without the public having any knowledge of the propagandistic initiative.”

Joseph Goebbels

Feb. 10, 2018, 6:49 p.m.
Posts: 11629
Joined: June 4, 2008

Maybe, but it doesn’t matter in the context it’s measured.

Feb. 13, 2018, 8:16 p.m.
Posts: 241
Joined: March 6, 2017

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

Feb. 14, 2018, 8:25 a.m.
Posts: 1263
Joined: Sept. 30, 2006

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

By definition, an offset bushing, well.....ummm.....offsets the eyelet.  So the stroke will stay the same, but the i2i is definitely changed.  How would one expect any difference in geometry if neither the stroke or i2i were changed?

Feb. 14, 2018, 8:32 a.m.
Posts: 241
Joined: March 6, 2017

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

By definition, an offset bushing, well.....ummm.....offsets the eyelet.  So the stroke will stay the same, but the i2i is definitely changed.  How would one expect any difference in geometry if neither the stroke or i2i were changed?

Because its the orientation of the frame on the shock that you're changing. The i2i of the actual shock doesnt change thus the travel amount and sag dont change. Think of any frame with a flip chip system (spartan for example). When you go to slack youre just essentially moving the seatstay up the shock body changing the frame orientation. This doesnt change the actual shock whatsoever.

Feb. 14, 2018, 8:56 a.m.
Posts: 1263
Joined: Sept. 30, 2006

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

By definition, an offset bushing, well.....ummm.....offsets the eyelet. So the stroke will stay the same, but the i2i is definitely changed. How would one expect any difference in geometry if neither the stroke or i2i were changed?

Because its the orientation of the frame on the shock that you're changing. The i2i of the actual shock doesnt change thus the travel amount and sag dont change. Think of any frame with a flip chip system (spartan for example). When you go to slack youre just essentially moving the seatstay up the shock body changing the frame orientation. This doesnt change the actual shock whatsoever.

Flip chip system is different than an offset bushing. An offset bushing definitely changes the effective i2i of the shock.

https://www.offsetbushings.com/pages/how-they-work


 Last edited by: shoreboy on Feb. 14, 2018, 9 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Feb. 14, 2018, 9:06 a.m.
Posts: 241
Joined: March 6, 2017

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

By definition, an offset bushing, well.....ummm.....offsets the eyelet. So the stroke will stay the same, but the i2i is definitely changed. How would one expect any difference in geometry if neither the stroke or i2i were changed?

Because its the orientation of the frame on the shock that you're changing. The i2i of the actual shock doesnt change thus the travel amount and sag dont change. Think of any frame with a flip chip system (spartan for example). When you go to slack youre just essentially moving the seatstay up the shock body changing the frame orientation. This doesnt change the actual shock whatsoever.

Flip chip system is different than an offset bushing. An offset bushing definitely changes the effective i2i of the shock.

https://www.offsetbushings.com/pages/how-they-work

Omg ok all the offset reducer does is change the location of the mounting hardware relative to the shock eye thats machined into the shock body. The only way to change the i2i would be to change the stroke or what have you of the shock. Sag is based on travel of the bike correct? Travel doesnt change when you install offset reducers so you dont have to change the sag. All that changes is the geo of the bike. The offset reducers are just glorified flip chips doing essentially the same thing.

Edit: I guess if you were to say the 'i2i' of the hardware changes then yes I would agree but that still wouldnt change the fact that the travel/sag dont change.


 Last edited by: T-mack on Feb. 14, 2018, 9:09 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Feb. 14, 2018, 9:13 a.m.
Posts: 1263
Joined: Sept. 30, 2006

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

By definition, an offset bushing, well.....ummm.....offsets the eyelet. So the stroke will stay the same, but the i2i is definitely changed. How would one expect any difference in geometry if neither the stroke or i2i were changed?

Because its the orientation of the frame on the shock that you're changing. The i2i of the actual shock doesnt change thus the travel amount and sag dont change. Think of any frame with a flip chip system (spartan for example). When you go to slack youre just essentially moving the seatstay up the shock body changing the frame orientation. This doesnt change the actual shock whatsoever.

Flip chip system is different than an offset bushing. An offset bushing definitely changes the effective i2i of the shock.

https://www.offsetbushings.com/pages/how-they-work

Omg ok all the offset reducer does is change the location of the mounting hardware relative to the shock eye thats machined into the shock body. The only way to change the i2i would be to change the stroke or what have you of the shock. Sag is based on travel of the bike correct? Travel doesnt change when you install offset reducers so you dont have to change the sag. All that changes is the geo of the bike. The offset reducers are just glorified flip chips doing essentially the same thing.

I wasnt actually addressing the sag question. I was merely pointing out that offset bushings change the effective i2i of the shock.


 Last edited by: shoreboy on Feb. 14, 2018, 9:14 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Feb. 14, 2018, 10:29 a.m.
Posts: 781
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

By definition, an offset bushing, well.....ummm.....offsets the eyelet. So the stroke will stay the same, but the i2i is definitely changed. How would one expect any difference in geometry if neither the stroke or i2i were changed?

Because its the orientation of the frame on the shock that you're changing. The i2i of the actual shock doesnt change thus the travel amount and sag dont change. Think of any frame with a flip chip system (spartan for example). When you go to slack youre just essentially moving the seatstay up the shock body changing the frame orientation. This doesnt change the actual shock whatsoever.

Flip chip system is different than an offset bushing. An offset bushing definitely changes the effective i2i of the shock.

https://www.offsetbushings.com/pages/how-they-work

Omg ok all the offset reducer does is change the location of the mounting hardware relative to the shock eye thats machined into the shock body. The only way to change the i2i would be to change the stroke or what have you of the shock. Sag is based on travel of the bike correct? Travel doesnt change when you install offset reducers so you dont have to change the sag. All that changes is the geo of the bike. The offset reducers are just glorified flip chips doing essentially the same thing.

I wasnt actually addressing the sag question. I was merely pointing out that offset bushings change the effective i2i of the shock.

sag = gas

Feb. 14, 2018, 10:36 a.m.
Posts: 241
Joined: March 6, 2017

Posted by: JBV

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

By definition, an offset bushing, well.....ummm.....offsets the eyelet. So the stroke will stay the same, but the i2i is definitely changed. How would one expect any difference in geometry if neither the stroke or i2i were changed?

Because its the orientation of the frame on the shock that you're changing. The i2i of the actual shock doesnt change thus the travel amount and sag dont change. Think of any frame with a flip chip system (spartan for example). When you go to slack youre just essentially moving the seatstay up the shock body changing the frame orientation. This doesnt change the actual shock whatsoever.

Flip chip system is different than an offset bushing. An offset bushing definitely changes the effective i2i of the shock.

https://www.offsetbushings.com/pages/how-they-work

Omg ok all the offset reducer does is change the location of the mounting hardware relative to the shock eye thats machined into the shock body. The only way to change the i2i would be to change the stroke or what have you of the shock. Sag is based on travel of the bike correct? Travel doesnt change when you install offset reducers so you dont have to change the sag. All that changes is the geo of the bike. The offset reducers are just glorified flip chips doing essentially the same thing.

I wasnt actually addressing the sag question. I was merely pointing out that offset bushings change the effective i2i of the shock.

sag = gas

Just quoting this to see how big the quote chain can get

Feb. 14, 2018, 11:11 a.m.
Posts: 11629
Joined: June 4, 2008

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: JBV

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

By definition, an offset bushing, well.....ummm.....offsets the eyelet. So the stroke will stay the same, but the i2i is definitely changed. How would one expect any difference in geometry if neither the stroke or i2i were changed?

Because its the orientation of the frame on the shock that you're changing. The i2i of the actual shock doesnt change thus the travel amount and sag dont change. Think of any frame with a flip chip system (spartan for example). When you go to slack youre just essentially moving the seatstay up the shock body changing the frame orientation. This doesnt change the actual shock whatsoever.

Flip chip system is different than an offset bushing. An offset bushing definitely changes the effective i2i of the shock.

https://www.offsetbushings.com/pages/how-they-work

Omg ok all the offset reducer does is change the location of the mounting hardware relative to the shock eye thats machined into the shock body. The only way to change the i2i would be to change the stroke or what have you of the shock. Sag is based on travel of the bike correct? Travel doesnt change when you install offset reducers so you dont have to change the sag. All that changes is the geo of the bike. The offset reducers are just glorified flip chips doing essentially the same thing.

I wasnt actually addressing the sag question. I was merely pointing out that offset bushings change the effective i2i of the shock.

sag = gas

Just quoting this to see how big the quote chain can get

LolOlOL

Feb. 14, 2018, 1 p.m.
Posts: 2477
Joined: May 23, 2006

Posted by: ReductiMat

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: JBV

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: T-mack

Posted by: tungsten

Do offset bushings change the way sag is achieved?

No because the i2i and stroke remain the same.

By definition, an offset bushing, well.....ummm.....offsets the eyelet. So the stroke will stay the same, but the i2i is definitely changed. How would one expect any difference in geometry if neither the stroke or i2i were changed?

Because its the orientation of the frame on the shock that you're changing. The i2i of the actual shock doesnt change thus the travel amount and sag dont change. Think of any frame with a flip chip system (spartan for example). When you go to slack youre just essentially moving the seatstay up the shock body changing the frame orientation. This doesnt change the actual shock whatsoever.

Flip chip system is different than an offset bushing. An offset bushing definitely changes the effective i2i of the shock.

https://www.offsetbushings.com/pages/how-they-work

Omg ok all the offset reducer does is change the location of the mounting hardware relative to the shock eye thats machined into the shock body. The only way to change the i2i would be to change the stroke or what have you of the shock. Sag is based on travel of the bike correct? Travel doesnt change when you install offset reducers so you dont have to change the sag. All that changes is the geo of the bike. The offset reducers are just glorified flip chips doing essentially the same thing.

I wasnt actually addressing the sag question. I was merely pointing out that offset bushings change the effective i2i of the shock.

sag = gas

Just quoting this to see how big the quote chain can get

LolOlOL

Thanks for the help!

Feb. 14, 2018, 1:22 p.m.
Posts: 11629
Joined: June 4, 2008

Good stuff.

Feb. 26, 2018, 11:01 a.m.
Posts: 2
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

The LR on my bike is progressive to linear in the last 10mm of travel and adding an offset bushing pushed the travel up 3mm by eliminating that last bit of linearity and gaining a bit more progression to the beginning of the stroke so it can effect the sag to a degree.

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