NSMB Forum test thread: Specialized tires

After having to take a 2 week hiatus from the bikes, I finally got to get back out there and formulate more of an opinion on these tires.

Test Bike: 29er Rocky Mountain Element
Front: Butcher 29x2.3
Rear: Ground Control 29x 2.3
Both tires are mounted tubeless, I had no trouble getting either of them to mount or maintain pressure

My first couple of rides back and I figured a good loop would be the Whistler Valley trails - Flank via Alpine then down Bintys, Billy Epic [HTML_REMOVED] Bobs Rebob, followed the next day with a loop up Stonebridge climb, to Legalize it, Bush Doctor and Danimal.

Climbing
I am finding the Ground Control to be a suitable climbing tire so far (still looking forward to testing it out in the wet though) I have no trouble with traction while climbing through looser trail bed, and find it holds on well while climbing up steeper pitches as well.

Descending
Ground Control: I think I said in my first post that I liked the Ground Control, and I still do. I find that it rolls fast and corners well. I will note that I keep finding there is an area between the centre and when the side knobs kick in where I find I get a little bit loose. Nothing out of control and it[HTML_REMOVED]#8217;s totally predictable. It[HTML_REMOVED]#8217;s only something I notice on the steeper looser terrain.

Butcher: The Butcher is a lot of front tire! The conditions this weekend were pretty good for riding the Whistler valley, so final judgment will come over time, but my first impressions are good. I had no trouble with traction on the steep and still somewhat loose trails on the Flank, I found it kept good control and grip down the loose chutes. The side knobs dug in and allowed me to corner with control and confidence and I found the traction on the rock rollers to be great.

More to come…

Two more longer rides on the 29r tires, both in Whistler.

Really pleased with the rolling resistance (lack of) on the GC on the rear, as we've been commuting the 4km from Creekside to Function for riding and a mix of singletrack and doubletrack climbing.

Finally had some moisture to test the tires in, albeit not much, as the ground is soaking it up pretty fast.

Ride #1 was Creekside to Interp Forest via highway, then up Eastside Trail (crushed gravel and soft-pack new trail work), the up See Colours and Puke (firm singletrack climbing with switchbacks), down Babylon by Bike (high speed straight-aways and lots of rolling jumps), Tunnel Vision (really varied from rocks slabs to high speed rooted gullies), back along highway and up Microwave Road (loose steep gravel road) to IBT (punchy tech descents and climbs), to AM/PM (rollicking good times and some steeps), then long road climb up Bayshores to kadenwoods for a final descent to Creekside via Big Timber.

That ride pretty much put the tires to the test in very mixed and variable terrain. It had rained pretty good the night before. On the climbs, traction was at a premium and gravel roads had firmed up, loam was tight, and the GC on the rear climbed very very well with the Butcher going where it was pointed and hooking up on the tighter switchbacks of See Colours.

This ride felt so fun and so fast - a combination of knowing these trails reasonably well and confidence in the bike and the tires. This set of trails was ready-made for an all mountain 29r and the Specialized tires complemented this setup particularly well. I know we're supposed to pick at flaws, but compared to the Conti combo and the previous Ardent setup, the GC/Butcher combination continue to ride flawlessy. I'm still waiting for fall goo to really thest the GC on the rear, but am pretty convinced now the Butcher will stay on the front until it's dead.

On the burlier descents and quick transitions of IBT and AM/PM, I had no trouble keeping the GC on the ground and in control. I don't feel the roll-over between top knobs and side knobs noted by AussieDreamZ, or it's a smooth shift that feels natural.

Ride #2 was Creekside to Function via the highway, then up Flank from behind Olives (tight switchbacks on loam, followed by long packed and loose gravel/rock climbs), descending Pura Vida and Moose Knuckles (mixed singletrack from buff to moderate slabs and one chunder gully), short climb up Sproat/A La Mode/etc to Lower Sproat to descend Three Birds (fun and fast singletrack) on Middle Danimal (fast fast fast) to exit a Stonebridge, up road to North Danimal for quick bombing down diverse intermediate singletrack (fast and flowy, rooty and rough, some wood features), back to Creekside via Valley Trail.

Nothing much to add… the tires continue to perform exactly as I could hope. I've never once slipped out, lost control, or punched a hole and regretted having these tires on my wheels.

Durability… no signs of premature wear of fatigue. Rubber is holding up well, sidewalls show no stress, air is still in the ghetto tubeless setup. Seems a good blend of stick and durability.

Now it's time to put some miles on the big bike to see if I feel the same with the 26" fatties.

6/7 weeks of having my Purgatory Control on the back of my Tallboy LTC and it is definitely looking tired. I do ride hard 2/3 times a week but my upcoming weekend in Whitehorse might be its last. I take a pic but the inside of the shoulder knobs are very worn now and I would say I am at 50% wear now. Still a good rear tire but would love a slight stiffer sidewall on the tire.

My Butcher up front is awesome but again susceptible to the pressure you run at and would be good with a stiffer sidewall.

I finally got two of my tires the other day and managed a ride on them this afternoon, so I'll post up first impressions.

The Bike

Photo from last week with the older tires. I was going to take an up-to-date photo but that was interrupted by a ride.

The bike that these are going on is a 2013 Knolly Chilcotin, used to pedal up (both fireroad and technical uphills), and then rip down. Because of this I tried to make it clear during my phone interview that I wanted something that would climb well through our technical trails, and still manage the descents. So far Specialized sent me a 2.3 Purgatory Control, and a 2.3 Ground Control. They were backordered on the 2.3 Butcher Control so that should be along when stock is back up. These two tires are replacing a 2.35 Bontrager Big Earl front and a 2.35 Maxxis Crossmark rear with the round side knobs cut off.

Initial Impressions.
2.3 Purgatory Control - Front on Stans Flow rim

Weight - 688g

I wanted to set this one up tubeless so the first thing I did was mount it up with a tube and leave it overnight to try and set the tire shape a little better. My initial thoughts handling the tire were that the sidewall was awfully thin and seemed to lack a little support, but the rubber felt grippier in my fingers than the tire I was removing. It also took a lot of effort and soapy water sprayed on the sidewall to get the tire to seat properly, which made me question the decision to set it up tubeless.

I'm running a Stans Flow in the front, with Gorilla tape in place of the rim strip and an ounce or so of Stans fluid for a not-quite-ghetto tubeless setup. Contrary to the difficulties I had mounting it with a tube, it snapped right in very quickly, and I was even able to air the tire up with a foot pump.

Once mounted, I took a quick peak at the tread. The spacing seems good to shed mud, and while the centre knobs are a little shallow, the corner knobs seem to be a bit deeper for grip. It'll be interesting to see how these hold up and if they'll fold over when pushed. The tire profile is a lot more rounded than I am used to, but I do find that I'm leaning the bike over more in corners than I used to so we'll see how the big chunky side knobs do.

2.3 Ground Control - Rear on Mavic 721 rim

Weight - 625g

This tire I'm planning on setting up tubeless in the future but I don't have an extra stem, so in the meantime I'm running it with tubes. It's mounted on a Mavic 721, and as I noted above, it's replacing a Maxxis Crossmark. As with the Purgatory, the sidewalls felt thin to me, and I was wondering how this tire would do under my 270lbs and some hard corners.

The Ground Control mounted up very easily. First impressions of the tire itself were again a more rounded profile than I am used to, and relatively shallow knobs. I do like the big blocky centre knobs though, I am guessing that I'm going to get much better grip than I had with my Crossmarks (not hard, I know), although I suspect that rolling resistance will suffer.

The ride

My first ride on these tires was in Cumberland. We've had some interesting weather on the Island for the last little while. Most of the summer was very hot, and the moisture had been baked out of the trails making all but the most treed areas very dusty and loose. The last week though we've had a lot of rain, and I assumed (wrongly) that today's ride would be through big puddles and there would be a lot of mud. Turns out that the ground was nowhere near saturated after the last week of rain, and most of the trails were a little damp but still very solid. Roots would prove to be slippery, but not at the level they get in the winter when they've formed a nice layer of slime.

I started the ride up Two [HTML_REMOVED] A Juice and Buggered Pig. For those that have ridden these Cumberland classics, they're technical up but without any really difficult sections. There is some chicken wired woodwork on Buggered Pig, and really the challenge was not spinning out on some of the short steep climbs while passing over roots. The Ground Control started to prove it's worth immediately. It actually felt like it was rolling as well as the Crossmark, but it dug in on the climbs and didn't slip or spin out. It did slide around on the roots a little, but nothing extreme, and part of that may have been a high tire pressure that I corrected midway up the trail.

From the lower trails I headed up the access roads to Bear Buns. This is a rooty, twisty trail with a few short climbs that will start off the upcoming Dodge City Enduro on 15 September. I lowered the air pressure a little more on both tires, and dropped in to the rock face that starts the descent, trying to keep up with a friend who was trying to seed himself for the enduro.

Right off the bat I found that I had a bit of the "first wet ride" jitters. I wasn't sure how much grip I'd have so I didn't push things as much on this trail as it really isn't very forgiving. I took the time to find where I'd grip and where I'd slip, so no land speed records were set on the way down. By the time I got to Sykes Bridge I was pretty confident that I knew where I could push the tires, so we headed up to Lower Thirsty Beaver to give it a shot.

Thirsty was wet, but other than the woodwork everything was still very grippy. I managed a PR on the trail, and found that the way the tires didn't let go all at once, but in a gradual way that allowed me to maintain control. The sidewalls were a bit of an issue in some of the more banked corners here, and with the lower tire pressure I felt the rim hit a few of the roots when I came up short on a couple I was trying to double. All in all though I was impressed with the ability of the tires to hold a line without slipping.

At this point the rest of the ride was just trying to figure out limits of the tires. I'm still not entirely happy with the sidewalls: the Control casing seems very thin and I could feel things rolling over a little in the back when I hit the berms on Teapot. Some of that may be tire pressure, so I'm going to play around with that on the next couple of rides. I'm also going to try to get a ride up Forbidden Plateau in the next couple of weeks as some of the rock in there can really do a number of tires. I'm also a little concerned about wear, as the rubber does feel very soft. It'll be interesting to see how many rides it takes for any wear to become noticeable. The grip on the other hand was pretty good for the first real wet ride I've had since April or May. It's obviously too early for a final verdict, but so far I'm happy with how the tires are behaving and am looking forward to putting them through some more rooty and rocky rides to test those limits.

Update on both 26 and 29r tires.

Been riding the 29r up and down BBY Mtn daily as it's my commute and the tires are holding up well. No air pressure burps on the ghetto tubeless and really nice trail feel. Still liking very much the Butcher on front… truly and exceptional tire that inspires confidence.

The Ground Control on rear is still a good performing, but riding trails I know very very well and ride very quickly, I have noticed a tendancy on fast buff corners (Gear Jammer, for example), that if I really lean the corner hard with confidence, the tire will flex and cut loose. Fortunately, it quickly refinds itself, but there is a section on the rounded profile when pushed hard at speed, will let go leaving a moment of life-saving uncertainty. That said, it does recover and with 40% of my commute being on pavement, it's still a fine blend of fast rolling and good traction. As things get wetter, we'll see if I feel the same.

As for the 26r, I've finally got some miles on them with the big 2.5 Butcher up front and the little 2.3 Butcher on the back end. That said, the 2.3 measures equally fat sidewall to sidewall as the Maxxis Highroller II that it's replacing and the Butcher 2.5 front is wider than the 2.5 Maxxis Minion DHF it's replacing. So it's a solid looking set of wheels.

This is also mounted tubeless. Now, I only have a couple rides, both on familiar trails that had that "fresh sheen" of fall wetness basically turning dust on roots into slime and grease. When rolling straight or landing drops or jumps, I noticed nothing but a solid and plush thud on landing and good handling of maintaining the line. No squirmies.

However, at speed, I am feeling the tires roll more than I expected; perhaps the DH casing is not as robust as the Maxxis DH casing; which could be the case as the tires were both (by hand test only) lighter than the Maxxis they replaced. Given that I"m running them tubeless I have lower PSI than I'd normally run (trying them at 25), so I will pump up to 29 or so and see if that gives more confidence. Certainly they seem durable, with no flats, but first impression has left me with straight-line big air smiles, but high speed corner nervousness….

I'll keep getting this bike out as much as possible.

Update on the Fast Trak.

Trail conditions have changed significantly since I last posted on this tire. The dry marble has been replaced with hard pack and slippery roots. I've had a half dozen rides on it as a rear tire and it's proving to be a winner in these conditions.

I'm also liking this tire on mixed surfaces such as asphalt and gravel. Pedaling 5k to the singletrack on pavement was fast and quiet. Fast Trak climbing and conering performance on the singletrack was great, but braking requires some anticipation as there is just not enough tread to deal with sudden stops. Local trail knowledge definitely helps reduce some of the risk.

I'm still running the Fast Trak matched with a tubed Ignitor up front but I plan to replace the Ignitor with my tubeless GC. Stay tuned.

Update on both 26 and 29r tires.

Been riding the 29r up and down BBY Mtn daily as it's my commute and the tires are holding up well. No air pressure burps on the ghetto tubeless and really nice trail feel. Still liking very much the Butcher on front… truly and exceptional tire that inspires confidence.

The Ground Control on rear is still a good performing, but riding trails I know very very well and ride very quickly, I have noticed a tendancy on fast buff corners (Gear Jammer, for example), that if I really lean the corner hard with confidence, the tire will flex and cut loose. Fortunately, it quickly refinds itself, but there is a section on the rounded profile when pushed hard at speed, will let go leaving a moment of life-saving uncertainty. That said, it does recover and with 40% of my commute being on pavement, it's still a fine blend of fast rolling and good traction. As things get wetter, we'll see if I feel the same.

As for the 26r, I've finally got some miles on them with the big 2.5 Butcher up front and the little 2.3 Butcher on the back end. That said, the 2.3 measures equally fat sidewall to sidewall as the Maxxis Highroller II that it's replacing and the Butcher 2.5 front is wider than the 2.5 Maxxis Minion DHF it's replacing. So it's a solid looking set of wheels.

This is also mounted tubeless. Now, I only have a couple rides, both on familiar trails that had that "fresh sheen" of fall wetness basically turning dust on roots into slime and grease. When rolling straight or landing drops or jumps, I noticed nothing but a solid and plush thud on landing and good handling of maintaining the line. No squirmies.

However, at speed, I am feeling the tires roll more than I expected; perhaps the DH casing is not as robust as the Maxxis DH casing; which could be the case as the tires were both (by hand test only) lighter than the Maxxis they replaced. Given that I"m running them tubeless I have lower PSI than I'd normally run (trying them at 25), so I will pump up to 29 or so and see if that gives more confidence. Certainly they seem durable, with no flats, but first impression has left me with straight-line big air smiles, but high speed corner nervousness….

I'll keep getting this bike out as much as possible.

Fasttrak on the rear for BBY…..seriously, you don't get that break away on GJ cement like you did with the GC. Insane speed, braking, ummm well not so much (especially on a hard tail;)

29x 2.3 Ground Control

When I pulled this one out of the box I was skeptical at best. It is of decent girth, the tread design looked decent but the tread depth left me questioning whether it was going to work for me at all. I was hesitant to even put it on the bike. My riding style is not very aggressive but this would be the most XC oriented tire I had used since moving to BC 6 years ago.

But, after a dozen or so rides on it over the last month I am convinced this tire is worth a buy. It punches in well above its weight class traction wise and still rolls better then average. Compared to the 2.1 Crossmark I had on the bike previous it gives up next to nothing in rolling resistance but significantly out corners, climb and brakes the Maxxis.

I have experienced the same slide out phenomenon as some of the other reviewers when really pushing this tire. It catches quickly though and is pretty predictable when it does release. Any combination of steep, loose and wet technical terrain is not this this tires strong points but it does hold its own.

I am going to throw the Purgatory on the rear and the Butcher on the front for the upcoming fall riding season when things are sure to get a bit wetter then August was.

As a proper send off I took this tire out for a late afternoon ride yesterday that best suited it. Riverside-Cheakamus Lake-Singing Creek and back. As expected it railed those trails.

I have finally been spending more time on the 26r with the DH Casing Butchers - 2.5 front and 2.4 rear - mounted ghetto tubeless.

Yesterday in the WBP, it was a serious case of brown pow plus massive trail maintenance by crews, mostly on the lower mountain. This time I pumped the tires to 29psi.

All I can say is awesome. The feeling of the tires rolling on the rim - especially the 2.4 rear - was now gone. A combination of the tires and the conditions probably had this as my fastest most confident day in the park in recent memory.

On tech single track with some still greasy roots and slabs, I had absolute confidence in tracking fast but precarious lines without questioning that the tires will go where I send them. Like my 29r, the Butcher is quickly becoming the most confident front tire for west coast riding that I have ever been on. It found grip on wet glossy roots and never faltered in a corner. Trails like Tech Noir, Crack Addict, and O Sin were a joy. The rear did nothing but stay tracking straight and true through it all.

When things turned fast on DM, A Line, and Freight Train, I loved the speed of the 2.4 over my previous Minion DHF 2.5 and the just-as-fast feeling rolling than the newer 2.4 Highroller II that it replaced. I think I perhaps tracked my best lap both for speed and air on Freigh Train…. Meaning that no one caught or passed me on what was a pretty busy Sunday. That helped the 40 year old ego.

So, 29psi turned these tires from meh to YEAH! So far tread wear is negligible and I truly look forward to riding these more now that things are gonna turn wet.

Oh yeah, and first park day in a long time with no burps or flats. And I know for certainty that I bottomed the front and rear tire each once to the rim. No flat spots perpetuating through to the rims either.

It has not been my month, after recovering from a minor concussion I now find myself sidelined for a few weeks from a broken clavicle. Luckily I got a few more good rides in (and photos) before breaking myself!

Part One:

A mid week ride with the Muddbunnies allowed me to finally get tires to dirt in North Vancouver. A quick rip on Fromme saw us heading down Expresso and then across the Baden Powell. It had rained the day before after the hot dry summer we have had and it was like the dust had been turned to a layer of lubricant on all the rocks and wood.

This being said, after a hesitant start I found that the front tire (Butcher) held as well as I could hope for in these unpredictable conditions. The Ground Control plus any brake engagement on the slick rocks and roots made for a slightly more unpredictable experience, but as I noted at the start conditions were pretty evil.

Back to Whistler

Decided to take in a little adventure in the No Flow Zone, I was curious after my Wednesday night Bunnie ride how the Whistler trails would treat me. For those unfamiliar with Whistler I guess I would describe the no flow zone as rocky and sometimes rooty punchy climbs and descents (I believe it was originally and still is a popular trials moto area) add rain a couple days previous and it makes for a fun time.

I found the Ground Control to generally have good traction on both the rock and the chunder while climbing. I was able to make all the punchy climbs that I usually make but spun out in a couple of sections (I assume this is pilot error and nothing to do with my tires, unfortunately)

I also found both tires to maintain good traction on the descents, both on the rock slabs and on the more inconsistent trail surface. I am starting to feel comfortable and confident with these tires and am really looking forward to putting them through their paces more over the fall/winter.

Part Two to follow shortly (One handed typing is hard!)

I still don't have any pictures, but I've got an update on the tires. Still no Butcher in the mail, I think I'll contact Specialized and see if the Grid UST models are coming out soon as I'd like to give that a try on the back tire.

So far the Purgatory has been great in the front. Conditions haven't been extreme in either direction, there are a few dusty patches in Cumberland but for the most part things are dry but solid after the last bit of rain we've been having. I've been pushing the front as much as I can and I'm impressed with the ability of the Purgatory to hook up in the corners. Performance on the rocky slabs on Forbidden Plateau has been great, but I expect that given the dry conditions we have now. When the wet sets in, I'll have to re-evaluate as that will be the real test for this tire.

The Ground Control was what I was having issues with. Climbing ability on loose trails and rolling resistance is fantastic, braking performance is decent although not stellar. I'm guessing some of that lack of rolling resistance is tied to the lack of braking performance, especially in loose and rocky soil. The big issue I had though was the lackluster sidewalls. I was running around 25-27psi in the back, close to what I normally run, and I found that the sidewalls weren't giving me very much support in hard corners. Push the tire too much and it feels like it wiggles under the bike, trying to get out from underneath me.

To counter that feeling, I've been messing with tire pressure in the back. I've gone up as high as 32psi, but found that too much, leading to a rough feeling especially over small bumps. I've been steadily lowering the pressure, trying to find the sweet spot, but I'm not there yet. 30psi was ok, but I think I'm going to try 28 on Friday morning and see if that helps. Again, I'm a big guy so this might not apply to everyone, but I'm anxious to try Specialized heavier duty sidewalls to see if that helps my issues.

Up and down and up and down and up and down Burnaby Mtn 4 days per week for work and the tires are holding out well on the 29r. Tread wear proving to be very good.

As for tire pressure, I'm running about 30psi tubeless, as my ride does include about 4km of road to get to the base of Burnaby Mtn. GC rolls well on pavement without too much whirring.

Did a more tech-centric ride last night, but with the dry conditions after some rain, the trails were pretty much glory and probably no tire would suck.

We rode Eagle, climbed the gas line to the hydro line and the up Physiotherapy. From there we descended Hammertime, top of Randy's, and then Juan Valdez (thanks DM) to backyard trails. So a good mix of flowy loam goodness, to some solid steeps on Hammertime. Then some nice gaps on Upper Randy's and more gaps, a slab, and some woodwork on Juan Valdez. Sort of an "everything BC can offer in one ride kinda' ride".

The tires proved their versatility, with just good solid control. In the perfect loamy goodness, I experienced no loss of traction and I'm learning how to just trust to drift the GC on fast corners, knowing it will snap back and regain traction. The Butcher on front remains bomber.

I completely cased one of the gaps (the entry gap) on Juan Valdez and bottomed my rear tire on the rim on the edge of the transition. No burp, no loss of air, no flat spot, just kept riding. Good job, Ground Control.

Shots from the ride - mostly Mrs. WH as I only had my cell phone in my pocket for photos:

Trail signage spelling errors rule:

Met a trail fairy that was in the process of raking out all of Physio - we got first tracks for most of the Physio Climb - here the Butcher smiles as it approaches the equivalent of trail-side corduroy:

Mrs. WH railing one of the features on Hammertime:

The glorious loam of Eagle:

Heading out and then up towards Randy's:

Plenty o' grip and control with the 2.3 Specialized rubber on Juan Valdez:

Butcher 2.5 front and 2.4 rear is inspiring as much confidence as my previous Minion DHF/HighrollerII combo in the same dimensions, but with a bit less wieght. Rolling resistance up Fromme is about the same. They continue to track well in a straight line and when landing and remain very predictable when layed over.

I tried dropping the PSI again just for kicks and giggles now that I'm used to how they perform and trust them. Back down to 26 from 29/30ish. Nope, they get squeemish - running them tubeless. Back up to 29 and they run great. No flats in a couple park days, some Fromme days, and some drops to semi-flat on Eagle.

ok… so the absolute crap has rolled in the last couple weeks. The riding has been ranging from fresh, wet, and slick mud that does not stick, to day-old mud that is starting to set up and really stick. I find riding when it's pouring easier or smoother than when it's showering and the mud has started to glock-up (technical term warning).

29er update: The Butcher on front continues to win win win. Right through the dry of August through the crap of this morning. Win. Very happy with this tire and it exudes confidence in all kinds of terrain.

The Ground Control on the back has met its match. Fortunately, as things slowly turned from dry to damp, I have learned to control the break-lose point of this tire on mid-speed to high-speed turns mid-apex. They pretty much predictably cut loose when leaning the bike at speed. However, I've learned to feel when this is about to happen, then let it go, and roll a bit further and they hook up again. But there is a dead tractionless void somewhere as it rolls over. In this new really wet really muddy weather, it's even more pronounced and getting traction back is less predictable. Especially now that the clipless have gone back on for winter riding season. I'll leave the Ground Control on for now, and see how bad it gets in terms of confidence once the light disappears for the downhill commute home and I'm greasing around on Nicole's and Gear Jammer in the dark each day.

26er update: Butchers front and back in 2.5 front and 2.4 rear with DH casing tubeless. Not a single flat or burp since these have been on. Kept at 29psi. A joy to ride. I see why this is the standard setup for their DH team. Really solid, really confidence inspiring and great grip on corners front and rear, even in this new very very very wet and muddy reality. The new test has been straight-line braking in the mud. Solid. Once I got the psi dialed this combo is working very well for me. As good, if not better than my Highroller II front and DHF rear with (so far) more flat tire reliability and better airing up tubeless.