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NSMB - 2021 - Hardtail Thread

Sept. 15, 2021, 7:05 p.m.
Posts: 1070
Joined: May 11, 2018

Posted by: velocipedestrian

Posted by: RAHrider

I figure I will use the sagged geo off my primer to decide on the fork length. I ride my primer with a 170mm fork and with a 10mm spacer under the stem and about 25% sag, the position is perfect. As I am using the stylus 27.5 geo, I took the ac height off a 27.5 lyric at 170mm travel, subtract 20mm for the bigger 29 wheel height and another 40mm off for 25% sag giving an ac height of about 500mm. 

My hardtail is currently rigid - the Surly Karate Monkey fork is 490mm A-C, boost, at least 15mm/side clearance around a DHF 29x2.5 on a 30mm rim, and has all the bosses. 

It's heavy, but you wanted to go slower, right? 

The bike you're describing sounds a bit like mine. Pipedream Moxie. 27.5x2.8 rear, 29 front, 44mm headtube, steel... Maybe more shopping around could save you the custom hassle? (totally understand if that's part of the appeal).

That's almost exactly what I am thinking. Does that setup maintain your hta and bb height? I would think the hta might steepen and the bb drop? How do the angles hold up? More importantly, how does it ride? Any pictures?

I was going to go with Marino for the custom job. It's really affordable. Ever since I found out about them I've wanted to try building something a bit crazy, thos might be it!

Sept. 15, 2021, 11:40 p.m.
Posts: 146
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Posted by: RAHrider

Posted by: velocipedestrian

Posted by: RAHrider

I figure I will use the sagged geo off my primer to decide on the fork length. I ride my primer with a 170mm fork and with a 10mm spacer under the stem and about 25% sag, the position is perfect. As I am using the stylus 27.5 geo, I took the ac height off a 27.5 lyric at 170mm travel, subtract 20mm for the bigger 29 wheel height and another 40mm off for 25% sag giving an ac height of about 500mm. 

My hardtail is currently rigid - the Surly Karate Monkey fork is 490mm A-C, boost, at least 15mm/side clearance around a DHF 29x2.5 on a 30mm rim, and has all the bosses. 

It's heavy, but you wanted to go slower, right? 

The bike you're describing sounds a bit like mine. Pipedream Moxie. 27.5x2.8 rear, 29 front, 44mm headtube, steel... Maybe more shopping around could save you the custom hassle? (totally understand if that's part of the appeal).

That's almost exactly what I am thinking. Does that setup maintain your hta and bb height? I would think the hta might steepen and the bb drop? How do the angles hold up? More importantly, how does it ride? Any pictures?

I was going to go with Marino for the custom job. It's really affordable. Ever since I found out about them I've wanted to try building something a bit crazy, thos might be it!

I don't have a comparison with a suspension fork yet, sorry. I'm building up the bike slowly - I started with the rigid fork and skinny 29" wheels with touring tyres. It made for the longest slackest 'entouro' bike in town, and rides pretty nicely in that imaginary category. I'll use it like that for gravel touring. 

The stays didn't clear a proper 29" tyre, so it's mullet. I've ridden easy trails with proper tyres and my son riding shotgun, and felt good. The 490mm A-C is roughly 60mm from bottom out of a proper fork, so eventual HA depends on the chosen travel. If I fully drop a heel at 6 o'clock with 175mm cranks I can drag the dirt, but I have long achilles - it's low, but manageable. 

Entouro

Sept. 16, 2021, 5:37 a.m.
Posts: 678
Joined: Sept. 10, 2012

Posted by: RAHrider

That's almost exactly what I am thinking. Does that setup maintain your hta and bb height? I would think the hta might steepen and the bb drop? How do the angles hold up? More importantly, how does it ride? Any pictures?

The Pipedream Sirius is made for a 100-120mm fork so a rigid Surly type fork would maintain the geo and you could still add a suspension fork later if you wanted. Price is decent and they are in stock...at least in my size. Fits up to 29 x 3.0" tire in the rear.

https://www.pipedreamcycles.com/shop/sirius/

Price with shipping to BC is ~$1200CAD last time I did the conversion. One par with the other production steel UK frames and I think comparable to a new Surly frame/fork last time I checked.


 Last edited by: Vikb on Sept. 16, 2021, 5:52 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Sept. 18, 2021, 8:29 a.m.
Posts: 4889
Joined: July 9, 2004

Smith Creek Cycle in West Kelowna carries Pipedream frames. Cool ship will a good a good vibe with a bunch of frames hanging from the wall. 

I compared their price to direct from Pipedream and it’s about the same but you remove the potential hassle of the CBA or DHL mischarging you. 

Pretty sure they ship as well. 

https://www.smithcreekcycle.ca/

Sept. 18, 2021, 4:03 p.m.
Posts: 1070
Joined: May 11, 2018

Andrew was nice enough to share his insights on rigid riding, which was really helpful. Thanks for the suggestions here. I think I'm gonna go custom as the geo with a rigid fork is a bit funny.

The bb drop is a bit challenging but I think I'm going to go 45mm as that is likely where the stylus would sit sagged. I'm also going to go with a longer headtube at 135 as I am always fighting trying not to add spacers to avoid shortening reach. As for the angles, I think 64/75 will be good. I'm pretty stoked on this project. It will likely take about 16 weeks or so, maybe in time for Xmas! I'll post pics down the road...hopefully not in the 2022 hardtail thread.

Sept. 19, 2021, 7:11 p.m.
Posts: 426
Joined: Jan. 2, 2018

Sounds cool! I've been shopping for a rigid fork for my chameleon that will continue to see shore riding post rigid conversion and it seems the majority of boost, through axle, 29er rigid forks have an axle to crown of around 490mm, so in my mind that's a good dimension to base the rest of the geometry around.

Definitely agree on going with a long head tube.

Personal preference maybe, but I'd want more bb drop than that, though. 

My chameleon has 55mm of drop with 29er dropouts and a suspension fork (and I run it 275+ on the shore sometimes) and a chromag surface voyager has 50mm.

I think if I was running a 27.5+ rear wheel I'd want at least 55mm and if 29er I'd want at least 60.

I think especially rigid you get away with a pretty low BB, and this is coming from someone who dislikes pedal strikes.


 Last edited by: Kenny on Sept. 19, 2021, 7:13 p.m., edited 2 times in total.
Sept. 21, 2021, 10:32 a.m.
Posts: 1070
Joined: May 11, 2018

I think your suggestion to increase the drop is a good one. My 27.5 hardtail has a 50mm drop that would be more like 60-65 sagged and it feels fine. I'm not sure why chromag uses so little on the stylus. It's a pretty low stack with small wheels, high bb and short head tube. 

I want the ability to run a suspension fork and besides, I like the riding position of a reasonable stack. I'm getting the fork made as well so I can put the front end wherever I want, which is nice.

Sept. 21, 2021, 12:35 p.m.
Posts: 1
Joined: Sept. 21, 2021

I'm riding a Pipedream Sirius. The build quality is very good and it uses a nice tube set. They are designed around a 65* head angle given a sagged 100mm fork. I've got a 120mm z2 and wouldn't want it much slacker. The stack height is pretty low on that frame, so I think many would end up running spacers or higher rise bars. I bought it from Brian at Smith Creek Cycle in Kelowna - solid dude, nice shop.

Sept. 21, 2021, 3:34 p.m.
Posts: 9
Joined: March 24, 2020

I've finally figured out how to post pictures... So here's my hardtail

Canfield Nimble 9 Chery Cola XL frame

Rockshox Lyrik Ultimate matte 160mm 42mm offset

We are one Insider Carbon wheelset with DT350 hubs

Dissector 2,4/Rekon 2.4

Shimano XT shifter, SLX rear mech 12 speed, SLX cassette, XT chain, SLX 4 pistons brakes

Galfer 180mm rotors, Galfer pro pads

Raceface Turbine Crankset 170mm

Absolute black oval 32T

Oneup V2 dropper (200mm!) with oneup lever

Sqlab 611 Ergowave saddle

Sqlab 30X carbon bars, 16 degrees backswept, 45mm rise

Spank pedals and stem

Ergon grip


 Last edited by: LewisQC on Sept. 22, 2021, 6:02 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Sept. 21, 2021, 3:39 p.m.
Posts: 426
Joined: Jan. 2, 2018

Posted by: RAHrider

I think your suggestion to increase the drop is a good one. My 27.5 hardtail has a 50mm drop that would be more like 60-65 sagged and it feels fine. I'm not sure why chromag uses so little on the stylus. It's a pretty low stack with small wheels, high bb and short head tube. 

I want the ability to run a suspension fork and besides, I like the riding position of a reasonable stack. I'm getting the fork made as well so I can put the front end wherever I want, which is nice.

I get the sense that the stylus is a bit of an anomaly - intended as an almost combo trail bike/pseudo dirtjumper, I think this results in the geo having a couple compromises in the context of a straight up trail bike.

Sept. 22, 2021, 2:39 a.m.
Posts: 43
Joined: March 14, 2017

Posted by: LewisQC

I've finally figured out how to post pictures... So here's my hardtail

Canfield Nimble 9 Chery Cola XL frame

Rockshox Lyrik Ultimate matte 160mm 42mm offset

We are one Insider Carbon wheelset with DT350 hubs

Dissector 2,4/Rekon 2.4

Shimano XT shifter, SLX rear mech 12 speed, SLX cassette, XT chain, SLX 4 pistons brakes

Galfer 180mm rotors, Galfer pro pads

Raceface Turbine Crankset 170mm

Absolute black oval 32T

Oneup V2 dropper (210mm!) with oneup lever

Sqlab 611 Ergowave saddle

Sqlab 30X carbon bars, 16 degrees backswept, 45mm rise

Spank pedals and stem

Ergon grip

That colour is amazing!  Lovely looking bike!

Sept. 22, 2021, 6:17 a.m.
Posts: 9
Joined: March 24, 2020

Posted by: DanLees1978

Posted by: LewisQC

I've finally figured out how to post pictures... So here's my hardtail

Canfield Nimble 9 Chery Cola XL frame

Rockshox Lyrik Ultimate matte 160mm 42mm offset

We are one Insider Carbon wheelset with DT350 hubs

Dissector 2,4/Rekon 2.4

Shimano XT shifter, SLX rear mech 12 speed, SLX cassette, XT chain, SLX 4 pistons brakes

Galfer 180mm rotors, Galfer pro pads

Raceface Turbine Crankset 170mm

Absolute black oval 32T

Oneup V2 dropper (210mm!) with oneup lever

Sqlab 611 Ergowave saddle

Sqlab 30X carbon bars, 16 degrees backswept, 45mm rise

Spank pedals and stem

Ergon grip

That colour is amazing! Lovely looking bike!

Thanks! It really is a georgous frame. The color in real life is even better, it has a sparkling effect in sun light very hard to show with a regular picture.

Sept. 22, 2021, 8:34 p.m.
Posts: 90
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Very nice colour and build indeed! I rolled on that bridge a few hours ago, always a good spot to snap a picture : ) Cheers!

Sept. 24, 2021, 10:03 a.m.
Posts: 76
Joined: May 11, 2017

Can anyone confirm the hub spacing on the Moxie's? The store is saying superboost but everything I can find online says 148 boost... 

When I quizzed the shop about it they measured the frame on the floor and said it was 155ish... could clamp down to 148  or up to 157 I guess.... but don't want to have issues with the brakes etc.

Want to make sure it's 148 before I get it shipped from Kelowna....

Sept. 24, 2021, 2:51 p.m.
Posts: 6
Joined: Sept. 3, 2021

Thought I'd share my 2021 Norco Torrent on this thread. This bike serves multiple functions for me, including:

1. Summer trail bike when I'm heading out on mellow trails, or when I fancy a bigger challenge on a more technical trail.

2. Winter trail ripper using 29x2.6" Wrathchilds, pogies and lights.

3. Bikepacking rig when loaded up with a few bags.

It's already gone through a few iterations in terms of setup. i've swapped out a Lyrik for a Fox 36 and have been swapping out my tires (2.6" Assegai (F), Rekon (F+R), SE2 (R)) dependant on what i'm planning to ride. I rode this as my only bike during much of summer 2021 whilst trying to source parts to build up my FS. It wrangled with whether this bike really could be my only MTB... it's so capable for my riding ability and serves so many purposes. I'm still struggling with this decision now of what I need vs. what I want.


 Last edited by: Chasmoftheclam on Sept. 24, 2021, 2:55 p.m., edited 1 time in total.

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