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NSMB - 2020 - Hardtail Thread

Nov. 12, 2020, 9:16 a.m.
Posts: 2
Joined: Nov. 11, 2020

@Craw 

The frame cost wasn’t $1500 - it was under $200.  I meant the finished cost to complete the build with all the odds and ends needed to make it feel complete.  Lots of unexpected details - and I was a lead shop mechanic for almost a decade in a previous life.

Also, Deore 12sp wasn’t out yet when I did my build.

My point was that I could have bought that Commencal complete for the same price and would probably enjoy it more.

If I was spending $1500 on a hardtail frame, you’d better believe it would be custom, local, built from domestic materials - basically more compelling than anything the world has seen (at least in my eyes).

Nov. 12, 2020, 9:55 a.m.
Posts: 6
Joined: June 19, 2020

Ragley Big AL, size XL. 480 reach, 650 stack. 150mm fork, HA measures 64*. I'm 5'11" and the fit is great. I will never own a short reach bike again.

Riding it to 7-11 with my kids it does feel like a lumbering beast but as soon as it hits dirt, it all makes sense. Much more capable than the hardtails of yesteryear. Stable, forgiving, fast, and just fine to throw around. Not in tight radius berms tho.

The 74 SA is almost a deal breaker but with saddle all the way forward is just enough. 76 probably the sweet spot. Alu frame, 29.5 lb build with good rubber. Frame was $450 from CRC to my door :)

9-E0-DDABA-17-B9-43-A1-AAE8-DA14-E8268147


 Last edited by: flattire2 on Nov. 12, 2020, 10:02 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Nov. 12, 2020, 11:46 a.m.
Posts: 644
Joined: Jan. 31, 2005

Posted by: heathen

Posted by: craw

You could have got a fully custom ti frame from http://www.waltlytitanium.com/ for much less than $1500USD. I don't get why anyone would pay more than $1000USD for a hardtail they had no say in.

How did you find the process of ordering from them? The site is not as intuitive as the Marino one

Great. Had to do it by email. They send you a form with all the options for tubing shapes/diameters/wall thickness also geometry and other features. Then a bunch of back and forth around particular features. Pay the 50% deposit for them to produce the drawing. Once you approve the drawing they build. Wait around 8 weeks. They send you some photos of the finished frame and you pay the balance and the frame ships. It was super thorough. My Waltly frame looks absolutely beautiful - as do the others on the Waltly site - they look super well finished. The Marino all look a bit raw and rudimentary to me, but they are very inexpensive.


 Last edited by: craw on Nov. 12, 2020, 11:48 a.m., edited 2 times in total.
Nov. 12, 2020, 1:25 p.m.
Posts: 1173
Joined: Nov. 21, 2002

Posted by: flattire2

Ragley Big AL, size XL. 480 reach, 650 stack. 150mm fork, HA measures 64*. I'm 5'11" and the fit is great. I will never own a short reach bike again.)

9-E0-DDABA-17-B9-43-A1-AAE8-DA14-E8268147

Looks solid, I live that milky way finish. I was close to pulling the trigger pre covid lockdowns, but my size was on backorder which kept on getting delayed month by month. I'm unsure if that backordered stock ever actually came through, and restock isnt expected until Spring 2021.

I'm working on getting my aluminum Eccentric 29 built up right now, I'm expecting a very 'responsive' ride even for a hardtail. The rear and main frame junctions are pure over built beef. It's by no means elegant, but the geo numbers say it will do fine hopefully.

Nov. 12, 2020, 3:30 p.m.
Posts: 381
Joined: Feb. 11, 2004

Posted by: flattire2

Ragley Big AL, size XL. 480 reach, 650 stack. 150mm fork, HA measures 64*. I'm 5'11" and the fit is great. I will never own a short reach bike again.

Riding it to 7-11 with my kids it does feel like a lumbering beast but as soon as it hits dirt, it all makes sense. Much more capable than the hardtails of yesteryear. Stable, forgiving, fast, and just fine to throw around. Not in tight radius berms tho.

The 74 SA is almost a deal breaker but with saddle all the way forward is just enough. 76 probably the sweet spot. Alu frame, 29.5 lb build with good rubber. Frame was $450 from CRC to my door :)

9-E0-DDABA-17-B9-43-A1-AAE8-DA14-E8268147

Sexy ride...is the FS bike getting any love!?

Nov. 12, 2020, 4:12 p.m.
Posts: 6
Joined: June 19, 2020

^ thanks man.  I flip flop back and forth between this and the 170mm enduro bike, it makes you appreciate what either excel in.    Its kinda fun to be on a hardtail again, climbs so well.  You realize what a slug the enduro bike is on the ups.

Nov. 12, 2020, 5:13 p.m.
Posts: 813
Joined: May 11, 2018

Posted by: craw

Posted by: Halloweenus

I have been riding the 27.5 version for a couple years (mine is a MY2019).  It’s stiff, real stiff- and I’m 245lbs.  I had this idea to build up a cheap hardtail as a second bike with parts leftover from my older (2015+) bikes.  I got the frame cheap on CRC, but it still ended up costing me $1500 USD total.

In the end, I wish that I would have just bought a complete for the same or even a little more with a more sophisticated frame.  

I’ve owned several aluminum hardtails in the past- all with worse geo than the eccentric.  I’ve also enjoyed all of those hardtails more than the eccentric.  Maybe I’m just getting older, but I feel like there is just something uniquely uninspiring with this frame.

You could have got a fully custom ti frame from http://www.waltlytitanium.com/ for much less than $1500USD. I don't get why anyone would pay more than $1000USD for a hardtail they had no say in.

I paid more than $1000 USD for my Primer and don't regret it. I honestly don't know what I would change on the geometry. I also think Chromag does a better job choosing my tube sets than I ever could. I also got to choose my paint, so I was happy. I also got a frame welded by either Truelove or Dekerf, which I am pretty stoked on - wish I knew which one it was....

Nov. 12, 2020, 9:23 p.m.
Posts: 1173
Joined: Nov. 21, 2002

Usually the Dekerf built frames have a little decal that notifies it as such.  Traditionally, Truelove did the Primers and Dekerf did the Surfaces. But there was a short period of time where Dekerf was building Primers as well. You probably knew all this already though

Nov. 12, 2020, 10:26 p.m.
Posts: 381
Joined: Feb. 11, 2004

Posted by: flattire2

^ thanks man.  I flip flop back and forth between this and the 170mm enduro bike, it makes you appreciate what either excel in.    Its kinda fun to be on a hardtail again, climbs so well.  You realize what a slug the enduro bike is on the ups.

Well, when we ride, take the Enduro! I'm a slooooow climber.

Nov. 13, 2020, 10:49 a.m.
Posts: 813
Joined: May 11, 2018

Posted by: UFO

Usually the Dekerf built frames have a little decal that notifies it as such. Traditionally, Truelove did the Primers and Dekerf did the Surfaces. But there was a short period of time where Dekerf was building Primers as well. You probably knew all this already though

They told me that dekerf likes to build a bunch of identical frames all at once whereas trulove does not so dekerf will build a whole bunch and then trulove will fill in gaps in the inventory. I suspect they mixed them all up and when I got mine, had no idea who built what. Whoever built it, its really nice to ride.

If I wanted custom rack mounts or something like that,  full custom would be the way to go. If I'm being honest with myself, I would have liked mounts for 2 bottles but I like the chromag product better than most custom frames due to the refinement they have built into their design over the years so I'm happy to go with their choices.


 Last edited by: RAHrider on Nov. 13, 2020, 10:59 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Nov. 14, 2020, 10:25 p.m.
Posts: 1173
Joined: Nov. 21, 2002

Cool little anecdote.

When I had my ex-Primer refreshed, I had Dekerf add in a 2nd set of bottle mounts.  This was cool, but limited my dropper post to 125mm since I lost a bunch of insertion depth with the seat tube mount. I imagine having rack mounts tacked on would be a piece of cake, if you so choose.

Nov. 15, 2020, 7 p.m.
Posts: 847
Joined: Nov. 18, 2015

My Naked gets around that (I have a 200mm dropper on it) by having the bolts reversed and pointing outwards. The bolts are outward facing and the cage is secured by bling bling nuts.

Nov. 15, 2020, 8:32 p.m.
Posts: 4
Joined: March 24, 2020

Hi! I've been reading this thread for a while... Since you guys all ride hardtails, I thought maybe I could ask for some advice. I'm having a hard time deciding which fork to get for my XL Nimble 9 (cherry cola) that I should receive next April. That frame can take 140 to 160mm. Even new, there's a limited choice of fork available at the moment and my budget is already pretty stretch out between all the parts that I need for my build. I've looked for a used fork or take off but I need at least 190mm of steering tube (ideally 200) so not a lot of option. I'm 205 naked and even if want my bike to stay relatively light and nimble (I have my Ripmo for really gnarly stuff), I don't want to get anything too flexy. I did run a fox 34 with FAST upgrade on my previous bike and the Fox 36 felt more stable and stiff when ridden hard.

Ideally, I would like to get a Pike Ultimate at 140 or 150 but they're really hard to find at the moment. I could get a new, slightly discounted Lyric Ultimate in 160mm (42mm offset). Will it be overkill for the Nimble 9? I could run it at 160 for the first season and then try 150 or 140mm if it's not ideal... I feel it should be great at my weight and 2050g for a big fork is still decent weight wise...

I've seen some Pike Select OEM take-off in 140 or 150mm (cheapest option budget wise) that should do ok but I'm worry about those fork being too low in their travel which is not ideal with a hardtail.

It's much easier to find (and a little cheaper than the new Lyric) a Fox 36 take-off but I would like to try Rockshox on my hardtail for their supposedly better small bump compliance. Plus I like the shiny look (ultimate models) with the glossy frame of the nimble 9.

Any input would be appreciated cause I'm in an analysis paralysis state at the moment (everything else is either ordered or in my possession)


 Last edited by: LewisQC on Nov. 15, 2020, 8:35 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
Nov. 15, 2020, 8:52 p.m.
Posts: 316
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Fox 34 is a wet noodle. I would recommend a DVO Dimond

Nov. 16, 2020, 5:50 a.m.
Posts: 567
Joined: Sept. 10, 2012

Posted by: LewisQC

I could get a new, slightly discounted Lyric Ultimate in 160mm (42mm offset). Will it be overkill for the Nimble 9?

I've got a Lyrik Ultimate on my winter hardtail. I'm ~185lbs out of the shower and it's a nice change from the Pike I run on my other hardtail. The stiffness and steering precision is noticeably better. Given you weigh more than me it seems like you'd be just as stoked. If 160mm ends up too long travel you can drop the travel to 150mm or 140mm with a new airshaft later on.


 Last edited by: Vikb on Nov. 16, 2020, 11:27 a.m., edited 1 time in total.

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