New posts

NSMB - 2020 - Hardtail Thread

April 6, 2020, 8:24 a.m.
Posts: 1444
Joined: April 25, 2003

Rootdown isn't "much more" than a Honzo at $870, Torrent isn't "much more" than a Rootdown at $999, but wait, how the heck did we get to $1000 for an offshore built hardtail?

April 6, 2020, 9:32 a.m.
Posts: 905
Joined: June 26, 2012

Has the Torrent frame only price gone up? I recall it being basically the same price as a Rootdown.

I am not sure why you would choose the Torrent over the Rootdown given the price difference.

Edit: yes, it did go up. It was $899 when they launched it. https://www.pinkbike.com/news/video-norco-bicycles-tests-riders-mettle-with-new-torrent-steel-hardtail.html


 Last edited by: D_C_ on April 6, 2020, 9:34 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
April 6, 2020, 9:46 a.m.
Posts: 277
Joined: Sept. 10, 2012

Posted by: D_C_

Has the Torrent frame only price gone up? I recall it being basically the same price as a Rootdown.

I am not sure why you would choose the Torrent over the Rootdown given the price difference.

Edit: yes, it did go up. It was $899 when they launched it. https://www.pinkbike.com/news/video-norco-bicycles-tests-riders-mettle-with-new-torrent-steel-hardtail.html

Just off the top of my head PF BB and lack of ISCG tabs on the Rootdown were a deal breaker for me. If you put a metal screw together PF BB adapter in the Rootdown its price goes up ~$120CAD and you can't do anything about the missing ISCG tabs since it won't work with one of the adaptors like the one MRP makes.

April 6, 2020, 10:03 a.m.
Posts: 905
Joined: June 26, 2012

Posted by: Vikb

Posted by: D_C_

Has the Torrent frame only price gone up? I recall it being basically the same price as a Rootdown.

I am not sure why you would choose the Torrent over the Rootdown given the price difference.

Edit: yes, it did go up. It was $899 when they launched it. https://www.pinkbike.com/news/video-norco-bicycles-tests-riders-mettle-with-new-torrent-steel-hardtail.html

Just off the top of my head PF BB and lack of ISCG tabs on the Rootdown were a deal breaker for me. If you put a metal screw together PF BB adapter in the Rootdown its price goes up ~$120CAD and you can't do anything about the missing ISCG tabs since it won't work with one of the adaptors like the one MRP makes.

Good points. I do wish my Rootdown had ISCG tabs (though I can count the number of chains I've dropped on one hand). The PF bb isn't a deal-breaker for me. But I could see those features being worth the extra $120 to some.

There are also some minor geometry differences - https://geometrygeeks.bike/compare/chromag-rootdown-2019-m-l,norco-torrent-ht-2020-m/

The main differences are that the Torrent will be half a degree slacker (both in HTA and STA) than the Rootdown for a fork of the same travel, and the Rootdown has a slightly lower bb. The Rootdown also comes in 5 sizes, compared to the Torrent's 4.


 Last edited by: D_C_ on April 6, 2020, 10:08 a.m., edited 2 times in total.
April 6, 2020, 10:21 a.m.
Posts: 6
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Posted by: Endurimil

Posted by: ken-leggatt

Not the best picture, but this is the original Wideangle.  Nothing but fun on this.

Wideangle

Hmm...that is? Made here or overseas?

The Wideangle of all vintages is a Taiwan made frame.

April 6, 2020, 10:43 a.m.
Posts: 1444
Joined: April 25, 2003

Yeah press fit BB's are a deal breaker for me too. Personally I don't miss the chain guides since I switched to narrow-wide 1x drivetrains, particularly with a top guide like my MRP that uses a seat tube mount.  My Stumpy uses PF, and relying on a big dollar Praxis BB instead of a cheap Shimano one is super irritating. My '15 Rootdown uses a threaded so I assumed the new ones would be the same (anyone wanna buy it?). Lame move on a steel bike IMO.


 Last edited by: tashi on April 6, 2020, 10:45 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
April 6, 2020, 11:20 a.m.
Posts: 277
Joined: Sept. 10, 2012

I don't use a chain guide, but I do have a taco bash on all my bikes and it gets used every ride by slamming into rocks.

Chromag is discounting the few remaining 2019 Rootdowns they have so who knows maybe the 2020 model will come with a threaded BB?

April 6, 2020, 11:26 a.m.
Posts: 905
Joined: June 26, 2012

Posted by: Vikb

Chromag is discounting the few remaining 2019 Rootdowns they have so who knows maybe the 2020 model will come with a threaded BB?

No, still PF - https://chromagbikes.com/products/frames-rootdown-20

April 6, 2020, 12:36 p.m.
Posts: 1444
Joined: April 25, 2003

Posted by: Vikb

I don't use a chain guide, but I do have a taco bash on all my bikes and it gets used every ride by slamming into rocks.

Chromag is discounting the few remaining 2019 Rootdowns they have so who knows maybe the 2020 model will come with a threaded BB?

You bash your ring every ride around Victoria?  Do you run a big ring or super low BB?

I don’t think I’ve scraped a ring since moving to a single 30 tooth (except for on Meat Draw) but none of my bikes have a “low” BB.

April 6, 2020, 4:22 p.m.
Posts: 277
Joined: Sept. 10, 2012

Posted by: tashi

You bash your ring every ride around Victoria? Do you run a big ring or super low BB?

I like riding janky tech, which means big odd shaped rocks and the older unmaintained trails. Getting up and over stuff requires momentum so that's a great way to drive the ring or hopefully the bash guard into something hard. For the new HT I'm looking at its first year it will get run as a 27+ since I have those parts available and later it will get switched to a 29er. In 27+ mode I'll be particularly concerned about hitting the ring since that bike will sit lower than as a 29er. The Norco Torrent has a pretty small BB drop for a 29er. A reviewer complained, but that's a feature I think I'd like.

It just doesn't make sense for me to buy a bike I can't mount a taco bash to when that's such cheap/easy protection. I keep my bikes 4+ years and every time I get rid of a frame I'm amazed at how chewed up the bashguard is.


 Last edited by: Vikb on April 6, 2020, 4:46 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
April 6, 2020, 5:31 p.m.
Posts: 164
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Posted by: Vikb

Posted by: tashi

You bash your ring every ride around Victoria? Do you run a big ring or super low BB?

I like riding janky tech, which means big odd shaped rocks and the older unmaintained trails. Getting up and over stuff requires momentum so that's a great way to drive the ring or hopefully the bash guard into something hard. For the new HT I'm looking at its first year it will get run as a 27+ since I have those parts available and later it will get switched to a 29er. In 27+ mode I'll be particularly concerned about hitting the ring since that bike will sit lower than as a 29er. The Norco Torrent has a pretty small BB drop for a 29er. A reviewer complained, but that's a feature I think I'd like.

It just doesn't make sense for me to buy a bike I can't mount a taco bash to when that's such cheap/easy protection. I keep my bikes 4+ years and every time I get rid of a frame I'm amazed at how chewed up the bashguard is.

That BB drop made me think it was 27.5 plus compatible. But sadly it is not.

April 6, 2020, 6:11 p.m.
Posts: 277
Joined: Sept. 10, 2012

Posted by: heathen

That BB drop made me think it was 27.5 plus compatible. But sadly it is not.

What's the problem? Usually a 29 that fits 2.6" tires will fit a 27 x 2.8" without issues.

April 6, 2020, 6:58 p.m.
Posts: 1129
Joined: Nov. 21, 2002

Posted by: tashi

Rootdown isn't "much more" than a Honzo at $870, Torrent isn't "much more" than a Rootdown at $999, but wait, how the heck did we get to $1000 for an offshore built hardtail?

This, all day long. 

The Rootdown cant go to a threaded bb due to the chain stay yoke design and the shortish chainstays. 

Having said that, my preference is for a chain stay no shorter than 430, 440 would be the upper limit, to help keep me centered on the steep climbs I frequent. 

The 2020 Chromag Surface is pretty close geo wise if it weren't for the shortish reach relative to the size. The Cotic Solaris max for me would be just fine, I'm an average height so the slackish sta doesn't bother me.

April 6, 2020, 7:01 p.m.
Posts: 1129
Joined: Nov. 21, 2002

And also I feel strongly that modern progressive hardtail should be run with a high volume 2.6 of not 2.8 rear tire with wide rims to support. As much as I love steel, I feel like frame material doesn't matter all that much with the rear tire damping things down. May as well save the 1 lb frame weight and likely a few dollars.

April 6, 2020, 8:57 p.m.
Posts: 34
Joined: March 16, 2017

Posted by: ken-leggatt

Posted by: Endurimil

Posted by: ken-leggatt

Not the best picture, but this is the original Wideangle.  Nothing but fun on this.

Wideangle

Hmm...that is? Made here or overseas?

The Wideangle of all vintages is a Taiwan made frame.

Thought so.  I have the predecessor to that in the work shop right now.

Forum jump: