NSMB - 2019 - Full Suspension Bike Thread

Posted by: D_C_

I picked up UFO's Devinci Django 29 (or Devinci Troy 111, as I've been calling it) and just built it up with parts from my hardtail. I debated long and hard about whether I was ready to move on from the Rootdown BA and figured I'd give it a go. They say steel hardtail frames are compliant, but sometimes you want just a bit more of that. My other bike is a Norco Range 29 with 170 mm fork, so I'm hoping there won't be too much overlap. I may drop down the fork's travel on this one.

The build includes a Pike set at 150 with the Debonair shaft (one of the better $50 upgrades I've done), Arc 27 rims with Hope rear hub, X Fusion Manic 150 post, Race Face Atlas cockpit, Shimano XTR shifter, SLX derailleur, XT 11-46 cassette, Turbine cranks with Enduro BB92 to 30mm bottom bracket, XT M8000 brakes.

The frame itself is about 8.2 lbs and the bike as currently built is just under 33 lbs! Yikes! But I am running ~1000 g tires front and back and a CushCore in the rear (necessary on the hardtail), so I could probably drop a couple pounds there.

sweet ride, similar to mine.

Slightly different look for the Madonna this year, the black has gone (mostly because the British weather & a few uplifts had battered it). So went paintless. Now spent some more time on this thing & continue to be impressed. Despite it's size and weight, it really does crawl up everything. Coming back down is a test of nerve. Looking forward to getting racing on it now. Back in BC for a month this summer & really looking forward to riding this thing out there :)

Nice. That's a great looking bike.

Posted by: HobNob

Slightly different look for the Madonna this year, the black has gone (mostly because the British weather & a few uplifts had battered it). So went paintless. Now spent some more time on this thing & continue to be impressed. Despite it's size and weight, it really does crawl up everything. Coming back down is a test of nerve. Looking forward to getting racing on it now. Back in BC for a month this summer & really looking forward to riding this thing out there :)

comfortable looking bench...

Would love to see the Madonna in person. Let me know when you are back and maybe I can show you some of the Fraser Valley.

So, as a late X-mas gift, I got myself a new toy .

Bold Unplugged Volume 1. Spec: Saint, GX, Deity cockpit & pedals, E1900 wheels (had to save a bit of money somewhere, plus, the crappy wheels on my trail bike have lasted for 5 years now…), KS lev Integra, RS Super Deluxe, one token. The fork is a Yari in name only since it was fitted  with a Charger damper tuned to my weight and riding style by the fine folks at Akira Tuning. Bike is in the longest/slackest setting.

Uphill: You’ll never mistake it for a trail bike, but I’ve ridden long-travel bikes that climbed a lot worse. Gets you up the hill. Tech climbing is actually pretty good, I even managed to clean a section that I’d never cleaned on flats before. Whenever I timed climbs I was actually going quite fast, it just felt like I had to work for it. The longest ride so far has been a little over 3.5 hours, but all-day rides should pose no problem.

Downhill : I have to work on my cornering technique. Haven’t really gotten the hang of quick cornering yet, but I’m adapting. Needs more input and more movement and of course a more aggressive position. Managed to get around even the tightest switchbacks around here w/o problems. Straight lines are scary fast, steeps seem less steep.  Suspension setup still needs some work. This bike begs you to go harder, steeper, rougher.

Two things I find hard to quantify: Line choice in tight switchbacks is very «intuitive», i.e. I seem to «see» the right line and be able to follow it easily. Demo’d a few other bikes that gave more trouble in such situations. Another thing is, I feel like I have more time to react in steep, tech situations, even though I’m probably going just as fast or faster than before.

No, this is not a cheap bike. OTOH, at MRSP of last year’s Reign Advanced 1, I got a custom tuned fork, the brakes, tires and cockpit of my choice, 175mm dropper and an otherwise similarly specced bike (Reign has slightly more expensive wheels but lots of house-brand parts and only a Fox Performance shock). So, I guess I’m trying to convince myself that it’s not THAT bad. Do I think it’s a ridiculous amount of money for a toy ? Sure. Do I think it’s money well spent ? You bet.

All my contacts with Bold were very pleasant. Emails to inquire about my saddle height, so they could cut the cables accordingly, a phone call that they would start building up my bike and had I seen their new colourway and would I prefer that one ? Sending my fork to the tuners free of charge, being more than willing to spec parts that are not officially listed on their website etc. Patiently answering questions about tokens in the shock, fork travel, you name it. Oh, and it’s nice to have a chat over coffee with the designer of your bike when you pick it up.

Other thoughts : While the L frame fits me well (I’m 1,90m and sitting position is very comfortable), I think I would prefer an XL if they made one. Especially on steep climbs and fast downhills (and fast is the name of the game with this bike), I wish for a little more TT/reach. Not an issue on tamer climbs/slower descents. Will put a 50mm stem and a slightly higher rise bar on the bike and see if it makes a difference. I think I’d like an even steeper seat angle. Bike is quite stiff, which I like. Also, large screws on all the frame pivots.

So, to end my ramblings, I’ll quote my wife when she got her new Reign: «Can I have my old bike back? All the trails have gotten so boring.» Yep, the Unplugged does make a lot oft hings seem easier/tamer.

Posted by: Bagheera

So, to end my ramblings, I’ll quote my wife when she got her new Reign: «Can I have my old bike back? All the trails have gotten so boring.» Yep, the Unplugged does make a lot oft hings seem easier/tamer.

Cool looking bike, I'd never heard of this brand before. I think your last comment is really intriguing though and could underscore the possible/perceived increase in popularity of hardtails. Of course this comes down to how and what people like to ride, but if the bike is making things seem too easy I can totally understand the desire for a hardtail bike.

It's an existential question, but is there a point for most riders where the bike becomes too good and is actually a step backwards in the fun quotient?

Posted by: syncro

It's an existential question, but is there a point for most riders where the bike becomes too good and is actually a step backwards in the fun quotient?

I have been in a situation like that. But I consider it more of a question of choosing the right bike for the kind of riding you do.

After living in BC and riding a burly trailbike around the north shore, I moved to the Black Forest, taking the bike with me. It turned out that this bike was just far too capable for most of the trails there. The only way not to fall asleep on the downhill was to go dangerously fast, create conflicts with hikers and still not have any sense of technical challenge.

So I bought a light XC hardtail which was a hoot to ride and just the perfect bike for the terrain. Plus, no need to wear a full face helmet or armour.

Is it possible that bikes have become so good that they are too capable even for parts of the north shore?

Posted by: Timer

I have been in a situation like that. But I consider it more of a question of choosing the right bike for the kind of riding you do.

After living in BC and riding a burly trailbike around the north shore, I moved to the black forest, taking the bike with me. It turned out that this bike was just far too capable for most of the trails there. The only way not to fall asleep on the downhill was to go dangerously fast, create conflicts with hikers and still not have any sense of technical challenge. 

So I bought a light XC hardtail which was a hoot to ride and just the perfect bike for the terrain. Plus, no need to wear a full face helmet or armour.

Is it possible that bikes have become so good that they are too capable even for parts of the north shore?

I agree about choosing the right bike for the type of trails one rides, but of course that is also dependent on the riders skills. A better rider will always be able to get away with less bike. One thing I have noticed though is that sometimes riding a bike that is overly capable for the trail I'm on can create a different, albeit not better, type of fun. In general though I prefer to be more engaged with the trail and find that spending too much time on an easier bike makes things a bit bland. You also lose that sharpness you get from needing to be much more dialed in with a lesser bike. So is it possible to have too capable a bike for the shore? I think it's possible for some riders but I don't think we're there yet for most riders.

I think it's also dependent on how fast you want to/are willing to go. IMO a given bike has a certain speed it "wants" to go on a given trail.

I rode my friend's pivot firebird briefly on Seymour. I honestly think I'd seriously hospitalize myself on that bike before long. Someone with more skill might be able to ride at the speeds the bike wanted me to go. It would be boring for me because I'm not comfortable with the speeds the bike is capable of. At the speed I ride it feels like a school bus. So is the bike "too capable for the shore"? For me it is because I can't use it how it was made to be used. For a more capable rider, maybe not. The other funny thing is that a LESS capable rider than me may also like it because it's like a big forgiving couch. So imo "big" "capable" bikes probably appeal to two different demographics -

1 shredders that will use every ounce of the bikes performance

2 riders that are not necessarily super aggressive and are looking for all of the forgiveness they can get.

A LOT of us most likely fall in between those two categories. 

Reminds me of this vid of vanderham on Seymour riding a slayer:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ys-3KU8v3qA

Yeah. I don't need a slayer. I won't be doing anything close to that. Ever.

Posted by: Kenny

I think it's also dependent on how fast you want to/are willing to go. IMO a given bike has a certain speed it "wants" to go on a given trail.  

I rode my friend's pivot firebird briefly on Seymour. I honestly think I'd seriously hospitalize myself on that bike before long. Someone with more skill might be able to ride at the speeds the bike wanted me to go. It would be boring for me because I'm not comfortable with the speeds the bike is capable of. At the speed I ride it feels like a school bus. So is the bike "too capable for the shore"? For me it is because I can use it how it was made to be used. For a more capable rider, maybe not. The other funny thing is that a LESS capable rider than me may also like it because it's like a big forgiving couch. 

Reminds me of this vid of vanderham on Seymour riding a slayer:

Yeah. I don't need a slayer. I won't be doing anything close to that. Ever.

yeah there are time where I like the couch style riding, but too much of that and it gets a bit boring. 

re watching the Vanderham on trails I know well, the speed is amazing. I think there's a point though where going faster makes the trails easier to a certain degree, but going not quite fast enough results in carnage. The beginning part down Incline is a perfect example of that as with the speed he's carrying he's able to sail over some of the gnarly bits and the physics of his forward momentum helps him basically float over some of the other stuff. The key is having the mental game to trust the bike and know the line  you need to hit in order to ride at that speed.

Posted by: Timer

Posted by: syncro

It's an existential question, but is there a point for most riders where the bike becomes too good and is actually a step backwards in the fun quotient?

I have been in a situation like that. But I consider it more of a question of choosing the right bike for the kind of riding you do.

After living in BC and riding a burly trailbike around the north shore, I moved to the Black Forest, taking the bike with me. It turned out that this bike was just far too capable for most of the trails there. The only way not to fall asleep on the downhill was to go dangerously fast, create conflicts with hikers and still not have any sense of technical challenge.

So I bought a light XC hardtail which was a hoot to ride and just the perfect bike for the terrain. Plus, no need to wear a full face helmet or armour.

Is it possible that bikes have become so good that they are too capable even for parts of the north shore?

I had the same experience when I move from Vancouver to Beautiful Fort Mcmurray. My fully made the trails just way too boring. So I built up a Cove Hand Job with a 140mm fork. That made the trails a blast and kept my skills up. I keep my full for trips to the mountains.

Had Dave @ BicycleHub install some upgrades on my 2017 YT Jeffsy CF 27:

Pike 160mm airshaft (from 150mm), also running Luftkappe

Offset bushings in shock

OneUp 150mm dropper (was running 125mm RF Turbine, legs too stubby to fit RF 150 with the tall seat tube)

Other upgrades from stock over the past few years: DVO Topaz T3 rear shock, RF SixC 35 800x35mm bar, RF Atlas 35mm stem, XT8000 mech/shifter w/ SunRace 11-46 cassette, XT8000 brakes, Fabric Scoop saddle, DMR Brendog Deathgrips and I will be putting on DD casing DHF/DHRII WT tires for the summer.

Geometry is now approx 65.5deg HTA, 74deg STA, 339mm BBH and travel is 160mm front and rear (stock = 150/150, 66.5/75/344)

If you saw my thread in the main forum, the bike in the post above was wrecked in a rear ender last week. ICBC came through with a settlement so I upgraded to the 2019 YT Jeffsy 27 CF Pro Race. YT has the bike in stock in Kelowna, it was put on a truck the same day I paid for it and showed up at my office the next morning. 

There she is stock, 30.25lbs with Race Face Atlas flats, water bottle and tubes in. Mods so far:

- Swap tires to Maxxis Minion DHF 27.5x2.5WT 3C MaxxGrip DD front, DHR II 27.5x2.4WT 3C MaxxTerra DD rear - tubeless

- Swap saddle to Fabric Scoop

Future mods once parts arrive:

- Swap chainring from 32t to 30t (rear is 9-46 and I cannot push 32-46 on steep climbs because fat)

- Swap Guide RSC brakes to Shimano XT 8020 4-piston/Icetech rotors

- Possibly swap stem from 50mm to 35mm, although first test ride with 50mm felt great.

Managed a 2hr shakedown ride on muddy Fromme on Saturday morning. Bike feels amazing, an upgrade in every way (and I loved my previous Jeffsy). Not sure if it's the Fox 36 over the pike, the carbon wheels, the beefier frame or a combo of all 3 but it feels much more stable/planted at the front end in rough terrain... like half way from my old bike with the Pike to my DH bike with Fox 40s. I weigh 200lbs before gearing up right now and I think the Pike was just not enough beef for me. Climbing feels great with the steeper STA. This bike has basically the same reach/chainstay length as my old one, but on that bike I went down to a 35mm stem as it felt too long. The 50 on the new one felt great in terms of weight distribution so not sure what's up.

I did snap the chain on first mountain highway climb which sucked, not sure what happened but need to spend more time dialing in the drivetrain as something is off.