gearbox bikes

seems like a pretty big sacrifice to save a bit of noise ;)

Wow… the cool thing about the Zerodes before this model was that it had a high pivot point.

anyone care to explain why the high single pivot is so revered, or what it's specific characteristics are

anyone care to explain why the high single pivot is so revered, or what it's specific characteristics are

Creates a rearward wheel path which lengthens the wheelbase of the bike as it compresses creating a lot of stability.

In addition to this, the rear wheel tends to roll over bumps nicely.

The side effect is that it creates a lot of chain growth which is often corrected with pulleys.

Though, obviously a lot of DH bikes do not use this setup which makes one question whether this is actually faster.

The zerode I rode certainly felt very nice, but there a lot of factors going on and I've only ridden 6-7 different dh bikes in bike park settings.

anyone care to explain why the high single pivot is so revered, or what it's specific characteristics are

The main awesomeness with them is that the rearward/upward axlepath eats up big harsh bumps like a mofo.

The lower singlepivots mounted by the BB area have a forward/upward axlepath that feels like it gets hung up on large bumps in comparison.

They do have their drawbacks, like relative chainstay length and chaingrowth/pedal feedback, but that is dealt with using a jackshaft or idler pulley.

Great design for longtravel DH bikes. They ride like nothing else out there.

edit: lol, just saw Dutch covered it above.

After owning 4 high pivot bikes, yes these statements are all true. Square edged bumped become virtually unnoticeable. It gives the effect of making the bike feel as if it is accelerating over every bump. It makes the first bit of travel feel hyper sensitive. The idler makes the pedal feedback minimal and thus helps the bike pedal well.

After owning 4 high pivot bikes, yes these statements are all true. Square edged bumped become virtually unnoticeable. It gives the effect of making the bike feel as if it is accelerating over every bump. It makes the first bit of travel feel hyper sensitive. The idler makes the pedal feedback minimal and thus helps the bike pedal well.

This.

From a downhill racing perspective the only negative I can think of from a strict racer/bike perspective is the added complexity/weight of the jack-shaft two-chain arrangement that BMW used OR the high idler (and two chains mated together) set-up that Balfa used. Otherwise it is a super simple to build suspension design and with modern geometry and shocks it would be really cool to see what the bikes would ride like if they were designed now.

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I'm not generally a bike industry conspiracy theorist (vis-a-vis why you don't see high pivot bikes anymore) but there is definitely a belief (and it's probably correct) that you need to tell one suspension story through your entire lineup.

Good examples of this are Trek which now has one ABP/Full-Floater platform (and used to have 3-4 designs at one time) and Rocky Mountain which at one time had 5 different platforms (3D-Link XC, ETSX, Slayer Super-XC, Switch, RMX) all in the same model year and marketed that as a positive.

Especially if you take the view that DH Racing is an investment in marketing your whole brand - not just your DH bikes - it only makes sense that your DH race platform uses the same ~ tech as your other bikes.

It makes sense (drag/noise/weight/complexity) that none of the major brands are using the high-pivot setup through their whole lineup, so you don't see the design used for DH racing.

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It's really too bad that DH Racing has become so expensive for the number of bikes sold, and that weight became such a determining factor in selling bikes because with the surge in really cool craft builders making bikes for every other aspect of riding I definitely miss the Balfa/BMW/Etc bikes that were so different.

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Creates a rearward wheel path which lengthens the wheelbase of the bike as it compresses creating a lot of stability.

the wheel trajectory is similar to that of the front wheel, so the wheelbase stays more constant in length overall, rather than the shortening under compression of a lower pivot.

as mentioned previously, the square edge eating / forward momentum maintaining capability of a high pivot is impressive. cool to see commencal building one again:

but yeah, was hoping zerode was going to run with the high pivot small bike. i'm sure they could have cleaned up the chain management, but more weight [HTML_REMOVED] complexity chips away at an already tiny market potential, so…

as mentioned previously, the square edge eating / forward momentum maintaining capability of a high pivot is impressive. cool to see commencal building one again:

Wow. That is the first bike Commencal has had made that catches my eye/interest. Chain management is very clean and with a 1x drivetrain and modern shock I'd love to see a 5" or 6" version. Why not?!

interestingly, they built a high pivot shorter travel test mule prior to releasing the dh bike. no indication that they intend to go into production with something like this, however.

^^^clean up the idler/chain like the DH rig and that would be sweet.

^^^clean up the idler/chain like the DH rig and that would be sweet.

Snagging your shorts on the chain [HTML_REMOVED] idler wheel wouldn't be much fun…

^^^clean up the idler/chain like the DH rig and that would be sweet.

I'd really love to see a high-pivot "little" bike similar to the Commençal V4 DH Supreme.

People may have turned their noses up a bit at Kona's Magic Link bikes, but the rearward-to-upward axle path of the rear wheel demolished square edged hits. It was awesome.

Seems like the high pivot is coming back into fashion. First the Zerode, then Bulls had one under Wyn, now Commençal. I wonder if everything old is new again as usual in the bike industry…?

I believe it has more to do with the industry wanting to play it safe. The internet seems to like the same ol' suspension designs, but if you look at some of the better performers, often times its a linkage driven single pivot or high pivot bike. I don't think anyone will fault the performance of the Kona Process, anything by Evil, or (shameless plug) the Xprezo Adhoc. Going even further back, the later versions of the Balfa BB7 were ahead of most of other designs on the market at that time.

Simplicity seems to take a back seat for some reason. I applaud Commencal for diving into a high single pivot design,