Yup. The perfect explanation for why more than one mtb is necessary.
Door to trail riders - tell me how you've accommodated these crazy steep seat angles please
Just a random tidbit that I found interesting. Steve from the My Back 40 podcast is about to ride the Tour Divide. He's on a custom rigid MTB frame with a 76 degree seat tube angle. Not that steep, but certainly steeper than a road bike, traditional touring bike etc.
Posted by: HollyBoni
Just a random tidbit that I found interesting. Steve from the My Back 40 podcast is about to ride the Tour Divide. He's on a custom rigid MTB frame with a 76 degree seat tube angle. Not that steep, but certainly steeper than a road bike, traditional touring bike etc.
Looks like he's using a tri-bar setup with aero bars and elbow pads to support his body weight. Makes sense in that as you move your body forward relative to the BB you need to put that weight somewhere other than mostly on the butt/feet. I'll keep an eye out for a report once he's done in terms of how he liked that setup.
Posted by: Vikb
Looks like he's using a tri-bar setup with aero bars and elbow pads to support his body weight. Makes sense in that as you move your body forward relative to the BB you need to put that weight somewhere other than mostly on the butt/feet. I'll keep an eye out for a report once he's done in terms of how he liked that setup.
Yep, didn't think about that!
I think he had the same setup when he Yoyo'd the BC1000 last summer. Seems like it's working for him. 🙃
Last edited by: HollyBoni on June 5, 2022, 1:21 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
Posted by: HollyBoni
Yep, didn't think about that!
I think he had the same setup when he Yoyo'd the BC1000 last summer. Seems like it's working for him. 🙃
The TD is a gravel road race so if he's comfortable in that aero position I can see it being beneficial for him making good time.
Steep seat tube angles for technical climbing might not be such a good idea.
The biggest mistake I see, for when people can't make an uphill move, is that their butt is planted in the saddle.
You should be barely weighting the saddle and be on a hair trigger to snap your butt up and forward and then thrust your bike forward of your centre of gravity.
If you are too comfortable being planted on the saddle, you are less likely to be ready to lift your butt when required.
Choose a saddle position/seat angle best suited for lower gradient gravel and paved climbs, then move forward and perch daintily on the nose for technical climbs.
Last edited by: taprider on June 5, 2022, 7:06 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
Posted by: Vikb
Looks like he's using a tri-bar setup with aero bars and elbow pads to support his body weight. Makes sense in that as you move your body forward relative to the BB you need to put that weight somewhere other than mostly on the butt/feet. I'll keep an eye out for a report once he's done in terms of how he liked that setup.
Yup.
Plus he may have a 34" inseam with a bike that has a slack actual seat angle. With a fairly typical design 72.8 actual with a 40mm offset and a 76 virtual (to the ETT):
At my pedalling height (30" inseam) and 165mm cranks I get a 166mm saddle setback as X3 measures it (the dot on top of the saddle to the BB). If I added 100mm to the pedalling height to mimic a 34" inseam it would be 181mm back or 15mm. So the taller rider is riding an effective seat angle 1.2 degrees sacker than I would be...
Last edited by: geraldooka on June 5, 2022, 7:52 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
Posted by: taprider
Choose a saddle position/seat angle best suited for lower gradient gravel and paved climbs, then move forward and perch daintily on the nose for technical climbs.
That would be my approach, but that's not the "modern" technique. Partially it's due to the fact you can't reach the bars on a really long bike if you aren't sitting up close to the BB and partially it's due to technical climbing not really being in fashion these days.
Need more info. Hardtail or fully? The steep sta on a full suspension bike should put you pretty close to 74 ish at seated sag.
This.
I have a current geo Chromag Rootdown, 76deg, feels much steeper than recent FS bikes I've had that have the same or steeper angles.
Do you use the pedal switch? If so, maybe try it without?
Maybe try different grips, or more backswept bars? Or just install a horribly uncomfortable seat, so you won't even notice slight hand pain. But yeah, I kinda get the same feeling of too much weight on my hands, but I have a sagged (hardtail) sta of 75, so pretty middle ground. Also it's biking on a road, suffering is the point, right? tehe
Edit: 75deg sta, unsagged.
Last edited by: kcy4130 on June 6, 2022, 10:40 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Posted by: HansB
Need more info. Hardtail or fully? The steep sta on a full suspension bike should put you pretty close to 74 ish at seated sag.
This.
I have a current geo Chromag Rootdown, 76deg, feels much steeper than recent FS bikes I've had that have the same or steeper angles.
Do you use the pedal switch? If so, maybe try it without?
You are correct. I realize a hardtail pivots arounds the rear axle and only steepens, I referenced my current too steep hardtail which has a seat angle of 75.5 static (no offset) which ends up near 77 at sag. I wasn't specifying in my original post because it doesn't matter if its a full sus or hardtail the issue is the saddle is too forward on my actual bikes. So if someones saddle is too forward on whatever they are riding full sus or hardtail how are you mitigating the discomfort on long flat rides?
Posted by: kcy4130
Maybe try different grips, or more backswept bars? Or just install a horribly uncomfortable seat, so you won't even notice slight hand pain. But yeah, I kinda get the same feeling of too much weight on my hands, but I have a sagged (hardtail) sta of 75, so pretty middle ground. Also it's biking on a road, suffering is the point, right? tehe
Edit: 75deg sta, unsagged.
Ha I like the painful seat idea ;-) I have pretty cushy grips with the ESI's I may try a more backswept bar that may work, although I am already using the 30x 12deg which has a decent back-sweep that eats up about 45mm of cockpit length.
Posted by: geraldooka
Ha I like the painful seat idea ;-) I have pretty cushy grips with the ESI's I may try a more backswept bar that may work, although I am already using the 30x 12deg which has a decent back-sweep that eats up about 45mm of cockpit length.
Did the 12deg bars help? I'm curious if they'd help me. I hesitate to spend much just to try them tho. As an experiment you could try over pressuring your fork so you have barely any sag for the road portion of a ride, hence slackening sta. If you like it, it'd at least give you a data point on what to aim for in future.
a stem with more rise and the seat nose high is what I have always used to get weight off the hands
I've got a76 degree seat tube but a low stack so to mitigate the weight on my hands went for a 50 mm rise bar which has really helped. When I'm mostly on flatter or rolling terrain I'll move the saddle back on its rails and flatten it out somewhat as well
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