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buying a used frame from the US and A

Feb. 24, 2019, 9:35 p.m.
Posts: 518
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

does anyone have first hand experience with buying used, private sale from the US?  seems like a reasonable deal but i'm wondering just how many hoops are involved and how many ways The Man is going to try and stick it to me.

Feb. 24, 2019, 10:28 p.m.
Posts: 1124
Joined: Sept. 30, 2006

Same question has been asked and answered at least once on here.  Search is your friend.

Feb. 24, 2019, 10:46 p.m.
Posts: 518
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

searches were done, little or no meaningful information was found and nothing recent, and nothing that wasn't hypothetical.

Feb. 25, 2019, 7:32 a.m.
Posts: 982
Joined: Nov. 23, 2002

So there's basically two ways to do it.

1. Get it shipped to a postal outlet or freight forwarder like one of the places in Point Roberts or Blaine - Point Bob is the go to for most people. Personally I like In Out Parcel as their locker system allows you to grab your stuff 24/7 so you can go later at night and avoid border line-ups. Shipping to Point Bob is always cheaper, often by $20 or more depending on what you're getting. When you cross into the US they'll ask you why you're heading down and you can just say you have a package to pick up at whichever place you're going to and/or going to get gas. On the way back CDN customs will ask if you got anything and the value. You may or may not get asked to come in and pay GST based on the value of the goods. Some officers are particular about seeing receipts (paypal, ebay, etc) and some don't. Typically if you're under about $300 value they'll just wave you through but it really depends on who you get. The bonus of driving down is a cheap tank of gas if you time it right.

2. Just get it shipped right to your door. You'll pay more for the shipping and you'll also pay a brokerage free. UPS is notorious for having higher fees, United Stated Postal Service (USPS) is usually the cheapest and Fed-Ex isn't too bad. You can do your own customs brokerage clearance but I'm not sure about the process as I've never done it. Apparently it's fairly easy though and it's just a form you need to fill out. Here's a couple sites with info on how to do it yourself.

https://borderbee.com/2014/01/13/how-to-self-clear-your-parcel-with-customs/

https://illknowitwheniseeit.com/4027/life/clearing-your-own-ups-package/


 Last edited by: syncro on Feb. 25, 2019, 7:32 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Feb. 25, 2019, 9:19 a.m.
Posts: 1124
Joined: Sept. 30, 2006

Posted by: JBV

searches were done, little or no meaningful information was found and nothing recent, and nothing that wasn't hypothetical.

https://nsmb.com/forum/forum/gear-4/topic/buying-a-used-frame-from-usa-1484/

What Syncro said sums it up well. Has to be a pretty good deal to offset the 25% dollar exchange and other fees you might get hit with.


 Last edited by: shoreboy on Feb. 25, 2019, 9:23 a.m., edited 2 times in total.
Feb. 25, 2019, 2:48 p.m.
Posts: 518
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

got all crazy and decided to see if there was a way to contact customs and just ask. to my shock, there is a phone number, but even more shocking was that it only took 10 minutes and a real person, english speaking as a first language no less, took my call.

used bicycle frame, made in Taiwan, 13% duty, PST and GST. 

well, i guess that simplifies it.

Feb. 25, 2019, 2:57 p.m.
Posts: 1124
Joined: Sept. 30, 2006

Posted by: JBV

got all crazy and decided to see if there was a way to contact customs and just ask. to my shock, there is a phone number, but even more shocking was that it only took 10 minutes and a real person, english speaking as a first language no less, took my call.

used bicycle frame, made in Taiwan, 13% duty, PST and GST. 

well, i guess that simplifies it.

I dont think that simplifies it.  There is no PST on bicycle parts in BC.  Whoever you talked to at customs is incorrect I believe.  The link I posted above gives the breakdown you stated here.

Feb. 25, 2019, 3:20 p.m.
Posts: 105
Joined: June 17, 2016

I think you wasted 10 minutes of your life on that phone call. Always better to directly look up the information yourself rather than going through some underpaid student in a call center.

https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/trade-commerce/tariff-tarif/2013/01-99/ch87-2013-eng.pdf

8714.91 - -Frames and forks, and parts thereof

8714.91.10 00 - - -Frame lugs, bottom bracket shells, forks, fork tubing sets, fork bearing assemblies, hydraulic shock absorbing cylinders, spring shock absorbers, rear pivots, cable stops, cable guides and back, chain and seat stays - Free

8714.91.90 00 - - -Other - 5%

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/taxes/sales-taxes/publications/pst-204-bicycles-tricycles.pdf

Parts are items that are essential to the basic functioning of a bicycle or qualifying tricycle. You

do not charge PST when you sell or install replacement parts specifically designed for bicycles

or qualifying tricycles, such as:

frame and fork sets

Feb. 26, 2019, 11:37 a.m.
Posts: 3464
Joined: Dec. 17, 2003

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: JBV

got all crazy and decided to see if there was a way to contact customs and just ask. to my shock, there is a phone number, but even more shocking was that it only took 10 minutes and a real person, english speaking as a first language no less, took my call.

used bicycle frame, made in Taiwan, 13% duty, PST and GST.

well, i guess that simplifies it.

I dont think that simplifies it. There is no PST on bicycle parts in BC. Whoever you talked to at customs is incorrect I believe. The link I posted above gives the breakdown you stated here.

Yes, also frames are different to bikes AFAIK. SC used to ship us bikes as build kits to offset this.

I just bought a frame from the US a couple of months ago. It was $1900 USD. By the time i'd got it in my hands (tax, shipping (bikeflights.com), insurance, brokerage) I'd laid out $3033 CAD. Tough to see that happening again unless it was a real unicorn of a bike. Edit - checking those numbers makes me a little sad.


 Last edited by: nouseforaname on Feb. 26, 2019, 11:37 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Feb. 26, 2019, 4:58 p.m.
Posts: 744
Joined: March 18, 2017

I paid GST when my MOJO frame arrived from UK. CBSA originally charged myself PST+GST+Duties but that was fucking wrong. So I disputed it

March 1, 2019, 9:32 a.m.
Posts: 914
Joined: Feb. 5, 2011

Posted by: JBV

got all crazy and decided to see if there was a way to contact customs and just ask. to my shock, there is a phone number, but even more shocking was that it only took 10 minutes and a real person, english speaking as a first language no less, took my call.

used bicycle frame, made in Taiwan, 13% duty, PST and GST. 

well, i guess that simplifies it.

The Canadian government actually has a duty estimate calculator on their website: https://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/travel-voyage/dte-acl/est-cal-eng.html

It looks like the way the duty works is that they calculate the cost of the bike and then add Canadian tax (5% + 7%), and then they calculate the 13% duty on the after-tax amount. If you punch a $1,000 bike into the calculator from a non-NAFTA manufacturing country, the total duty is $265.60, which is ($1,000 x 12%) x 13%.  

Sucks that you have to pay the duty even on a used bike, since the original purchaser would have technically already paid a duty when they imported the bike from Taiwan to the USA. Does the bike not effectively "become American (for NAFTA purposes)" once that duty is paid by the original purchaser? Or do you just keep paying more and more duties every time it crosses a border?

March 1, 2019, 9:33 a.m.
Posts: 914
Joined: Feb. 5, 2011

Posted by: Endur-Bro

I paid GST when my MOJO frame arrived from UK. CBSA originally charged myself PST+GST+Duties but that was fucking wrong. So I disputed it

Were you successful in getting the PST and duty refunded?

March 1, 2019, 11:58 a.m.
Posts: 14373
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

Is it really worth buying shit from the excited states with duty, shipping, the exchange yada fucking yada?

back in the day 661 had Axo Duallies (159$) on sale for 39.95 so I bought a pair, by the time I got them on my feet ... 112$

a few years ago a guy advertised used  dalbello ski boots on TGR exactly the same as mine with intuition liners for FREE he just wanted to get rid of them, he sent them slowest USPS from San fransico which should be the cheapest and I paypaled him 60$ for shipping and a beer

If you get the wrong size or something goes sideways the costs can really go up somebody on NSMB wrote about a 350$ t-shirt


 Last edited by: XXX_er on March 1, 2019, 12:29 p.m., edited 1 time in total.
March 1, 2019, 12:28 p.m.
Posts: 518
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

i've decided that it is not.  it might be for American's however. i sold a bike to the states 4 years ago and it was probably well worth it for the deal i gave the guy and the exchange. 

for the cost, duties, taxes and risk of unknown used frame, despite the value over brand new (looking at a 1 year old frame) it isn't worth it for me. i'd save close to a grand vs a new frame, but spend more than a grand over his firm asking price in Cdn pesos. i bet a bike could be sold across the border 10 times and pay duty and taxes 10 times. it's just the way the system works. 

basically, as a Cdn, there's no alternative. pay through the nose for high end shit and be grateful to live here. and stop looking at the US economic model of cheap prices, cheap taxes and free shipping and returns, it's like comparing your wife to supermodels....

March 1, 2019, 12:34 p.m.
Posts: 14373
Joined: Nov. 20, 2002

trying to get old farts to buy fat skis they would always say " yeah but my skis are fine " to which i would reply " ya yer wifes  ok too but wouldn't you rather have a super model ? "

nobody ever said no my wife is fine they would all just smile

and now they all got fat skis

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