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Anyone use 510 reach? And how tall are you?

Oct. 22, 2019, 6:50 p.m.
Posts: 375
Joined: May 11, 2018

Wondering what reach you guys run? I am always between a large and XL frame. I just got a XL warden with 475 reach and that's the longest I have ever owned. That being said, at 6foot 1.5" it is not overly big. I'm looking at a frame and the large has 475 reach but with a steeper STA and the ETT is only 630 or so. The XL is 510 reach. Anyone my size running 510 out there? How do you like it. With the really steep STA these days I don't know how to balance the benefits of reach vs ETT. I tend to pedal a lot so my seated position is important

Oct. 22, 2019, 7:52 p.m.
Posts: 1080
Joined: May 4, 2006

My XXL Hightower is 518mm reach. I'm 6'3" but with 33" inseam (so short leg/long spine).

Fit seems fine to me though the sheer length means things like the Kirkford switchbacks have to be taken really slow & precisely.

Not had it long enough to do any really long days in the saddle to determine whether I get back ache (just under 4hrs has been my longest ride so far...) which is my real reason for choosing something with such a long reach 

(The long/low/slack geometry is just a happy coincidence for me)

Oct. 23, 2019, 10:50 a.m.
Posts: 5
Joined: Oct. 23, 2019

You're considering a Kona Process 134 29 or Process 153 29 right?

I'm 6'2" ~33" inseam and I'm on a XL Process 153 29 (510mm stock, current setup ~507mm). So not too different from you. I was previously on an XL 2016 Norco Range (453mm reach), and when I bought that bike I was under the impression that 460mm was my max reach measurement, and thinking that I was looking for a bike between L and XL. After 2.5 seasons on the Range, I'd adjusted my riding position to be way more centered/weighting the front wheel more/taking wide lines around tight switch backs. I got on an XL Process and had no issues with the 510mm reach, it didn't feel long, it just felt better. I think that I'll be going for even more reach next time I upgrade.

The reason I bring this up is because I think whether you can adapt to this increase in reach will be somewhat dependent on the length of the other bikes you ride. If you're very used to comparatively shorter bikes, it may be more of an adjustment, and once you get used to it your other bikes will probably feel like ancient relics (at least that's what happened to me).

I'd also not classify the Process seat tube as steep by any means, 75.7° effective STA when your seat is in line with the headtube junction isn't realistic. My seat height puts it much higher than that combined with the actual STA being quite slack the seated position is much longer than the nominal ETT. Its also easier (and cheaper) to adjust your saddle fore and aft than to adjust your frame length.

My P153 now has a -2° Works Angleset and a 170mm fork pushing the wheelbase out to ~1281mm, (63.9° HT Angle), but that's a story for another day.

I'm very curious SixZeroSixOne, how are you finding the 666mm stack when combined with the 515mm reach on the XXL Megatower, it seems like that would effect the riding position a lot. I'm also jealous of those adjustable chainstays, but I'm happy to have moved away from integrated headsets.

Oct. 23, 2019, 6:20 p.m.
Posts: 201
Joined: March 6, 2017

I'm on a large Pole Evolink with a 510 reach, stack height also plays a major role too. I'm 6'4" and find it to be pretty much perfect. That being said I'm running a 50mm stem and a 10mm spacer under the stem so I did lose some reach with the spacer. The xxl Megatower would be perfect for me. Point being dont just look at the reach number on bikes as a 510 reach bike with a low stack will feel much longer than a 510 bike with a tall stack.

Oct. 23, 2019, 8:33 p.m.
Posts: 1092
Joined: Nov. 8, 2003

Keep in mind your virtual top tube length is the seated reach number.

Personally I'm ok with a somewhat shorter reach (standing). It's short TT's that I can't abide at all (seated).

Oct. 23, 2019, 10:26 p.m.
Posts: 375
Joined: May 11, 2018

Thanks for the feedback. I don't really want to be scrunched while pedaling seated either. I tried the 510 reach version of the bike I am looking at and although it felt fine to sit and pedal, I had to shift my weight way forwards to get the steering to feel OK. It's my first time being on a bike this long and although I could probably get used to it, I don't think I'd have as much fun. I figure the ETT and STA are kind of BS measurements on most bikes. The actual STA is quite slack and the effective STA is just an estimate that is always wrong when you size down. I figure I'll get the 475 reach bike and slide the seat back 15-20mm on the rails if I want more room seated. All my other bikes are 27.5 these days and I don't think I could handle going up to 29 AND sizing up in frame size....baby steps for me. I'm sure I will sacrifice top speed control and climibing, but it will be so much more fun I expect.

Oct. 24, 2019, 2:17 p.m.
Posts: 142
Joined: March 14, 2017

Posted by: RAHrider

Thanks for the feedback. I don't really want to be scrunched while pedaling seated either. I tried the 510 reach version of the bike I am looking at and although it felt fine to sit and pedal, I had to shift my weight way forwards to get the steering to feel OK. It's my first time being on a bike this long and although I could probably get used to it, I don't think I'd have as much fun. I figure the ETT and STA are kind of BS measurements on most bikes. The actual STA is quite slack and the effective STA is just an estimate that is always wrong when you size down. I figure I'll get the 475 reach bike and slide the seat back 15-20mm on the rails if I want more room seated. All my other bikes are 27.5 these days and I don't think I could handle going up to 29 AND sizing up in frame size....baby steps for me. I'm sure I will sacrifice top speed control and climibing, but it will be so much more fun I expect.

I had to put a longer stem and roll the bars more forward to get weight on the front end.  Kind of opposite thinking when going longer reach.

Oct. 24, 2019, 7:21 p.m.
Posts: 375
Joined: May 11, 2018

Posted by: wingelabs

You're considering a Kona Process 134 29 or Process 153 29 right?

I'm 6'2" ~33" inseam and I'm on a XL Process 153 29 (510mm stock, current setup ~507mm). So not too different from you. I was previously on an XL 2016 Norco Range (453mm reach), and when I bought that bike I was under the impression that 460mm was my max reach measurement, and thinking that I was looking for a bike between L and XL. After 2.5 seasons on the Range, I'd adjusted my riding position to be way more centered/weighting the front wheel more/taking wide lines around tight switch backs. I got on an XL Process and had no issues with the 510mm reach, it didn't feel long, it just felt better. I think that I'll be going for even more reach next time I upgrade.

The reason I bring this up is because I think whether you can adapt to this increase in reach will be somewhat dependent on the length of the other bikes you ride. If you're very used to comparatively shorter bikes, it may be more of an adjustment, and once you get used to it your other bikes will probably feel like ancient relics (at least that's what happened to me).

I'd also not classify the Process seat tube as steep by any means, 75.7° effective STA when your seat is in line with the headtube junction isn't realistic. My seat height puts it much higher than that combined with the actual STA being quite slack the seated position is much longer than the nominal ETT. Its also easier (and cheaper) to adjust your saddle fore and aft than to adjust your frame length.

My P153 now has a -2° Works Angleset and a 170mm fork pushing the wheelbase out to ~1281mm, (63.9° HT Angle), but that's a story for another day.

I'm very curious SixZeroSixOne, how are you finding the 666mm stack when combined with the 515mm reach on the XXL Megatower, it seems like that would effect the riding position a lot. I'm also jealous of those adjustable chainstays, but I'm happy to have moved away from integrated headsets.

This was super helpful. But also makes me second guess everything I know. I am looking at the process. Decided on the 134. I'm 90% of the way to the large. I love tech, tight and twisty. I would hate to not be able to clean everything on good sir martin just because I have a monster truck of a bike. How do you find yours is on super tight switchbacks or in tight treed singletrack?

I have an XL Knolly that I have messed with the geometry. It is supposed to have a 475 reach and a 640mm ETT. I have mulleted it so it is slack around 64.5 rather than 65.5. I think the actual reach is around 460 and the ETT 630. The large Kona might even be bigger feeling than that one, and it's my biggest. That being said, I bet I would be faster on an XL on a fast downhill.

Oct. 25, 2019, 8:49 p.m.
Posts: 375
Joined: May 11, 2018

Ok. So I took my own bike in and measured it up side of by side with the large and Xl konas. Wow, it's so different in real life as compared to the number charts. 

Turns out the large would be super cramped, too low a seat to handlebar drop and I'd be running an unfashionably long seatpost. So guess I'll be trying my first 510 reach. Interestingly the ETT is about the same as the rest of my bikes. 

Thanks for the in-depth advice wingelabs. Your post made me second guess the numbers and so I did more digging. I think I'll be really happy with the XL.

Oct. 26, 2019, 8:18 p.m.
Posts: 5
Joined: Oct. 23, 2019

I’m glad it was helpful. I think you’ll be happy with the XL, although it may take time to adjust. Your riding position will need to move forward but it’ll be a good thing. 

As for your question, Kirkford switchbacks feel slow. But the clock doesn’t lie, they are not. Good sir Martin, I actually have less trouble cleaning the switchbacks than on my range, on a good day I can clean them all no problem. Again, wide lines are your friend, leaning towards the middle of the corner and sometimes getting up and balancing but it’s very doable. 

Don’t fight buying the right sized bike. Lots of shorter people think that a long bike is a pain in tight trails, it just takes some technique adjustment.

(Also, XL process 153 fits a 210 dropper, hopefully the 134 does too)

I look forward to seeing your build!

Oct. 29, 2019, 8:28 p.m.
Posts: 897
Joined: March 18, 2017

I use 502mm Reach. 175cm in height. Ape index of 1.

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