ebikes on the Shore

Posted by: shoreboy

Posted by: andy-eunson

We’re kind of getting off track here from the original subject of type 1 ebikes on trails. I don’t think commuter ebikes are really much of an issue. If they get people out of cars and busses that’s a good thing. 

What does irk me are the excuse arguments to justify the use of ebikes off road. Oh it lets people with physical limitations ride. It allows unfit people to ride etc etc. Sure these things are true. But I haven’t seen any adds with old folks or infirm people riding ebikes. It’s quite simple, the main thrust of e mountain bikes is to climb faster so a rider can get more descents. That is the issue to discuss. Does this increased use cause a problem with trail wear and maintenance by mostly volunteer trail associations? I’ve read people say that was the same argument made by hikers against the use of mountain bikes back in the day. And those hikers were right. But from what I’ve seen the mountain bike groups stepped up big time with building and maintenance. 

Does the riding community desire growth of the sport through the inclusion of semi motorized bikes? Go the shore or Squamish or certain trails in Whistler and it’s pretty damn busy. Is that good or bad? My personal philosophy is anti growth for the sake of growth. I’ve heard it argued that if we want the sport to grow, as if it’s an incontrovertible argument that growth is good, we should embrace our ebike kin. I’m not convinced that infinite growth is good.

Agreed. I took this off on a tangent for sure. Apologies for that. Lets get back to the ebikes on trails discussion.

Why? We have talked about the EMtb issue to death. This thread was getting really interesting with some good points about ebikes in general.

Posted by: bux-bux 

Why? We have talked about the EMtb issue to death. This thread was getting really interesting with some good points about ebikes in general.

I agree. It's 77 pages later, the thread has evolved.

I have a few comments to respond to from last page but before I do, let me say - I wholly admit that I don't get ebikes. I am happy some people like riding them. I myself have ridden and still do ride bikes that others think are out dated or ridiculous. For instance, I rode a fully rigid 29er back in the year 2000 when 29ers were gauche and fully rigid was ridiculous. I currently ride a 27.5 hardtail with a 73 degree seat tube angle and a 450mm reach in size large - no one understands why I ride or like either of these, but I do. If ebikes are your jam, great 👍.  

Syncro, I don't think I've ever seen a post here with journal references- way to elevate the conversation. I actually didn't need any evidence to be convinced that exercise people like is a good thing. That being said, I know for fact that many of my patients are not getting the exercise they think they are because I do stress tests on them and we talk about their heart health and fitness level. I never tell them to stop ebiking but I encourage them to do some other exercise that will build their conditioning. Many ebike riders on here love cycling and use the motor to cover more ground but still get a great workout. If I assumed all my patients were using their ebikes like the riders on here, I would be misguided. On one occasion I had to convince a person that there was something wrong with their heart, a fact they couldn't understand because they ride their ebike every day. I won't go into details but sufficed to say they had open heart surgery a week later. 

Am I glad people ride ebikes and enjoy it, yes. Do I assume they are getting good exercise on them, no. Could they be getting exercise, yes. Is it good for the soul to ride on two wheels down a country road with the sun on your face and the wind at your back (motor assisted or not), HELL  YES! There are drugs that help people avoid heart attacks and strokes but none of the drugs actually make you healthy. Exercise is key, as is emotional health, family, friends, financial security, good diet etc etc. Medical school does not teach this perspective in bc in my experience; but people do understand this and a doctor saying so can sometimes go a long way.

KenN, your life sounds really really busy. I'm glad the motor on your ebike helps you fit everything in. Your ebike story is a commendable one in regards to the benefits of attaching a motor to a bike. Thanks for sharing it. This forum is a great place for all sorts of people with different experiences to share what they love about cycling. 

I'm interested to see where ebikes go as a form of transportation. I have bike commuted on and off for years including the 50k trip from downtown to whiterock. I don't bike commute any more, not because of the distance but because I hate getting to work drenched in sweat. Personally, I'd rather have an ebike with a throttle, the idea of getting all sweaty with a perfectly good motor between my legs seems superfluous, but obviously people like them for their own reasons. Enjoy your two wheeled contraptions and ride safe.

Posted by: RAHrider

Posted by: bux-bux 

Why? We have talked about the EMtb issue to death. This thread was getting really interesting with some good points about ebikes in general.

I agree. It's 77 pages later, the thread has evolved.

I have a few comments to respond to from last page but before I do, let me say - I wholly admit that I don't get ebikes. I am happy some people like riding them. I myself have ridden and still do ride bikes that others think are out dated or ridiculous. For instance, I rode a fully rigid 29er back in the year 2000 when 29ers were gauche and fully rigid was ridiculous. I currently ride a 27.5 hardtail with a 73 degree seat tube angle and a 450mm reach in size large - no one understands why I ride or like either of these, but I do. If ebikes are your jam, great 👍.  

Syncro, I don't think I've ever seen a post here with journal references- way to elevate the conversation. I actually didn't need any evidence to be convinced that exercise people like is a good thing. That being said, I know for fact that many of my patients are not getting the exercise they think they are because I do stress tests on them and we talk about their heart health and fitness level. I never tell them to stop ebiking but I encourage them to do some other exercise that will build their conditioning. Many ebike riders on here love cycling and use the motor to cover more ground but still get a great workout. If I assumed all my patients were using their ebikes like the riders on here, I would be misguided. On one occasion I had to convince a person that there was something wrong with their heart, a fact they couldn't understand because they ride their ebike every day. I won't go into details but sufficed to say they had open heart surgery a week later. 

Am I glad people ride ebikes and enjoy it, yes. Do I assume they are getting good exercise on them, no. Could they be getting exercise, yes. Is it good for the soul to ride on two wheels down a country road with the sun on your face and the wind at your back (motor assisted or not), HELL  YES! There are drugs that help people avoid heart attacks and strokes but none of the drugs actually make you healthy. Exercise is key, as is emotional health, family, friends, financial security, good diet etc etc. Medical school does not teach this perspective in bc in my experience; but people do understand this and a doctor saying so can sometimes go a long way.

KenN, your life sounds really really busy. I'm glad the motor on your ebike helps you fit everything in. Your ebike story is a commendable one in regards to the benefits of attaching a motor to a bike. Thanks for sharing it. This forum is a great place for all sorts of people with different experiences to share what they love about cycling. 

I'm interested to see where ebikes go as a form of transportation. I have bike commuted on and off for years including the 50k trip from downtown to whiterock. I don't bike commute any more, not because of the distance but because I hate getting to work drenched in sweat. Personally, I'd rather have an ebike with a throttle, the idea of getting all sweaty with a perfectly good motor between my legs seems superfluous, but obviously people like them for their own reasons. Enjoy your two wheeled contraptions and ride safe.

I wish we could still rep. Good post.

Posted by: RAHrider

Syncro, I don't think I've ever seen a post here with journal references- way to elevate the conversation. I actually didn't need any evidence to be convinced that exercise people like is a good thing. That being said, I know for fact that many of my patients are not getting the exercise they think they are because I do stress tests on them and we talk about their heart health and fitness level. I never tell them to stop ebiking but I encourage them to do some other exercise that will build their conditioning. Many ebike riders on here love cycling and use the motor to cover more ground but still get a great workout. If I assumed all my patients were using their ebikes like the riders on here, I would be misguided. On one occasion I had to convince a person that there was something wrong with their heart, a fact they couldn't understand because they ride their ebike every day. I won't go into details but sufficed to say they had open heart surgery a week later. 

Am I glad people ride ebikes an

Hey RAH, thanks for the added details and further explanation, that definitely changes the gist of what you said previously. It can definitely be a challenge to get people with little to no fitness background to understand or appreciate what level of effort is required when they have been sedentary most of their lives. 

Heeyyyyyyyy RAH, hey RAH....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWgvGjAhvIw

Armageddon... https://youtu.be/U55okaKSxQQ

Just like the guy pretty much spraying rocks as he whipped around the third switchback on fromme the other day. ( I'm guessing he hacked the motor). Just put pegs on it and get it over with.

Those guys weren't going that fast - seen a lot faster going up BP.

For shits and giggles I just configured one of those Optibikes that Tungsten posted up with some of the suggested upgrades and the price came to $20495 CAN. For a (claimed.....so probably much heavier) 73lb pedal assist electric moped. People are nuts. You could buy a decent MTB, Trails Moto bike and an OK used truck for that price. Reminds me of the people that sink $100,000 into a customized Tacoma that finally has the practicality of an AWD Astrovan :D

Posted by: trumpstinyhands

For shits and giggles I just configured one of those Optibikes that Tungsten posted up with some of the suggested upgrades and the price came to $20495 CAN. For a (claimed.....so probably much heavier) 73lb pedal assist electric moped. People are nuts. You could buy a decent MTB, Trails Moto bike and an OK used truck for that price. Reminds me of the people that sink $100,000 into a customized Tacoma that finally has the practicality of an AWD Astrovan :D

It's like congrats, you just bought a super shitty motorbike. I have only seen a couple of these things on the local trails, but I'm sure they will start being more frequent. Will be interesting to see how that shakes out.

I'm not sure if it makes me happy or sad that they outfit those monstrosities with a rholoff hub. I mean finally someone ditched the derailleur and cassette that barely makes sense with my power output. On the other hand, Rholoff hubs have always held a special place in my heart and I hate to see them indentured to the service of such an abomination.

Posted by: RAHrider

I'm not sure if it makes me happy or sad that they outfit those monstrosities with a rholoff hub. I mean finally someone ditched the derailleur and cassette that barely makes sense with my power output. On the other hand, Rholoff hubs have always held a special place in my heart and I hate to see them indentured to the service of such an abomination.

This just isn't good for the sport. I don't want to be associated with these uber dorks. We can all see this coming with the high power emotocross fake crankset bikes. What is the solution?

Posted by: trumpstinyhands

For shits and giggles I just configured one of those Optibikes that Tungsten posted up with some of the suggested upgrades and the price came to $20495 CAN. For a (claimed.....so probably much heavier) 73lb pedal assist electric moped. People are nuts. You could buy a decent MTB, Trails Moto bike and an OK used truck for that price. Reminds me of the people that sink $100,000 into a customized Tacoma that finally has the practicality of an AWD Astrovan :D

I was toying around with the idea of planning a bike trip from Van to Tuktoyaktuk the other day and this thing would almost be perfect.

^ Is there a gasoline generator in the trailer?

^Ha, or maybe the flag holder converts into a sail.