Ironically I was riding to work via 1st Ave due to mayor moonbeam's bike lane construction at MacDonald and PG road. I am almost in a traffic circle at about Yew Street when a little blue Echo comes up at a good clip from my left. If I hadn't have braked hard and turned my front wheel to the right, we would have collided. I would estimate that given our relative speeds that we got to the circle at the same time.
Be careful out there folks.
Debate? Bikes are made for riding not pushing.
Ironically I was riding to work via 1st Ave due to mayor moonbeam's bike lane construction at MacDonald and PG road. I am almost in a traffic circle at about Yew Street when a little blue Echo comes up at a good clip from my left. If I hadn't have braked hard and turned my front wheel to the right, we would have collided. I would estimate that given our relative speeds that we got to the circle at the same time.
Be careful out there folks.
Those little traffic circles are a nightmare. There is a bunch in East Van. I basically slow right down if a car was coming because you never know what they might do. Half the people don't know how to use them. Glad there was no injury though!
Those little traffic circles are a nightmare.
in reality those little traffic circles are working pretty well, reducing the number and severity of collisions. the downside is that they make people uncomfortable; the upside is that this makes people act cautiously and therefor safer
I basically slow right down if a car was coming because you never know what they might do.
case in point :) we don't always like what's good for us
"Nobody really gives a shit that you don't like the thing that you have no firsthand experience with." Dave
Those little traffic circles are a nightmare. There is a bunch in East Van. I basically slow right down if a car was coming because you never know what they might do. Half the people don't know how to use them. Glad there was no injury though!
They seem to work better when traffic coming from both directions is moving at about the same speed. I don't mind them in residential areas, and the one at 16th and Westbrook flows well.
The ones that seem to be problematic are where they are used to intentionally slow traffic on a busier artery. There's a couple on Blenheim between 41st and Broadway, and nobody has a clue what to do. Drivers coming off the side streets tend to give right of way to faster moving traffic, and drivers on the faster moving street end up slamming on the brakes waiting for the other driver to obey the first in the circle rule. They might as well just put in 4-way stops and avoid the confusion.
in reality those little traffic circles are working pretty well, reducing the number and severity of collisions. the downside is that they make people uncomfortable; the upside is that this makes people act cautiously and therefor safer
I see what you are saying, but I am not sure they make everyone slow down and be more cautious. Anecdotal, but I have seen people do some crazy things at those little circles (drive right over the top, drive round them the wrong way). While I agree, being cautious is a good idea I think that more predictable road users is probably also a good idea.
I'd be interested in seeing the data behind the traffic circles over, say, a two-way or four-way stop sign.
I would disagree with the traffic circles working better. In my daily commute along the 10th ave bike route, there are probably about 5 of them. Some of them were recently installed, taking out stop signs for traffic crossing 10th. I have seen more accidents at these intersections then I ever saw at the stop signs. Both cars and bikers to blame for the accidents. Cars dont see it as an uncontrolled intersection and just sail thru. Bikers often cut on the inside when making a left turn leading to even more chaos. Not sure why the stop signs were ever removed…
Not sure why the stop signs were ever removed…
Cuz they were slowing down life brah!
That feeling with your heart in your mouth as you know your going to hit but then just miss is no fun at all.
Had 1 of my car / bike accidents right near the area you are talking about in a traffic circle.
Was bombing down the hill on 1st towards Burrard and at the traffic circle on the corner of 1st and Arbutus a lady was coming down Arbutus. we both entered at the same time both at high speed. I almost squeaked through but her bumper clipped the edge of my rear wheel sending me over the bars flying through the air landing upside down on a construction sign skidding across the street.
It was both our faults and I walked away without a scratch.
I learned that day to never ever enter a traffic circle without slowing right down. If a car is headed in always assume they will go until they come to a complete stop and let you through.
Another real bad spot for traffic circle burners is Creelman Ave and Whyte Ave just off the Burrard st bridge towards the water. Something about the people living in that area and not giving a crap.
Almost got smoked driving through a traffic circle in Hastings Sunrise the other night. Already in the intersection and buddy in a Honda seemed to have no intention of yielding to me. Had to slam the brakes to avoid a collision. Then buddy tailgates me with high beams for 3 blocks as if I'd been the one that has no clue what the **** they're doing.
I used to routinely almost get hit in the circles along 10th between Fraser and Kingsways. Saw a lady on a bike get smoked by a Land Cruiser in one over in Kits last summer.
I learned that day to never ever enter a traffic circle without slowing right down. If a car is headed in always assume they will go until they come to a complete stop and let you through.
That's the bit people don't seem to get. It's like everyone sees the circle coming, thinks "oh boy! I don't have to stop!", and just flies in there with reckless abandon.
People in this city really aren't capable of handling something as "complex" as a traffic circle. Tear them all out.
As someone who has altered their commute due to countless near miss head on collisions with fuckwits cutting corners and going through those traffic circles the wrong way, I say: Fuck those stupid circles.
Ride, don't slide.
the downside is that they make people stoopid
fyp
i agree with you on the idea that traffic circles can be an effective means of traffic control but only as long as people know what to do and actually do it. i'm not privy to stats and know you are up on them so i won't dispute that the number and severity of incidents is down. however, in my many travails along bike routes with circles it is clear that many drivers don't know how to deal with them and the avg cyclist has even less idea than that.
i'll watch people's eyes as i'm coming into those circles and the number of people who actually slow down a bit to take a look in the three other directions is minimal.
We don't know what our limits are, so to start something with the idea of being limited actually ends up limiting us.
Ellen Langer
while traffic circles have been proven to improve road safety (i'm done digging up proof for you lazy :censored:, gfe!), emerging evidence suggests that for once, syncro might right!
however, in my many travails along bike routes with circles it is clear that… the avg cyclist has even less idea than that.
from an article entitled Traffic circles: Studies show theyre dangerous to Vancouver cyclists, the author notes towards the end of the piece that
Another of the that [sic] studys points was that a significant number of injuries at traffic circles involved only the cyclist in other words, the cyclist hitting the centre island.
:hurt:
"Nobody really gives a shit that you don't like the thing that you have no firsthand experience with." Dave
while traffic circles have been proven to improve road safety (i'm done digging up proof for you lazy :censored:, gfe!), emerging evidence suggests that for once, syncro might right!
from an article entitled Traffic circles: Studies show theyre dangerous to Vancouver cyclists, the author notes towards the end of the piece that
:hurt:
hey it's not my fault that you can't handle how i'm always right with these sorts of things. :P
that bit about cyclists hitting the island doesn't surprise me tho.
We don't know what our limits are, so to start something with the idea of being limited actually ends up limiting us.
Ellen Langer
I used to live at 12th Street East and St Andrews in North Van. Traffic circles were installed on St Andrews as drivers were using at as an alternative to St Georges which was the alternative to Lonsdale where it is impossible to drive down without hitting many many red lights. The first week some ding dong went over one at high speed waking up all the neighbours, gouging and breaking the new concrete and leaving a few spare parts around. All in all those did slow traffic down as intended. Most people can figure it out. The person i came close to this AM was driving too fast, and I would say I wasn't paying close enough attention to what was potentially coming around the corner. I don't think this person saw me. I wonder if the driver would have struck a pedestrian if one had been there?
Debate? Bikes are made for riding not pushing.
I used to live at 12th Street East and St Andrews in North Van. Traffic circles were installed on St Andrews as drivers were using at as an alternative to St Georges which was the alternative to Lonsdale where it is impossible to drive down without hitting many many red lights. The first week some ding dong went over one at high speed waking up all the neighbours, gouging and breaking the new concrete and leaving a few spare parts around. All in all those did slow traffic down as intended. Most people can figure it out. The person i came close to this AM was driving too fast, and I would say I wasn't paying close enough attention to what was potentially coming around the corner. I don't think this person saw me. I wonder if the driver would have struck a pedestrian if one had been there?
the biggest problem with the traffic circles in this city and in particular on the cycling routes is the sightlines - they're fucking horrible (fucking for necessary empahsis)
- you have narrow streets to start with
- the circles have signage and fooilage in them at eye level making it a bit difficult to see what's on the other side
- the properties on the corners typically have shrubs and/or trees right at the edge of the lots, sometimes overhanging the street
consider that the pic below is taken from the rooftop of a google car and that on a bike or in a car your sightline would be lower and inevitably worse.
proove me wrong here boom - muahahahahahahaha
We don't know what our limits are, so to start something with the idea of being limited actually ends up limiting us.
Ellen Langer
Forum jump:
