Nickel and Butcher - two new sleds from Santa Cruz

too many people like to state opinion as fact

And unfortunately my "opinion" is based on fact.

Too many people are blinded into thinking that linkage driven sp's are junk when they can easily outperform many linkage bikes (ie: Horst links).

Recent trends in DH World Cup races would suggest the opposite.

I think they look clumsy generally, the Evil Revolt being the exception.

I'll echo the thought that these two new rigs will likely phase in as the SL and the Heckler head to the big Hall of the Fame in the sky.

Doesn't anyone else think that these rigs also provide a fresh alternative to people eager to get on a SC but want to also run Hammerschmizzle? The VPP platform doesn't play nice with it. I thought that was a recurring thread when the Driver 8 came out.
As for these new bikes - I'd happily jump on either one. I dig my old Gemini but the Judge was a great step forward. Same goes for the Ventana Pantera - in its day, it was a ripper, but when it went all swing-linky on us, it just got better.

Recent trends in DH World Cup races would suggest the opposite.

I think they look clumsy generally, the Evil Revolt being the exception.

Association is not causation.

After watching the videos now, it seems the Nickel doesn't have ISCG tabs. Can anyone confirm or deny?

Association is not causation.

You haven't provided any evidence otherwise for your fact based opinion so I'll go on the fastest guys in the world appearing to be more dominant on VPP/Horst bikes.

I would wager Gee would be quicker on a less horse-like bike.

For the weekend warrior, performance is 31.4%* irrelevant anyway. I'd happy ride any half decent bike if the frame looks good and matches my new massively wide bars and shoe detailing. ;)

*FACT

I think they look quite nice.

But don't let that influence your purchasing decision.

You haven't provided any evidence otherwise for your fact based opinion so I'll go on the fastest guys in the world appearing to be more dominant on VPP/Horst bikes.

I would wager Gee would be quicker on a less horse-like bike.

For the weekend warrior, performance is 31.4%* irrelevant anyway. I'd happy ride any half decent bike if the frame looks good and matches my new massively wide bars and shoe detailing. ;)

*FACT

oh FFS just go ride one. :P

Why do these bikes always line the pivot point up with the big ring? Who even has a big ring? While I'm sure this linkage helps address the shit suspension performance of this design - moving the pivot looks like a better plan. Really - I rode a Heckler for years. The geo was excellent but realistically the suspension sucked compared to most anything else.

The Heckler needed a good shock to feel any good. Like the old 5th element was way over damped for that frame. With an RP3 or similar it performs great.

Big rings…. well most people outside of the lower mainland uses big rings on bikes like that. Shit, just think of the California market alone.

As with the heckler, no water bottle cage bosses.
Too bad - look like nice bikes but I get thirsty out there.

Saw both the Nickel and the Butcher in person today at Santa Cruz's booth at Sea Otter and they are very sharp looking in person. The rep said that they feel very similar to the VPP bikes as they used the linkage to tweek the suspension curve.

I didn't look, but I don't believe the Nickel had ISCG tabs. I will check again tomorrow and report back.

Brown, the_ SC Butcher_, the official bike of UPS.

Actually the price point looks promising, I've been riding with a lot of new riders recently and they want a good bike, but not an expensive bike just yet… many seem to opt for a hard tail or a used fully (often though not really the right bike, but a good cheap bike).

I looked at the Pitch when it came out for this very reason, alas it was not my favourite colour choice either