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MEATengines

Oct. 7, 2022, 10:11 p.m.
Posts: 479
Joined: March 16, 2017

Posted by: fartymarty

"elect fewer little-thinking "I've got mine" pricks" - Great Quote Andrew.  I am going to use it liberally.

What if the selection of pricks is more along what level of crazy and evil you can tolerate?

Oct. 8, 2022, 10:23 a.m.
Posts: 368
Joined: Aug. 13, 2017

Posted by: Endurimil

Posted by: fartymarty

"elect fewer little-thinking "I've got mine" pricks" - Great Quote Andrew.  I am going to use it liberally.

What if the selection of pricks is more along what level of crazy and evil you can tolerate?

Then you're screwed - like us in the UK atm.

Oct. 8, 2022, 9:32 p.m.
Posts: 342
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

Re: optimum drop. I was surprised by all the folks wanting less than they could get. I understand using the inside of the knee etc when steering, but ASSumed my preference for being able to swing my thigh over the saddle with pedals level was universal.

Silly me.

Oct. 9, 2022, 4:55 a.m.
Posts: 368
Joined: Aug. 13, 2017

Posted by: velocipedestrian

Re: optimum drop. I was surprised by all the folks wanting less than they could get. I understand using the inside of the knee etc when steering, but ASSumed my preference for being able to swing my thigh over the saddle with pedals level was universal.

Silly me.

170mm works for me at 6'1" but I would take the other 20mm or so that I could have if I was to get a longer post.

Oct. 9, 2022, 5:37 a.m.
Posts: 1658
Joined: Sept. 10, 2012

I've just kept increasing dropper length as tech evolved. 150mm was good. 175mm was a bit better. 200mm was worse, but that post was adjustable down to 170mm so I did that and I am happy with it. I like 150mm better than 200mm, but if I am buying a new dropper I'll shoot for 170mm-180mm and hopefully they are adjustable a few mm +/- for fine tuning. If other people want longer droppers that's great, but I won't be one of them.

FWIW - I'm 5'11" with 33" pants inseam.

Oct. 9, 2022, 5:57 a.m.
Posts: 507
Joined: June 17, 2016

The longer travel droppers are most useful on the bikes with steep seat tube angles and long reach. It makes sense that people who prefer more traditional STAs and reach numbers also don't need 200+ droppers.

Oct. 9, 2022, 7:28 a.m.
Posts: 395
Joined: Feb. 28, 2017

Posted by: niels@nsmb.com

The longer travel droppers are most useful on the bikes with steep seat tube angles and long reach. It makes sense that people who prefer more traditional STAs and reach numbers also don't need 200+ droppers.

I have also said this before myself and still agree to a point. Bikes with steep STAs are much less fun without a long enough dropper compared to bikes with slacker STAs where I can still have fun with less drop.

But, and had I written the larger article I would have addressed it, I’m finding that around about 170mm is my sweet spot regardless of STA. And I’m riding bikes with a fairly broad range of STAs right now.

Posted by: velocipedestrian

Re: optimum drop. I was surprised by all the folks wanting less than they could get. I understand using the inside of the knee etc when steering, but ASSumed my preference for being able to swing my thigh over the saddle with pedals level was universal.

Silly me.

I’m not going back to a 120mm post or anything crazy like that. I just found, for example, where 200mm drop felt very vague control wise lowering the post to 170mm gave me more control with no negatives even on really steep trails.

Not saying anyone’s wrong to want 200mm+ drop (seeing plenty of OneUp 240mm droppers around), it was just meant as an encouragement to conduct a very simple experiment, that requires zero investment, to ensure there isn’t a somewhat shorter number that’s better.


 Last edited by: AndrewMajor on Oct. 9, 2022, 7:29 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Oct. 9, 2022, 8:14 a.m.
Posts: 584
Joined: Jan. 2, 2018

Depends on saddle a little, too. 

I have a mix of sqlab and wtb on my machines.

185mm on a wtb is good. 

The SQLab have a more chonky backside and I feel a similar amount of saddle "presence" when descending if I use a 200-210mm dropper with those. 

5'11", 32" inseam, mostly slacker stas.

Oct. 9, 2022, 8:33 a.m.
Posts: 311
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

I could live with 125mm on everything but the most ridiculous steeps.  

I would also take a three position post over infinite.  Up, 1.5 inches down and full drop. I like that 1.5 inch drop for stuff I don't find too technical but want some drop.

O e thing I don't want is the post fully slammed in the frame where I have no ability to drop the post down for racing. On long stages like Whistler Top of the World to the Village I would drop my post in the frame so that my full up position was 1.5 inches down from my full climbing height. This way I could put it up for a climb but if I didn't get it down before a tech section I wasn't at full climb high posting.

Oct. 9, 2022, 9:51 p.m.
Posts: 342
Joined: Feb. 24, 2017

For all the folks choosing less drop than you could have, what's the preference based on?

I understand the repeated full squat getting tiring for racers, but for recreational use it seems minor. The steering with the knee works for me using the upper shin, and being able to swing my thigh over the saddle feels much better - like going back to the 410mm rigid Thomson at full slam.

Oct. 10, 2022, 4:55 a.m.
Posts: 81
Joined: Jan. 10, 2022

If your dropper is totally slammed where are you supposed to attach your Trail-A-Bike, rear blinker and clip-on fender?

I considered dropper evolution up to 10” when I picked my seat tube length, but didn’t run out to buy a 240 when the OneUp was released. Learning to landmark the saddle at a different spot takes time, and once my feet are flat on the ground when standing over the saddle I don’t find going lower adds a lot of functionality.

Oct. 10, 2022, 6:24 a.m.
Posts: 1658
Joined: Sept. 10, 2012

Posted by: velocipedestrian

For all the folks choosing less drop than you could have, what's the preference based on?

After a certain point going lower doesn't add anything to the bike's descending capability for me. I also use the lower position to sit on and rest or pedal a bit on longer sections where I don't want to raise/lower repeatedly. At 150-175mm drop I can do that. At 200mm I can't do that plus going from sitting to standing at that drop is very hard/tiring due to how deep my knee bend is. Trying to lower only part way is annoying when I don't get any benefit from the lower drop beyond 170mm.

Even at 150mm drop I can ride everything I want to ride without having the saddle be an issue in any way. So I just don't see why I would be shooting for 200mm+ drop. I've got no argument against other people doing so.

FWIW - I checked last couple rides and my saddles are about at knee height fully lowered on my bikes.


 Last edited by: Vikb on Oct. 10, 2022, 6:41 a.m., edited 1 time in total.
Oct. 10, 2022, 8:26 a.m.
Posts: 18444
Joined: Oct. 28, 2003

Posted by: Blofeld

If your dropper is totally slammed where are you supposed to attach your Trail-A-Bike, rear blinker and clip-on fender?

You forgot my seat-bag (serious)

Oct. 10, 2022, 9:12 a.m.
Posts: 181
Joined: March 1, 2017

I have 180mm drop on my hardtail but could go with 200. I've thought about it, but one of the main reasons I can see for going with a longer drop is to be able to get on the bike easily if you have to start riding in the middle of a tech / exposed section. The BB height on hardtails is lower on hardtails (or should be....) and mine is practically dragging on the ground so the above isn't an issue for me.

Once I'm on the bike, again I think the BB height helps with keeping the center of gravity low and giving the bike inherent stability so I've never felt the need for more drop.

Oct. 10, 2022, 10:16 a.m.
Posts: 507
Joined: June 17, 2016

For me the situation where (I think) I benefit the most from dropping the saddle as low as possible is when leaning the bike into a corner. Outer pedal at ~6 o'clock, outer leg very lightly bent, butt straight above the outer leg. Inner pedal ~12 o'clock, inner leg deeply bent with the thigh crossing over the saddle area. Vik shot some riding photos of me yesterday on the Fluid and at full 200 mm drop my thigh is hovering just above the saddle in that situation. 190 would probably be fine but put the seat any higher and my movement is restricted and my cornering ability impaired.

That explains why going from 160 to 213 on my Reign 29 (similar enough geometry as the Fluid) was such a revelation and brought the bike alive for me.

Between 200 on the Fluid and 213 on the Reign I notice no difference so I suspect beyond 200 drop there is no additional benefit for me.

For short sitting/pedalling sections I just raise the seat a little, after some practice this became second nature just like shifting, braking, etc. I also increased core and leg strength a lot in recent years so I don't get tired very quickly anymore standing on the pedals.

I'm 6' 2" (187 cm) with 35" (89 cm) inseam. STA on the Fluid is 77, on my Reign it's 76.8.


 Last edited by: niels@nsmb.com on Oct. 10, 2022, 10:23 a.m., edited 4 times in total.

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