MEATengines 2022...

Man, Andrew, sorry to hear about your Ford issues. That is a true lemon story. The Focus is a solid chassis, it’s a shame they couldn’t do other basics (like drivetrain or warranty) right. Hope there’s a remedy.

Posted by: Vikb

Posted by: tashi

The two-way and many sections of the semi protected bike lanes in Victoria are total death traps and IMO give a false sense of security  to the riders, while crating conditions that actually make it harder for drivers to see cyclists. 

It’s very frustrating because they’re both so close to being good, and much of our new infrastructure here is actually so good but our most visible and expensive initiatives kinda suck.

I agree the intersections were more dangerous than riding in a uni-directional on road painted bike lane. Actually what I found most problematic was being forced to ride with oncoming cyclists is a small confined space that I could leave. Lots of people inexperienced/not paying attention. The ones on e-bikes going at significant speeds. It was normal for me to be on edge anytime I used them during peak hours and I usually had to holler at them "Head's Up!" as they drifted into my lane and I was at risk of a head on collision. By comparison uni-directional bike lanes in Victoria put me traveling in the same direction as traffic [bike & car] plus I could leave the bike lane if I wanted/needed to since there was no curb on both sides. I can't recall an issue with a car while using the painted bike lanes during my 10+ years in Victoria and no issues with cyclists either.

I get that you feel that for you that painted bike lanes feel safer to you while trusting drivers to not decide today is the day you get taken out.

Reality is while maybe get taken put on those MUPs in Victoria by another rider. But I have a far greater chance of not being killed on those then riding in a bike lane while hoping that today is not the day that O am killed by a driver this time.

And more importantly since it has not been mentioned. Having PTSI, anxiety, and depression from a driver maiming has a very long term effect on how you react when put in anything that feel like threat of life while riding. And this should not be dismissed either.

I 100% don't expect every person on a bicycle to see the situation the way I do. That's why I would happily have my tax $$ spent on separated bike lanes if there are folks that will use them and appreciate them.

Posted by: Vikb

I 100% don't expect every person on a bicycle to see the situation the way I do. That's why I would happily have my tax $$ spent on separated bike lanes if there are folks that will use them and appreciate them.

It’s so hard to see how many awful and expensive bike lanes to nowhere there are out there. Or ones that make things more dangerous,

But horizontal or vertical paint really isn’t enough to separate folks from traffic and that’s what’s going to get more people on bikes (I’m purposely ignoring if those bikes have motors).

I’m entirely selfish. I’d like to be able to ride more places with my kid without feeling like every single second she could get driven down.

Posted by: T0m

Man, Andrew, sorry to hear about your Ford issues. That is a true lemon story. The Focus is a solid chassis, it’s a shame they couldn’t do other basics (like drivetrain or warranty) right. Hope there’s a remedy.

Thanks Tom,

It’s actually a great driving car and we’ve had tons of adventures in it. The last two transmissions we were in and out quick and they shuddered badly to let us know (which is probably also why we need engine mounts). But this time it was terrifying and we aren’t willing to go a year without a bike rack. I’m coming to terms with buying something else. 

———

Last night we dropped my wife at her group ride. It’s the first time in over 20 years I had to take both wheels off to get a bike into a car. 

I’m considering whether I can Tetris both Claire and my bikes back there, with Claire’s seat in place, with blankets between them. Ugh?!

Posted by: AndrewMajor

I’m entirely selfish. I’d like to be able to ride more places with my kid without feeling like every single second she could get driven down.

This is not selfish IMHO. Parents feeling comfortable letting their kids cycle anywhere without safety concerns is the golden standard that every city or town should strive for. It makes those cities or towns more liveable for everyone.

Posted by: mnihiser

@Andrew: regarding your Focus tranny problems. I was a supervisor in a Ford transmission plant here in the states. Word was that the Focus unit had design flaws and there is no cheap or easy fix. Even our employees who owned a Focus seemed to get the runaround. IIRC there was a class action suit and subsequent settlement.

Yeah, we didn’t join the class action, until now we’ve swiftly been looked after, and I believe that it’s not whether or not f***-ups happen it’s how you deal with them. Hey, let there be no doubt that I’m a romantic and a sucker. 

I can’t decide if I’m going to write something about it - because it make me sound variously like a sap and an idiot and I, like most people, don’t much enjoy that self image - but this is more than just a car issue for me. 

I’ve only owned Fords going back to my ‘93 Escort. As a little kid we had a Bobcat (or Lynx maybe) and a Courier, that the mine provided, and the only cars we ever had that weren’t Fords were a pair of mini-vans when Chrysler was the only game in town. It’s one of the few unthinking influences I carried on from my dad. 

It’s actually the only major manufacturer (unless we count Tilley hats) that I have/had any brand loyalty to.

Posted by: [email protected]

Posted by: AndrewMajor

I’m entirely selfish. I’d like to be able to ride more places with my kid without feeling like every single second she could get driven down.

This is not selfish IMHO. Parents feeling comfortable letting their kids cycle anywhere without safety concerns is the golden standard that every city or town should strive for. It makes those cities or towns more liveable for everyone.

Cheers Niels,

I guess more accurately it’s not purely altruistic. It’s tax dollars I want to see spent for my benefit.

Posted by: AndrewMajor

Posted by: [email protected]

Posted by: AndrewMajor

I’m entirely selfish. I’d like to be able to ride more places with my kid without feeling like every single second she could get driven down.

This is not selfish IMHO. Parents feeling comfortable letting their kids cycle anywhere without safety concerns is the golden standard that every city or town should strive for. It makes those cities or towns more liveable for everyone.

Cheers Niels,

I guess more accurately it’s not purely altruistic. It’s tax dollars I want to see spent for my benefit.

The way I see it, it's investing tax dollars in something that ultimately results in less cars, less accidents, less pollution, more physical exercise, etc. It revolves around a vision of a liveable city/town.

I know, the whole idea that an urban area should not be designed around facilitating cars sounds very ridiculous to most North Americans. Someone who has never experienced it may not be able to see it because it's too far outside their frame of reference.

I'm happy to see here in Comox/Courtenay there is a non-trivial amount of people cycling, including kids to/from school. And most drivers seem to be very courteous towards cyclists. It's a start.

I'll note that my comments are about uni-direction painted bike lanes vs. bi-directional separated bike lanes/MUPs. I haven't ridden much on uni-directional separated bike lanes, but I could see how they would remove a significant number of issues I have with bi-directional variety.

Posted by: AndrewMajor

Posted by: Vikb

I 100% don't expect every person on a bicycle to see the situation the way I do. That's why I would happily have my tax $$ spent on separated bike lanes if there are folks that will use them and appreciate them.

It’s so hard to see how many awful and expensive bike lanes to nowhere there are out there. Or ones that make things more dangerous,

But horizontal or vertical paint really isn’t enough to separate folks from traffic and that’s what’s going to get more people on bikes (I’m purposely ignoring if those bikes have motors).

I’m entirely selfish. I’d like to be able to ride more places with my kid without feeling like every single second she could get driven down.

Andrew, Vik, we need all available options. Because I have commented to people out here is bike lanes with a mere painted line really best serve those cyclists who are mentally prepared to deal with distracted humans operating cars that easily become weapons. Alot of riders I know would rather have other options.

One thing should note is an interesting thing observed. It seems like every cycling advocate in Ontario a few years ago became target locked with the protected bike lanes in Vancouver after the Olympics. Yet no one noted the previous work done in the years. That being all the side street bike routes that not only where mapped  but signed, all major road crossings you not only had cross walk light but they put a pole with the activation button at the curb for cyclists, and when there was a change of direction of the side street bike route there was a direction sign giving direction , and so on. In Vancouver could almost ride the Pacific Spirit Park trails then via the side street bike route get to Burnaby Mountain trails to ride. Without touching a busy main street. There is zero effort in Toronto or or even Kingston to achieve the same results. This isn't even before you include the False Creek Seawall. It was a definite culture shock to come out here to have so little like that and to create my own was a bloody navigational nightmare.

Though depending on where you live in Hamilton and Ottawa there is some of that but not a great deal. 

Speaking of MUP's it was interesting after 2010 how quietly and suddenly Toronto Council built paved paths under two hydrolines in the easter part of Scarborough near where I lived when moved out here. Plus another was built alongside a creek. See them used all the time especially by local kids. For me it's great having them as it is was a good option to get to trails in the Rouge from my Mother in Law's place and now my Sister in laws. 

Reality though is though government can pass all the laws they want to "protect" cyclists from drivers maiming/killing them. They are utterly worthless if the only time they get used is after the cyclist is maimed/killed by the driver. It does absolutely nothing to protect and value life other then a "Look we did something so we cared" publicity exercise by the elected types.

Andrew, totally get the bike lanes that go nowhere and just end. Been a mind numbing thing to watch in Toronto over the last twenty years.

Living in Abbotsford most of the bikelanes dump you into traffic. The othes are on grades too steep for the average rider to get up without walking. Bike lanes should be designed for my six year old grandson.to ride on. Green paint at a crossing is essentially a feel good for the city especially when it just dumps you on to a busy street and that's it.

Posted by: Jonathan

Living in Abbotsford most of the bikelanes dump you into traffic. The othes are on grades too steep for the average rider to get up without walking. Bike lanes should be designed for my six year old grandson.to ride on. Green paint at a crossing is essentially a feel good for the city especially when it just dumps you on to a busy street and that's it.

"But we did something. See we care.' say the politicians.

I think the elephant in the room when it comes to how do we do cycling safe infrastructure is the culture we have built around the act of driving motor vehicles. Where I live in coastal California the very progressive minded city bureaucracy has implemented all kinds of infrastructure. They have stated that their goal is to make this a safe place to cycle and do something about carbon by using this infrastructure to not only promote cycling but make driving less attractive. Sounds good right? Enter the law of unintended consequences. Over the last few years accidents are up. Most involved the places where new infrastructure intersected old infrastructure. I have written to my local government about this and have mostly been met with a line of response of “ we know this is all new and it’ll just take time for everybody to get use to it.” Apparently we are just suppose to accept the death and injuries as the price to be paid for progress. What I notice day to day cycling and driving is an increased level of confusion and frustration that I know must be a contributing factor.

My point is that infrastructure matters but not nearly as much as what’s going on with people when they are driving. We don’t take it seriously, we are distracted, we are poorly trained and there are almost no consequences for fucking up and killing people. What we think of as accidents are not accidents but failures of responsibility and should be judged and punished accordingly. When someone accidentally shoots someone with a gun we often charge them with a felony. 

Ultimately, infrastructure can only play a minor and supporting role in safe and sane transportation. We need to change our hearts and minds. We need to develope a culture of cooperation. We need to always know that encased in these fragile meat sacks is a precious soul. We need to model good behavior and judgement particularly to our children. Road rage should have no place on the roads.

Peace and love to all