MEATengines 2022...

Posted by: skooks

"Hardtails aren't for beginners anymore; they are for beginners who lack the funds for FS. "

For sure, but there's another user group at the other end of the spectrum. The people I see buying modern HTs are all very experienced riders looking for a bike that offers a different riding experience to compliment their full-sus rigs.

Only reason at this time would start considering full suspension is when I need it medically to help my injuries.  Currently am fine with hardtails and contrary to what others think I am happy with this path.

Posted by: skooks

"I do agree that hardtails are mainly for weirdos - seems to be the common thread and I include myself under that banner."

Agreed. Sign me up for the weirdo club.

I know I also resemble this remark, and acknowledge my hardtail bias.

Posted by: skooks

"Hardtails aren't for beginners anymore; they are for beginners who lack the funds for FS. "

For sure, but there's another user group at the other end of the spectrum. The people I see buying modern HTs are all very experienced riders looking for a bike that offers a different riding experience to compliment their full-sus rigs.

But if this really is the case with how many awesome hardtail rigs there are (and how much less they cost to run), that does make me a bit sad. How many folks aren’t getting into riding because the culture says you’re too poor to ride? How many people get turned off because the bike they buy for 4K is a POS when the hardtail equivalent is a ton of bike?

Posted by: AndrewMajor

But if this really is the case with how many awesome hardtail rigs there are (and how much less they cost to run), that does make me a bit sad. How many folks aren’t getting into riding because the culture says you’re too poor to ride? How many people get turned off because the bike they buy for 4K is a POS when then hardtail equivalent is a ton of bike?

Andrew, this is exactly what have heard a few times.

So far this year I haven't even taken out my Meta AM once and I've been only riding  my '09 RM Reaper 1 that I bought on kijiji as a loaner bike for 100$ 4-5 years ago. I've rebuilt and changed most parts, but it still has the original RS Dart fork, stock narrow wheels and cheap cable disc brakes.

Most people I meet in the trails only look at my bike and I can see the judgement in their eyes. I guess It would be different if I was riding a Chromag, but I don't care and  I'm having just as much fun as when I'm riding my tricked out full suspension bike. (My back does not agree but it's just temporary.)

Maybe it is location dependant, but riding an old hardtail is a good test for ego and/or a nice sociology experiment around here. Whenever I see someone riding and old bike or a rigid bike (hasn't happened to me since the late 90s here on the East Coast), I'm thinking they're like me and they like to vary their riding experience, or that's what they were able to afford and it's nice that they're giving the sport a go without needing a 3-4K bike.

Unfortunately, people are so influenced by marketing, sales people and looks these days. Everyone would benefit from more open-mindness.

The combination of trails in town where I live in Alaska are incredible on a hardtail - basically the only reason I own a full-sus is for long distance backcountry stuff. Lots of folks around here just squish their way around the XC trails on long travel enduros, and there’s definitely a bit of stigma towards hardtails. The bike I’ve spent the largest portion of my riding career on was a Trek Marlin 7, which admittedly isn’t the most capable hardtail, but was plenty for me to ride (almost) everything I wanted to around here. One of the only negative experiences riding a MTB that’s stuck with me is a couple years ago someone I know saw me out riding on that bike and literally told me to “get a real bike”, which has only spurred me on to ride harder on my hardtail. My full-sus has been down for maintenance for a bit now, and I’ve been really enjoying the hardtail-only life again - though an interesting discovery I’ve made is that I much prefer the ride feel of aluminum 27.5+ wheels to carbon 29ers without rear suspension to add some give.

Posted by: fartymarty

Posted by: skooks

For sure, but there's another user group at the other end of the spectrum. The people I see buying modern HTs are all very experienced riders looking for a bike that offers a different riding experience to compliment their full-sus rigs.

I would absolutely agree with this. They are for experienced riders who want to challenge themselves.

I thought this whole concept was covered with "weirdos", i guess I should have been more clear ;)

Hardtails make everything faster, rougher and more fun while actually going slower.

Andrew's point about noobs being able to pick up a sick hardtail for 3-4k is a good one. I find a good number of new riders aren't into the "challenge" of a hardtail though. Flow trails and full suspension are a pretty straight forward equation for a noob to feel like a veteran rider. Add a chair lift or motor and noobs really don't have to do much to feel like they are getting the full mtb experience. Imagine trying to talk someone who prefers flow trails and chairlifts into buying a chromag. This is where mtb seems to be going for the masses as far as I can tell.

Hardtails aren't really for weirdos but those who prefer to roll down b-line on their enduro bike will see us that way.

In a way I enjoy the looks I get when I roll up on my old beaten up Krampus.  It's got some reasonably nice parts but is a million miles away from being blingy.  My Murmur is similar in a way in that it's not your cookie cutter carbon sagwagon.  Maybe I am that weirdo...  Maybe those in this thread are also those weirdos...  and i'm happy with that.  We just need to spread the HT love.

I agree with all the above statements, I love my Cotic...great little hardtail. Our "mellow" east coast trails are perfect for it. Had a buddy who moved out here from Wyoming and said his FS hardly got used because the HT was so much fun here. The descents re to short to justify it...but I still get weird looks out on the trail, can't wait to see the looks when I go back to SS!

I did run into a HT rider at the CBC in Cumby post-ride yesterday. We had a quick chat and he commented that Cumby was ideal HT terrain.

Posted by: fartymarty

In a way I enjoy the looks I get when I roll up on my old beaten up Krampus.  It's got some reasonably nice parts but is a million miles away from being blingy.  

When I work at the LBS I usually ride the rigid SS Krampus and being lazy I park it in a corner of the showroom vs. hauling it upstairs to the bike storage area. It's got some interesting stuff hanging on it and is definitely not like any other bike in the shop. So far I have only had one customer notice it and comment on it. It's almost like it has an invisibility/cloaking field generator on it. ;-)

Cumberlandworx coverage has been solid.

Posted by: Vikb

I did run into a HT rider at the CBC in Cumby post-ride yesterday. We had a quick chat and he commented that Cumby was ideal HT terrain.

Neat, that doesn’t look anything like a filing cabinet! (Kidding, kidding, I like how Orange FS bikes look). 

Posted by: mrbrett

Cumberlandworx coverage has been solid.

Cheers!

Looking forward to the Kali invader review...I have one of their helmets and find the shape to fit my noggin well...I never understood the judgement from others regarding full face/pads/ect...I applaud any and all safety measures a person is willing to use, regardless of what I am comfortable in.

As for the latest post...do you think Marin will offer the San Quentin 24 as a frame only? I have so many parts that it would be a shame to not use them. Also any other dad's on here that know who makes a decent 20" front tire? Preferably with some proper knobs. We live around Snowshoe and it has been quite wet this year.

*Edit* loving the coverage, btw. I think my daughter is inspired (or challenged, can't figure out which one) by your posts. She now want to try skinnies!

For anyone that wants to get #CUMBYwerxed it's not a limited time offer. We are open for business 365.