First Look
Specialized P2 and P3 Bikes First look HIS and his
Specialized recently reintroduced their Dirt Jumper line in 4 different sizes and I was offered to "review" the P3 for the summer. While the idea of commiting to ride and review a DJ bike seemed silly, and downright dangerous, the impending arrival of a young guest at my household made the decision making a little more appealing.
Dirt jumping creates community. Building the terrain to ride together, and spending hours shaping massive piles of dirt into rideable sculptures, takes many hands and feet. These hands and feet end up spending many hours together and become family. Just like any family, there is dysfunction and anger and love all within arm's reach. This communal aspect of riding and sessioning is what makes the whole dirt jump scene fun. While I've had very little interest in entering the family of blown knees and busted shoulders as the repetitive, progressive nature of jumping little bikes on big take-offs creates, I was excited about a few things lining up for July-August to make this review worth everyone's time.
My offspring, who is now a 125cm (4'1") tall firecracker of a boy lives quite far away from where I reside in North Vancouver, BC. He goes to a school in Eastern Spain and is already a master of multiple languages at the age of 8 1/2. We had previously made plans to get him out to Canada where he was born, for summer holidays last year but the craziness that was the Passport mania delayed his visit to the summer of 2023. He doesn't spend a lot of time on his bike in Spain due to the excessive daytime heat and questionable driving exercised on the neighbourhood streets. His visit to the mountain biking capital of the world should get him up to speed on what is possible on two wheels.
I told Specialized I'd be particularly interested in reviewing the P3 if they also sent a P2 for the little man who would be my roommate as well as my riding buddy at the newly opened North Shore Bike Park.
My bluff was called immediately as Allan Cook showed great interest in the proposition. We would be riding the indoor bike park as often as we could and see what kind of progress we could make over the course of the month.
The first model in the line is the 20-inch-wheeled P1 with a rigid fork. The traditional 22.2mm bars are swapped for 19mm ones with thin grips for little hands. The geometry is corrected for a 100mm fork at sag. The excellent Manitou JUnit Expert-Pro fork comes in 100mm options which I would personally use. It's a wicked looking bike but after some deliberation with Allan, we decided it might be a little small for the intended user.
My roomie is of thinner proportions, not unlike how I ran my lipid levels when I was at his age. Full of energy and sprint speed, he lacks stamina for the longer rides but has ton of get up and go for a lap around the pumptrack.
Specialized P2
The 24-inch-wheeled P2 is a sharp looking bike and all the new bikes have a few things in common.
The head angle, which sits at 68.5°, and the 12x148 boost (can I get an Hells Yeah!) hub spacing. The slack-ish angles of the bike allow for a relaxed riding experience. For Comparison the Evil Faction II and the Chromag Monk are around 70°. If you are an experienced park or street rider those might be good options but the slacker P Series feels right at home on the jumps and pump track for this old man. The young roomie however has no idea what he is doing so it also works in his favour by allowing him to make mistakes and not faceplant.
The standover is exceptional and the 680mm bars and 140mm cranks are just about perfect for him. A 30T chainring paired to a 13T cog seems to be a decent gearing for the 24" bike for riding around and spinning out at the BMX track. I wouldn't change a thing on that front. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't change anything on the P2 for the foreseeable future. The Kicker Sport tires roll fast and grippy on just about any surface they touch. Wood, dirt, gravel, asphalt. It's all good.
The P2 however is a 1700 bike. While not cheap, the Manitou Junit-forked fun machine will not be out grown for a few years. As a matter of fact, I personally took it for a few laps around the Bike Park and was surprised how rideable it was for my 5'9" (175cm) self.
Specialized P3
The dictionary definition of a Dirt Jumper may illustrate a steel tubed sleek frame but the Specialized P3's alloy frame sure is a looker. The glossy grey/black combo is excellent and if you have the chaps to send it big, you can also opt in for the Desert Rose option. It looks stunning in person.
What makes the P series an easy going bike is the geometry first and the 68.5° Head Angle is excellent off of big jumps at the Bike Park or the local trails. Specialized put a Sram Level T brake on the P series and while it does a noble job scrubbing speed when coming in hot, I wouldn't want to rely on one on the trails. Why would you have to if you ask, the reason would be that all the P series bikes have internal routing for a dropper post. Which will allow for an easy pedal to the local spot or maybe even ride some easy blues and greens in the woods. I've seen such things happen in the past and The Marzocchi Z1 DJ with the grip damper is so damn good, that I would have no hesitation hitting some fun lines on it. Coming up to Bobsled soon! stay tuned.
P Series wheels are stout and rock Schrader tubes with metal valves. Pumped up to 55psi, they roll mighty fast, have tons of support and grip on wood, asphalt and gravel on our local BMX track.
165mm cranks are fine on this beast and mated to a 30t Chainring and 13T cog, there is enough get up and go for anything I've come across so far.
9-degree backsweep, 6-degree upsweep, 38mm rise, 750mm width, bars feel great on the bike and I can see taller folks may want to bump that up to a 50-70mm rise one for more comfort.
P3 and P4 frames share geometry and can be run with either 26 or 27.5". At my height I see no benefit to the bigger wheels and the 26-inch-wheeled P3 seems perfect. Recently a buddy of mine decided to purchase a P4 and I will be asking his opinions for the final review to see if there is a merit to the bigger wheels for the 6'2" (188cm) fella.
The Goal
With the mini me constantly looking for ways to burn whatever calories he is ingesting, we are spending as much time on the bikes as possible. Either on the rather steep access trails or killing hours at the North Shore Bike Park working on skills.
We've made 3 visits in so far and aiming for at least 10 or 15 total. The progression curve is steeper than the Shore itself but he is getting more and more confident on every visit and the translation of the skills to the trail has been phenomenal.
I'm looking forward to writing a report at the end of his visit as he just started making an elevation/distance chart for every ride he is going on. This kid is awesome!
5'8"
162lbs
Playful, lively riding style
Photographer and Story Teller
Lenticular Aesthetician
Comments
Jeff White
1 year, 2 months ago
This is fantastic, and timely for me. On Saturday, my 16 y/o son and I picked up matching Cannondale Daves on closeout from a local shop so we could DJ and hit the pump track together. At 50, I'm a little concerned about pushing myself too hard as I've had more than enough injuries over the years, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't stoked to get out and try to up my skills a bit as I know they will translate well to the trail bike. Looking forward to your followups!
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
Definitely scary carrying speed around paved berms on pumptracks. So much traction yet so little room for error. I love the slack HA of the P3 for that reason the most. Definitely the least twitchy DJ I've been on.
Have a good Dave!
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Cooper Quinn
1 year, 2 months ago
Hey, this is *my* niche!
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
Dadcntry vs jumpcntry
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OldManBike
1 year, 2 months ago
“if you have the chaps to send it big” is the best usage error I’ve seen in a long, long time.
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
Intentionally International.
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OldManBike
1 year, 2 months ago
Where I’m from, the expression is “have the chops,” and chaps are seatless leggings worn for riding horses and other, more-adventurous activities. So the image of someone sending dirtjumps while wearing leather chaps, bottom bared to the world, was an intriguing one.
https://www.grammarphobia.com/blog/2019/03/chops.html
A very fine review in any event.
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93EXCivic
1 year, 2 months ago
Great review. But why is boost spacing on a dirt jumper a hell yeah? It seems like 135mm makes more sense based on available hubs and wheel sets from dirt jumpers.
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
I forgot to mention, but this bike comes with a der. hanger for those who would maybe want to add some 1x10 gearing for easy cruising. I figured the boost spacing would open up massive amount of hub possibilities for that option.
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finbarr
1 year, 2 months ago
That was a great read. I’m really looking forward to when my 1 year old is old enough to do some pedaling with me. Just might have to get matching dad & son dirt jumpers….
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Cooper Quinn
1 year, 2 months ago
Start 'em young? https://nsmb.com/articles/kids-ride-shotgun-dirt-hero/
And don't forget to treat yourself. https://nsmb.com/articles/dadcountry/
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BarryW
1 year, 2 months ago
Fun stuff Deniz.
But $2,499 for a rigid, single speed, aluminum frame with cheap brakes is insane.
For that much money I got a full suspension, Fox fork and shock, 4 piston brakes, dropper, etc.
I'm sure it's a great bike but for God sakes that's just ridiculous on the price. How can this cost more than a Status 140? Feels like some crazy profiteering on these. Especially when a Marin Alcatraz is only $1,149 with similar components. And a Polygon Trid is only $1,099.
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
I hear ya..
Chromag Monk is $2500CAD
Transition PBJ is $2000 USD
All made is super low numbers and kept for 10+ years. Thats $200 year...
Netflix membership is $20/month, $240/year....
Choose your poison.
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BarryW
1 year, 2 months ago
That's a decent way to think of it, but still for most manufacturers they make one size, one spec and sell tje exact same bike for years and years.
I don't disagree that you can justify it in some manner, but I'm saying that these kinds of prices need to be commented on because they are ridiculous.
How can they cost more to bring to market than the Status 140? It literally has twice the value of components on it, AND a more complicated to manufacture frame, AND several sizes. See what I'm getting at?
And in what way are those examples you mentioned better than my much lower cost examples? Seem like apples to apples to me.
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
I'm just pointing out the pricing of the best dirt jumpers in the market. They are all high. Not sure why but only way it makes sense is the people who are buying the dirt jumpers are not buying any other bikes. They are not repeat customers so they pay a premium. Does that make sense? Im not sure.
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BarryW
1 year, 2 months ago
So what makes those the 'best dirt jumpers on the market'? Because they are the highest priced?
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
As Pete pointed out the amount of snapped steerers or frames i have seen on clapped out and cheap DJ bikes scare me enough to spend some money on well built frames. Specialized, definitely is on top of the list when it comes to aluminum construction.
But i will draw some parallels between all the attainable DJ frames in the market for the final peace.
Pete Roggeman
1 year, 2 months ago
It's very common when evaluating bikes like this to zoom straight to the componentry and only give a cursory glance to the biggest part of the package - the frame.
Back when metal was the only choice - steel, mostly - and hardtails were the norm, we all paid a lot more attention to the materials and workmanship involved in those frames. Good ones were strong, straight, and felt nicer underneath you. It's no different for carbon frames - there are good ones and ones that aren't as good - but it's difficult for brands to communicate much about their frames because consumers can't see inside them, and the manufacturing process is less about craft and quality and more about proprietary processes.
This inability to properly market frame quality - or frustration that the consumer doesn't value it - has carried over into most bike categories. Marketers use other tactics like branding and sponsorship to overcome this.
Easily forgotten is that Specialized has very high quality manufacturing and quality control on all their bikes. A dirt jumper made to last has to be tough but it shouldn't feel like a couple of wooden wheels riding on a lead chassis, so you'd better believe they spent time tuning the ride as well as engineering a frame that is both strong and light.
Your original question, however, is very valid: why should someone pay a premium for a dirt jumper? That's a challenge we can lay at Deniz's feet for part two of this series.
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BarryW
1 year, 2 months ago
As a response to that it feels like there is a claim going on that there are bad frames. But really the idea of better vs bad feels a little silly as the expectation for ANY frame is that it will be strong enough for purpose. Again I ask how a Status 140 is less money than this bike? Is the implication that the Status has a frame that will break when used according to its purpose? I think we can all agree that it absolutely should not break when ridden in any 'normal' way.
Are there other brands (such as I've referenced for a lot less $$$) that regularly break? Is it true that Specialized has higher quality control than a brand like Marin?
I hear you on ride feel, but how much of that can be actually attributed to the frame and not the wheelset?
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Zero-cool
1 year, 2 months ago
I’m guessing it’s an economy of scales and they make and sell a lot more of the Status compared to the P3/4s.
Pete Roggeman
1 year, 1 month ago
There's a lot more to frame quality than strength or ride feel. Making something strong enough 'not to break' is not hard, but it's also not the standard we're talking about here. Making something strong and light is expensive. With good ride feel? Expensive. Specialized tunes every frame according to size, so in a way each bike model has 4-5 or 6 different frames, each one designed to ride and flex for a given weight distribution and flex pattern that a given weight and strength range will demand for that size. Much more expensive to do it that way. I can't comment on Marin's QA vs Specialized, but it would be fair to assume Specialized has a more extensive testing, R&D, design, engineering, and QA process than almost every other brand.
Bikes
1 year, 2 months ago
This article makes me sad…LA has horrible access to bike parks (i.e. basically non existent). Worse, it has the weather to allow their use year round, but just seems to hate cycling. Local officials don’t even know what a bike park is.
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
Hit the streets. Thats what i am suggesting my offspring do when he gets back to Espana. But i definitely wish we could get rid of random useless parks and play structures for some pumptracks.
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Dogl0rd
1 year, 2 months ago
What? There are some great pump tracks and dirt jumps in LA and the greater area. El Monte pump track is one of them. Sapwi is better dirt jumps than El Monte, but a more professional and less interesting pump track. And there are 2 bike parks within 2 hours away. Not to mention TONS of trails. What are you talking about???
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Bikes
1 year, 2 months ago
Familiar with both and if you are familiar with LA and children and parenting, you will realize LA is huge geographically and by # of people. 2 parks is a shame Imagine if there were just 2 skate parks!
Spending 2-3 hrs driving (round trip) to go to a bike park gets very hard in the busy schedule of children/parents.
LA has lots of trails (for many it’s an hour drive to them). A lot of them aren’t conducive to those under 5 or 6 that don’t have gears. not complaining as it is just our steeper geography where trails are made, but pump tracks and bike parks allow younger kids to ride features without big (for them) climbs and are just a fun place to hangout…like skate parks (which we have everywhere)
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Dogl0rd
1 year, 2 months ago
An hour to get to trails???? Do you live underground?
You can get to trails in 20-30 minutes even if you live in Venice. At the friggin beach.
I hate to say it but I think you are just being grumpy, there is so much here.
MTB went mainstream MUCH more recently than skateboarding. So if you're expecting more, give it time, or be the change you want to see.
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Bikes
1 year, 2 months ago
That’s because Venice is pretty far north. Come into the deep South Bay and most trail areas are about a 50 min drive in good traffic (we actually have some trails down here just steep so hard when you are 5-6 on a single speed) Look at a map. Look at something like MTB Projects for trails. LA is big and a lot of it is not near most mtb trails.
Anyway, not grumpy, I just think a city the size of LA should have way more bike parks and it’s differential to most cities of this size so numbers seem to back my view. And we have weather to use the year round unlike a lot of other cities.
I think anyone would want more bike parks
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
More bike parks! Less Car parks!
Zero-cool
1 year, 2 months ago
Build it and they will come.
Maybe you need to get a bunch of people together and build your own pumptrack. Or find someone with a big backyard. Or ride skate parks.
Good luck
(Caveat - I have no idea how it works in the US as I grew up on a farm in the UK and we just built stuff on our land) and the UK has loads of pump tracks.
albert03
1 year, 2 months ago
This is why street trials make a lot of sense to me. Anything becomes a session-able obstacle, and you don't have to travel anywhere. You can practice in your driveway/parking lot/basement. And all of those skills transfer to the trails when you get the chance. Also, almost all trials moves are done at low speed or stationary, so high speed accidents aren't an issue.
I built a Giant STP for this purpose, originally a two-speed that used a barrel adjuster to shift, and many permutations later I converted it to a 6-speed so that it was easier to ride to other spots. And bought those Jeff Lenosky and Ryan Leech DVDs, back when DVDs were a thing.
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
Oh the times i wish i had some trials skills!! Imagine having all the terrain in the world to ride. What a privilege. I did spend decades in parking lots riding flatland bikes which translated well to piloting a mountain bike around the north shore..
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dave_f
1 year, 2 months ago
Sounds like the idea here is that when dad is at the specialized concept store scoping out his next s-works turbo levo he picks up a few of these for his kids
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MTB_THETOWN
1 year, 2 months ago
I got a scott voltage DJ two summers ago, and although it felt great on the pump track, it felt too squirrely for me on actual jumps. I find that jumping my Transition Throttle ht, or even my scout, is much more confidence inspiring even if I give up a bit of pop. A slacker head angle like this may help with that issue, although serious dj riders may scoff at it and prefer the faster handling.
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
Having ridden a Scott Voltage DJ , I agree about the twitch factor. 70deg head angles on DJ bikes are not my cup of tea. Steep headangles help with street tricks and jibbing, but Dirt Jumpers usually prefer slacker angles and relaxed steering off of huge lips
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Velocipedestrian
1 year, 2 months ago
I spy a bolt-up 20mm axle on a fork that looks like it would clear a 27.5.
Make axles big again!
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Deniz Merdano
1 year, 2 months ago
As a matter of fact it does clear 27.5 as the P4 comes with one
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Andy Krull
1 year, 1 month ago
I have the previous p3 model and it's great. 6 years of use now. I think a DJ should be a DJ. Seems like this new one is trying to stretch things... 135mm is just fine, and no dropper thanks! Also, I think the previous adjustable drop-out I have, though more complex, is going to be more reliable about avoiding sliding and having your chain flop around.
27.5 could work for a very tall person, but ...Tim Bringer... 26" wheels at 1.94m height.
Kids getting rad on great bikes, I'm all for! So glad to see more competition in the 24/20" wheel space. A few years ago, there was only Spawn... That's what we ended up with. Now there's Specialized, Commencal, Spawn, Norco, Transition, and more.
It's super fun to DJ with yer kid! It's a bit scary/demoralizing when he surpasses you though! Kids can really send it... That's inspiring.
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