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REVIEW

Banshee Titan Review - Part Two

Words Andrew Major
Photos Deniz Merdano (or as noted)
Date Jun 9, 2021
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Moving Forward

This is a frame-only review of Banshee's 6" travel Titan. Being a frame-only review and because the build has been ever-evolving, there is a certain degree to which this is a snapshot. Essentially I'm reviewing my experience as the bike sits - from my own mullet wheelset and coil shock, to the Wolf Tooth -1° angleset - on the day that Deniz shot it. So this is a telling of my experience with the Titan and the evolution of my build. Certainly, this has been the most interesting bike review I have undertaken. A curious consumer of content could follow that process through a number of pieces on NSMB:

As much fun as this process as this has been, I'd call the Titan as shown here 'complete.' That is to say, I'm no longer seeking anything from the bike it doesn't deliver, and other than some fresh brake pads and some routine shock & stem swapping I haven't made a single component change since Deniz took these shots.

Seeking nothing more from the Titan this seems as good a time as ever to put together a review. I have a lot to say about the Titan and the process so I can say in advance that this has all been edited for brevity lest it becomes some sort of Odyssey. If there's some detail or avenue that seems to have been missed please hit me in the comments.

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The Banshee Titan is the strong quiet type and lets its performance do the talking. Predictable and supportive. It encourages me to explore my boundaries but it's there to bail me out when I get over my head.

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If the Titan doesn't have much to say I more than make up for it. I can talk about this bike for hours, as Deniz will attest, so if I missed any details in here please feel encouraged to hit me up in the comments!

Routine Swaps

My two big back and forth component swaps are between two shocks (the SR Suntour TriAir rear shock and my Cane Creek CCDB Coil CS) as well as between 40mm and 50mm stems set at the same height.

No surprise that the TriAir is lighter but that's not a concern for me at all. My shock swapping comes down to the Titan already having a firmly planted feel over all terrain. At my speed and level of pop it takes a lot more muscle to get the bike in the air with the coil than with the less damped feeling SR air shock. I do happen to love the grab-and-go coil setup and just how awesome traction is, up & down, with the Cane Creek setup. Starting from fresh I'd be tempted to try a Cane Creek CCDB Air CS shock to split the difference. In either event, once I removed the stock Fox X2 air shock I never looked back.

On that subject, I don't have anything to add about my experience with the Float X2 beyond my first look. In considering the value of the frame, I would be factoring in the cost difference between selling the stock shock and purchasing one of my choosing. I recognize that some folks are getting along fine with the X2 but I'd be interested in hearing from anyone who tried a different shock - whether it be a DVO, or an SR, or a Cane Creek, or Banshee's recommendation of an EXT - and then didn't find the bike to be significantly better.

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The Titan brings to bear a very planted 155mm of travel in either wheelbase setup. An active air shock is a nice option for more playful trails. Photo: Andrew Major (AM)

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Whether it's the SQLab 30X or Fasst Flexx bar, I'm running a 12° back sweep on the Titan. Generally I'm riding a 50mm stem on the large Banshee. Photo: AM

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For those Titan owners seeking a different experience than the stock Float X2, absolutely go with a coil shock. I've had a great experience with the CCDB off my Marin. Banshee recommends an EXT.

For most situations, I prefer my position on the bike with a 50mm stem. Whether running the Fasst Flexx bar or my SQLab 30X I'm running a bar with 12° of back sweep. Occasionally when I'm riding really steep trails and my fork is sitting deep in the travel, or when I'm being a big chicken and riding too far behind the bike, I find the 50mm stem is just a touch too long, so I'll throw on a 40mm stem for that sort of trail. I don't own a 45mm or I'd try the tweener size but really the 50mm feels great 95% of the time and I should just trust the Titan and get over the front a bit more on the other 5% of rides.

In fact, returning to the paragraph above after another half dozen or so rides I've absolutely concluded that a 50mm stem is where I should be and any time it does feel a touch long it's the Titan telling me to get back in a proper riding position. As soon as I scoot forward all kinds of great things start happening both in terms of suspension feel and absolute traction thanks to a truly balanced feel between the front-center and rear-center.

The Long & Short

It's a misnomer to refer to Titan's two rear-center options as 'long' and 'short.' In fact, even changing 'short' to 'medium' is pushing a false narrative. I like to refer to them as 'long' and 'longer.' With that touch of semantics covered, I swapped back and forth a significant number of times before deciding that I preferred the 452mm setting over the 462mm.

For anyone who wonders if they could tell the difference: yes. Yes, you could. It's like jumping back and forth between a 50mm and 60mm stem, or an 800mm and 790mm handlebar, or raising and lowering your stem 10mm, or even swapping between the common crank lengths. In cycling fit, there are two truths: You can adapt to pretty much anything, and 1cm can make a world of difference. I love that Banshee offers options, and the options are almost idiot-proof to swap between, and I find myself wishing I could have tried a 442mm rear-center option as well just so I could talk about it for the purpose of this review.

After playing around I can say for my size large Titan there is no real performance to be gained anywhere from running the 462mm stay. Even in the straight line janky chunk, the wheelbase is plenty long and the weight balance is perfect in a neutral position. I'd love to hear from someone who has tried both lengths on an XL as I can't help but think that combined with the 495mm Reach, instead of the 470mm Reach, the longer stays may be perfect.

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I started with the long 462mm dropouts in the low position. This meant I needed a new brake line and new chain to move parts over from my Marin. Photo: AM

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With the tight tolerances, it is a five minutes max swap between dropout lengths. I didn't even have to adjust the brake as it's on a PM-to-IS adapter. Photo: AM

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I ended up preferring the short(er), but still long, 452mm dropout options for nearly all my riding with a dual-29'er or mullet setup. (Photo: AM)

Staying with sizing for a moment. I'm about 5'9" tall with T-Rex's ape-index and the size large frame, with its 470mm Reach | 644mm Stack, absolutely felt like the right size throughout the test. At no point was I running a 31mm stem and wishing P-Dent had really become a thing. Even if the medium and large frames added a centimeter to their top tubes I think I'd still be choosing a large and dropping to a 40mm stem.

The long and the short of it is that the largest proportion of riders sit in a pocket between most brands' medium and large sizes and I'd really like to see companies adding a medium-large frame size to reflect that with the added bonus that larges could be true larges and XL bikes could be true XL bikes. Truly tall riders will lament that the "tiny-Titan's" XL Reach is under 500mm and they don't offer an XXL. In an ideal world that XL would be notably longer.

Now, critics will correctly jump on me that the Banshees all have massive headtubes and that increased Stack makes the Reach numbers effectively longer compared to other companies whose short headtubes make for an automatic reduction of effective Reach due to a massive neck of spacers added under their stems. I have two counterpoints. Firstly, it's all about fit before fashion so just pick up a high-rise handlebar for your short-stacked bicycle. Second, I'm happily riding a large.

Two Titanic Misses

In my mind this Banshee has two glaring misses for a premium bicycle. I'm not talking about misses in my opinion, like I'd prefer a truly raw aluminum finish over the satin, or I think the head tubes should be a half centimeter shorter in every size, or I don't like Trunnion mount. These are actually concrete, factual, issues and I'm going to throw them out there right now so that we can move on to the good stuff.

First, the internal cable routing setup is loud. Way too loud. It is the loudest of any bike I've ridden in recent memory. And it doesn't matter how tight you crank down the zip tie in the downtube or how nicely you talk to the exit port hardware, the rattle is real. It's also very easy to resolve the same way most companies do with internal routing on aluminum frames. Just restrict the cables at their exit points.

Knolly uses a rubber grommet, Rocky Mountain uses and zip tie, and with the Titan, I used a few wraps of electrical tape. Just build up a few wraps of tape on the cable where it will sit inside the frame next to the cable ports, install the aluminum ports, and give the cables a tug. It's easy, it works like a dream, and it's more than a bit hokey on a 2500 USD | 3300 CAD aluminum frameset.

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One of the details on the Titan that feels like an afterthought is the cable routing. It's loud and the exit port widgets are finicky. Photo: AM

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The noise was easily resolved with some electrical tape. A few wraps on the cables right behind the port widget, install widget, and pull. Photo: AM

The second major miss is that Banshee has done nothing to protect the lower linkage bearings from being bathed in dirt and grime. This is an even bigger issue than I first thought, as I've also learned that going forward Banshee is using full complement Enduro Max bearings in their bikes rather than INA bearings. Switching to a full complement bearing makes perfect sense for suspension pivot applications thanks to a much higher load capacity, but in my experience, Enduro bearings need to be shielded to a much greater extent than Banshee's suspension design accomplishes on its own.

The solution is simple: spec a fender. Banshee even has a nifty template so we can cut one out of a milk jug. Given the template has been around for at least a year, I think at this point it's safe to say that it's not a temporary measure while Banshee works on a production option. I ended up just using a zip tie fork arch fender and a cutting utensil to fashion my own fender by chopping the wings off. It works just fine, but it does look like I downcycled something usable.

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No fender! That rotating loam shelf gets swamped which just screams bearing murder. Photo: AM

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Fender! The difference in the amount of junk trying to corrupt my bearings is exceptional. Photo: AM

Hot For Mullet

If you tell me that the crew at Banshee designed the Titan to be a Mullet, I'll believe you. Heck, I'll believe you even if Keith@Banshee calls me up and swears to the contrary. This is the bike that made me do a 180° on mullets. I'd tried other bike conversions with up-wheeling 27" platforms and I even rode my hardtail for quite a while with mixed wheels and it was all comme-ci comme-ca before now. Something I'd tease my early adopter bike industry friends about with enough personal experience to also see there was some potential behind their hyper-excited ravings.

I have to say, I really enjoyed the Titan with dual 29" wheels. Particularly once I sorted out my pedaling position using the SQLab 60X. I had grand plans to go back and forth between the two hoops and write something interesting but my first ride with the smaller wheel out back and I was totally sold for this platform.

Thanks to the Banshee's excellent rear suspension and long stays I didn't perceive any loss of climbing traction and I had no issues with the smaller rear wheel getting hung up on janky descents. I did drop a rotor size to balance the braking, but otherwise it was a case of there not being any situation where I was missing the bigger hoop in the back. Maybe rollover would have been more of an issue with a lower travel bike or if I was a faster rider, but for me on this bike, there is no redeeming factor for the larger rear hoop.

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Even with the smaller rear wheel I preferred the 'low' setting on the dropouts. My tall fork and small chainring certainly help with clearance but even pedaling my 175mm cranks that Titan delivers awesome support and I rarely bashed a pedal.

So, no notable negative differences between the two rear wheel sizes, but what's to be gained? I haven't been riding with many different people lately and I've had multiple friends, including friends who rode with me with both setups, tell me that they've never seen me riding more playfully than on the mulleted Titan. As long as the bike's wheelbase is, it corners like I actually know what I'm doing!

I've never ridden a setup that goes around flat corners as well as this beauty, and I've taken my mediocre cornering skills to plenty of different suspension platforms. I'm not attributing this all to general mullet magic. I'm not in the all-the-mullets-all-the-time camp. But if you own a Titan and you're a serial tinkerer who's thinking of different setups to try, the smaller rear wheel is absolutely something to jump on.

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27" agility in the corners and long wheelbase stability on the descents. I'd be a raving mullet evangelist if the Banshee was the only one I'd ever ridden. (Photo: Mr. Lungtastic)

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The 29er confidence that I love with no notable loss of performance due to the smaller rear wheel, thanks to the Titan's rear suspension and balanced ride. (Photo: Mr. Lungtastic)

Some setup housekeeping before I go forward. Even with the mullet arrangement, I still stuck with the 'low' geometry position. Throwing it into the higher option would have returned the bottom bracket height, STA, and HTA to approximately the same position they were in with dual 29" hoops but I gave that how-low-can-you-go package a try and I was hooked. It does help that my fork is a bit taller than spec. Even in the low setting, running 175mm arms, crank clearance was rarely an issue thanks to how supportive the suspension design is on climbs. Also, thanks to my smaller-than-normal front chainring with the mixed-wheels (28t), I didn't smack it any more regularly when descending slow janky trails than I do running a 32t on most modern full suspension bikes.

Final Build

Over the course of this review, the Titan has transitioned from a rather mundane but very good Shimano Deore M6100 drivetrain and carbon 29er wheels, to a 2x7 manual front-shifting setup, to the current 1x8 Perry-style setup I'm running (28 x 13-36t). I've installed my mullet wheelset - built off of some P321 hubs that are still going strong - and the OneUp 180mm dropper, which added just the right amount of confidence over the 160mm models I could fit in before.

I rode two different 12° backswept bars in the form of the Fasst Flexx shown in the first look and the SQLab 30X in these photos. I swapped to the 30X playing with Rev Grips as part of an ongoing experiment with different micro-suspension, or noise-canceling, products. I love writing about this stuff and I fully appreciate how much comfort some folks gain from. But, with my Durolux properly serviced and my rear shock setup well I'd be just as happy running my usual push-on Swayze grips on the 12° SQLab.

For folks that follow my ongoing bar-sweep musings (somehow this article keeps attracting fresh comments), I did also try a 16° bar - which is my preferred sweep normally. Fit-wise, it had me going to a 60mm stem. It was fine for climbing but I felt less aggressive while descending compared to my 12° bar with a 50mm setup.

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Take the HTA and subtract about 1/2° for the smaller rear wheel, then another -1° for my Wolf Tooth Geoshift angleset. Note that my fork is 13mm taller than the chart, and the static angle is on the who-gives-a-hoot-exactly side of 63°.

One hidden upgrade that I really appreciate is the angleset I've been running for a good chunk of this review - even before switching to the mullet setup. Between the Banshee's 130mm ZS44/ZS56 headtube and the fact that the Wolf Tooth Geoshift angleset is a -1° version, it's a very subtle addition to the bike. That's subtle both in terms of the appearance, with no obvious headset cup extensions, and also from a performance perspective.

Going from 64.5° in the low setting with my 170mm SR Suntour Durolux and then slacking the system out a degree isn't nearly as profound a change as ditching a degree from a much steeper bike, but it's a difference in handling and stability nonetheless and takes the Banshee closer to the territory that a bike with its travel endowment lives in 2021.

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The -1° Wolf Tooth Geoshift angletset goes totally unnoticed to the eye but I think it's a nice improvement that drags the Titan's geometry in line with its peers.

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The fully stashed -1° headset is a typically high quality Wolf Tooth product available with a ZS44 upper cup and either an EC49 or ZS56 lower cup. It uses their black oxide Performance bearings. Photo: AM

As compared to running the same fork with the stock Banshee headset, the -1° also increases the reach, steepens the STA slightly, and lowers the BB height a touch. The steeper STA wouldn't be desirable personally, but my mullet setup easily compensates for it.

It's true that the Titan frame includes a headset, with the cups preinstalled, right out of the box. For folks who aren't seeking any change in geo, this is a nice little value add compared to buying a frame only. I could certainly see plenty of folks adding a zero-stack angleset to their build though. The Banshee already has a nice and tall head tube for a given size, so the fact the Wolf Tooth angleset doesn't add to that is a bonus in my book.

Putting aside the Titan for the moment, I think an angleset can be an excellent way to refresh any bike , whether it's moving slacker or steeper than the stock geometry. I'm a big fan of the plan to Buy The Bike You Already Own and I also think that anglesets create potential value when looking at used bikes - something I'll be looking into further in a future article.

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Plenty of staples from past reviews like this now mulleted Project 321 wheelset...

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... and this Wolf Tooth Light Action Remote. Now back on its own hinged clamp...

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...and the 170mm SR Suntour Durolux EQ RC2 suspension fork.

For a drivetrain, the Banshee is sporting my compelling crankset from Race Face, a 28-tooth North Shore Billet narrow-wide granny ring that's offset inboard, and an 8-speed 13-36t cassette. Shifting is handled by a Shimano Zee short cage rear derailleur and a 9-speed XTR shifter mated to a Wolf Tooth Tanpan. Riding on the North Shore I've been fine with the range this delivers and I like the beautiful chainline. Can't argue with the significant reduction in unsprung mass either - although I chew up the savings running a CushCore Pro insert in the rear wheel.

On that subject, I'm running CushCore Pro inserts front and rear with a Specialized Butcher Grid 27 x 2.6" out back and a 29 x 2.6" Vigilante High Grip/Light Casing tire on the front. The Vigilante 29 x 2.8" is the best 29+ front tire I've ridden, and I've been generally very happy with the 2.6" as a trail tire on a variety of bikes; however, with the Titan I could easily be talked into a slower, more aggressive, option like WTB's Verdict or a Magic Mary. It's particularly the case when I'm on unfamiliar trails and find myself needing to bring the bike down from higher speeds with very limited notice.

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Going back to the first (used) set of Magura MT-7 brakes I bought in 2015, the four-piston brakes have been an easy favourite for their combination of feel and power.

'Onion Mount' Tears

As I mentioned above, after I received a number of messages from readers regarding their Banshee frame bearings, I confirmed that folks buying a Titan going forward will find that it comes spec'd with Enduro Max bearings. Full complement Max bearings make a lot of sense for suspension pivots and combined with the judicious use of a fender for that lower link, should have a comparable life span to higher quality, standard INA bearings.

One place I hope the Max bearings will make a difference, and I recognize this is going back on my INA-hopes in my first look, is in the Trunnion shock-mount bearing life. I'll note that the Banshee's Trunnion bearings outlasted any other Trunnion bike I've ridden to date; however, they've been fairly indexed for a few rides now and if this was my bike I would have replaced them a month ago. The rest of the bearings are still rotating just-fine.

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Big, stiff, precise linkage with big, stiff, precise bearings...

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...actually, my Trunnion bearings are fully cooked. If it doesn't work great on this platform, I doubt the bike will be properly sellable. Photo: AM

It's probably fair to say that the newer Banshee frame layout couldn't exist without Trunnion and that ability to pack a longer stroke into a shorter eye-to-eye length. The shock-basket layout does lower the centre of gravity, look sweet, and contribute to the excellent frame geometry so it's hard to be a giant prick about the use of 'Onion Mount' here. Banshee also did things right with this Titan and the alignment is wonderful.

There's no binding of my shock through the stroke the way the frame is assembled around the two machined sections - front & back - tied together by machined linkages there shouldn't be any of the crazy shock-eating loads that a fair few Trunnion-bikes are starting to see flagged on their resumes. Certainly, at this moment in time, the Banshee is the only Trunnion platform that I'd consider putting my own money down to purchase.

Climbing Up


“This aggression will not stand, man.” - The Dude (Big Lebowski)

I'm still fairly shocked at how well the Titan gets up the hill. It doesn't matter what damper I'm using, air or coil spring, and I never hit the climb switch - no extra support needed. Just find the right gear and turn those cranks in circles. The extended rear-centre forces the tire into the ground. The wheelbase is long but it's so well balanced that it's very stable leaning the Banshee around tight switchback corners. The 27" rear wheel of my mullet setup is much easier to accelerate when needed but thanks to the quality of the suspension there's no issue maintaining moment or traction v. the stock 29" fitment.

Of course it's not surprising that the climbing traction is excellent. Companies really have to try to f*** up their 6" travel bikes to have them skittering about on the trails. Don't get me wrong, some do. There's a reason that 6" travel bikes that 'pedal like [heavy] XC bikes' up the hill usually aren't all that fun on the way back down. In the case of this Banshee, I would absolutely put the bike up against any comparable machine in terms of the magical balance of traction and climbing support without sacrificing descending capabilities. I could almost, almost, call it pleasant.


If the latter options have Motörhead playing in my head on the climbs, the Titan is definitely bringing on the Bob Marley.
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It's long. Even with the shorter dropout option installed and a 27" rear wheel, it's the longest bike I've ridden up technical trails, and it's surprisingly capable of mowing up those trails.

Pleasant. Like having tea with a polite stranger. It reminds me of other long(er) travel bikes that have a solid reputation for uphill capabilities like the Specialized Enduro or Santa Cruz Nomad. Chill out, maintain a steady pace, be friendly, and I'm at the top of the climb - technical or tame - much faster than I would have guessed. I was happy to be surprised more than once as I spun onto friends' wheels uphill when they were sporting significantly lighter weight bikes.

There's certainly no point in trying to push the pace. The Titan doesn't reward hard efforts efficiently, especially for someone like this fella who likes to climb out of the saddle sometimes regardless of the bike he's on. Nope, on the Banshee sit-and-spin is the name of the game and this platform absolutely rewards the most patient of manners in determining the order of arrival at the top on group rides.

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11-speed short-cage derailleur meets 8-speed cassette with 10-speed spacing.

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9-speed Shimano XTR shifter modified with a Wolf Tooth Tanpan for 10-speed road brifters.

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My compelling Turbines, Cinch Spider, and a 28t North Shore Billet ring & Blackspire Grannie bash ring.

So, a synonym for pleasant, at least in this case, is boring. As in not fun, but not offensive at the same time. For folks who are just winching up to come back down, the Banshee fits the bill perfectly. Perfectly. That's the ideal Titan customer. Even if that winch-up ride is hours long. I've done some very long rides on the Titan and never once complained about how much it weighs or about it being slow.

The flip side is that I really do enjoy attacking technical climbs and, whether I'm sporting a 27" or 29" wheel in the rear, this is not the bike for me in that regard. It actually improved with the addition of the angleset as the bike is just that bit much more composed when I'm up out of the saddle but even with the mullet rear wheel the bike just isn't jumping to it.

I've actually had a pretty good debate with a Banshee Titan owner in this regard and I really feel like we are saying the same thing - it's just that our metrics are skewed. He says it's the best climbing 6" bike on the market and I'm certainly not going to argue on the contrary. I say it's very capable of getting me up the hill but if I was to call it a great climbing bike I'd add the caveat that it lacks severely in the 'fun factor' relative to shorter travel machines I've ridden.

That is to say that the best climbing long-travel bikes on the market are still just getting me somewhere where I find climbing a hardtail or a short travel FS bike is actually a truly enjoyable part of the ride. If the latter options have Motörhead playing in my head on the climbs, the Titan is definitely bringing on the Bob Marley.

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It's totally normal to weep a few tears of joy when you see that beautiful chainline in the grinding gears. Photo: AM

The Downs

It's slack. It's long. Stability is excellent in all situations and I appreciate how well it climbs, but let's face it, if you're in the market for a Titan it's the fast and/or janky descents that have you choosing it over the shorter travel bikes in Banshee's line up. Again, the Banshee is a very stable, predictable, bike.

It wants to have fun, really it does, it's just that it wants to do that down very aggressive steeps and at higher speeds than I'm typically going. This is fully a compliment to the bike as I routinely had to push through a minor case of imposter syndrome and ride the bike outside of my typical comfort zone. I hit quite a few lines on the Banshee Titan that I had never hit before, or with newfound confidence, and frankly, it was exhilarating.

Sometimes a bit too exhilarating maybe. I also had some of my larger off-the-bike moments in years. On stuff that I ride my rigid singlespeed down. It's that old factor that speed is indeed itself a technical feature and even great suspension and some of the best brakes money can buy can only help so much to get a bike under control when it's cooking.

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Maximum descending confidence brought to you by this 180mm travel OneUp Dropper. This was the only 180mm option for me with the short-on-insertion Banshee frame design. Photo: AM

The Titan has a relatively tall front end courtesy of its 130mm headtube (size large) and long travel fork. Some folks won't love this - it's 20mm taller than the headtube on an XL Knolly Chilcotin for example - but for me it's ideal. With my 170mm Durolux EQ, 5mm spacer under the stem, and mid-rise SQLab bar I was in my high-bar happy place minus all the judgmental looks.

Thanks to the long and balanced setup getting my weight into the front wheel on descents or in corners was never an issue. Neither was creating power on climbs. Running the dual 29er setup I did occasionally find it hard to muscle the bike through tight, flat, corners. I'm certain that largely comes down to my much-more-progress-needed cornering techniques but with the smaller hoop in the back, the Titan simply railed.

Whether the climbs are all about taking a deep breath and spinning to the top, the Titan rewards more aggressive behaviour on the way back down. My awesome experience running the bottom bracket low with the mullet in tow has me regularly asking the question 'how low is too low?' when it comes to bottom brackets. It certainly helps that I recovered a lot of ground clearance, when my pedals are level, by running a 28-tooth ring; however, I am still running my preferred 175mm cranks and with some judicious technique, I rarely clip a pedal.

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I find the relatively tall front end to be confidence-inspiring while at the same time I experienced zero issues loading up the front wheel for traction.

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Even with the BB in the low setting and a 27" rear wheel I find the bike stands up in its travel enough to keep pumping through roots.

I do think that Banshee would do well to spec their bikes with a OneUp dropper post so that folks can be assured they're getting the longest possible drop for their leg length. It's a bike that benefits from increased bike-body separation. Then again, what bike isn't?

I did have a few awkward moments coming off of log rides. Always with turns, and always losing the back or front wheel first as I attempted to drive the Banshee around them. What's bizarre is I'd then go back and hit the same corner with absolutely zero stress. This comes down to the long front & rear centre and I've become ever-so-much better at not losing the rear tire off of stuff with the abundance of practice I've been getting. It's long, especially for having a relatively short reach number, and I generally like that. No, love that. The balance between the wheels on this bike is the best I've ridden in a trail/enduro bike. It reminds me of rolling around on a DH rig except this one can be easily pedaled to the top.

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I struggle sometimes to let the Titan out of the cage I assembled for it. It's much more confident than I am and I really just need to let it lead.

If I had to choose one, I'd ride the Titan with a coil shock for certain. It has plenty of progression built into the suspension design and frankly once you've committed to the aluminum Banshee, gram counting obviously isn't a regular pastime. A good coil shock will cut down on maintenance costs & frequency, and also boost the bike's tendency to hug the terrain and deliver solid traction whether it's cornering, trying to ditch speed on steep terrain, or looking to eke out that last bit of brake control on a grungy sport surface.

The coil shock also accentuates the Titan's best features. Whether it's soaking up repeated braking bumps, or easing away the energy from a big & fast hit, I'm regularly amazed at how good the KS-2 suspension design is turning out to be.

Phantan? Titom?

I love this frame-only review format for a few reasons, not the least of which is I feel encouraged to get my geek on. It also really lets me see deep into a bicycle in a way that's proven very helpful for challenging some of my theories on bike fit and bike maintenance. It's also helped me determine that I really love the Titan but I've decided that it is too much bike for me on a day-to-day basis.

I want the geometry. I want all the geometry - Wolf Tooth angleset, and mullet, and lightly over-forked front end - but I want it dropped directly into a much shorter travel rig. It's more involved than just pressing an angleset into a company's existing 100-120mm 29er travel full suspension platform and then slapping a 27" wheel on the back. I mean, the Banshee Phantom actually starts to get close with the mods installed but it's still not bleeding edge progressive for a short travel bike. I think I'm looking for long, low, slack DH bike geometry in a 4" travel platform?

The Phantan or Titom is going to absolutely fly down trails, while at the same time being very comfortable with the prospect of all day or multi-day periods in the saddle. Enough geometry to get me into all kinds of trouble on the trail and certainly not enough travel to get me out, and isn't that half the fun? Then I'd rather dwell on the potential than the pitfalls.

I feel like a bunch of companies are on the cusp of producing just such a mountain bicycle and don't see any reason a next-generation phantom couldn't be a contender. Certainly, I know folks who are over-biked so they can get certain geometry and folks buying shorter travel options because they want to go out and pedal all day. Sign me up.

Banshee Titan Andrew NSMB Dentizt (2).jpg

There she sits, the Banshee Titan frame. Plus, a collection of NSMB test parts, CushCore inserts front & rear, and any other number of other products from brakes to the drivetrain that came out off my other bikes.

In the meantime, cheers to the Titan. Fantastic suspension performance, handled in a mature way, with lots of great details in the bike. I think you get a lot of really nicely made frame for 2500 USD | 3250 CAD in this instance. I've enjoyed progressing on this frame to no end. The adjustable wheelbase and quality of manufacturing just add to the value as does the ease of installing the different length dropouts.

There's plenty more information on Banshee's website, and I'm happy to answer any questions, any concerns, and for anything I've missed in the comments below.

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Comments

YDiv
+2 Andrew Major Pete Roggeman
YDiv  - June 8, 2021, 11:03 p.m.

Sigh. That chainline.

I think I'm in love.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 8, 2021, 11:19 p.m.

Cheers, it's a beautiful thing. The difference in terms of wear-and-tear grinding up North Shore climbs is glorious!

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schmung
+1 Andrew Major
schmung  - June 9, 2021, 2:57 a.m.

I think the biggest thing I noticed on mine and the thing I'm still adjusting to is the balance - coming from a bike with longer reach and shorter chainstays the titan really does need to be ridden differently. I find that with more open or loose corners it's a lot safer feeling and I can carry speed more easily and that I don't need to be quite so aggressive in loading the front. Conversely the tight corners need a bit more heft to get round. I think for me and how I ride this actually works out really well, although it's taken some getting used to.

I'm 5"7 on a medium and mulleted it straight away - I buzzed myself on a chute riding a 29" hardtail and that was enough to put me off even trying the big wheels on the back. Ditto the air shock, I've never really gotten on with them so I went straight to a kitsuma. The X2 is in a box in the garage waiting for me to put more effort into selling it.

I'm intrigued by bars with more backsweep, but I don't want to give up my vibrocore bars, because they've been so helpful in reducing wrist/hand pain for me but I'm curious as to how much of that is due to the position that 'regular' bars put my wrists in, so may have to give that a go.

I did also look at the possibility of the Prime, but my main concern with being over biked was weight rather than geo, climbing ability or anything else and if I'm sticking coil on both ends and proper tyres and wheels then the penalty for the titan is minimal so why not.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 6:18 a.m.

I think coming off my Walt V2 is why it was so easy to adapt to the longer/balanced wheelbase. 

I’ve had quite the opposite experience where riding less balanced bikes, or more out-of-balance bikes, or whatever the best way to say that is proving difficult to adapt to.

.

No clearance issues with the Kitsuma? I was wondering if the dimensions were close enough to my CCDB to work.

Now is the time to see that X2! Demand way higher than supply for shocks.

-

Having ridden Vibrocore, I think you’d be really impressed with OneUp’s bar (just align it properly) if you go carbon. 

SQLab makes great bars (their alloy bars are perfect) but to get into backsweep and noise cancelling Fasst Flexx is the way to go. The FF bar though is going way beyond the more subtle affects of the Vibrocore or OneUp.

Cheers!

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MuscogeeMasher
+1 Andrew Major
MuscogeeMasher  - June 10, 2021, 3:35 a.m.

On the OneUp, with a non OneUp stem would you still align based on the markings on the bar or ignore those and focus on the orientation of the ovality relative to the ground (vertical axis) or your arms in an attack position?

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AndrewMajor
+1 MuscogeeMasher
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 7:23 a.m.

The stem markings only really matter with their stem. Any other stem it’s oval shape aligned to ground/HTA.

I’m not a fan of their stem as a stem, but it was good to set a couple combos up in terms of seeing how the bars intended to roll.

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MuscogeeMasher
+1 Andrew Major
MuscogeeMasher  - June 10, 2021, 9:52 a.m.

Got advice on what that orientation should be that you could express in a few sentences?  Is oval perpendicular to head tube?

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AndrewMajor
+1 MuscogeeMasher
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 2:34 p.m.

Honestly no, I just adjust it until it looks right to me and then suggest the rider bracket their experience from there.

Next time I install one I’ll snap you a picture (will try to remember at least).

AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 6:24 a.m.

“I did also look at the possibility of the Prime, but my main concern with being over biked was weight rather than geo, climbing ability or anything else and if I'm sticking coil on both ends and proper tyres and wheels then the penalty for the titan is minimal so why not.”

I’m back and forth on this all the time. My hardtail has CushCore, but rubber, etc and it’s still much more ‘fun’ on the climbs than the Titan. You’re right, capability/gram the Titan costs nothing over a shorter travel rig with the same build. I just don’t think I care... maybe?

I’m working on figuring it out. I  dropped the Durolux EQ to 120mm and moved everything but the shock as is over to a used Yeti frame to play around with just this concept. 

On that note, anyone reading with an integrated IS41/IS52 headset on an older bike - the 9Point8 Slack’r isn’t just a great product, it’s a community service!!! (Review coming soon).

Reply

schmung
+1 Andrew Major
schmung  - June 9, 2021, 7:16 a.m.

I looked at fast flexxx, but it's a bit cost prohibitive just to try something. I might try the SQLab bars to see how the increase is backsweep feels before going the whole hog. It might be that changing wrist position is more helpful than the vibration damping. 

I think the other factor with climbing is what sort of climbing you do - for me everything local is a fireroad slog or up a lane, so as long as bike has some sort of lockout and doesn't bob around too much it all comes down to weight.

Kitsuma sits on the bike very nicely with no issues, there's an owners thread over at mtbr and some guys there running it, so I knew it would be ok before purchasing. My old CCDB is normal eyelet mount, so it's hard to do a direct comparison, but they seem to be very similar in terms of reservoir size etc

oh and really enjoyed the two part in-depth review.  It's much more useful to a potential buyer than the format you tend to see elsewhere and especially valuable for a bike that's sold as frame only.

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craw
+2 Andrew Major AndrewR
Cr4w  - June 9, 2021, 11:23 a.m.

I just grabbed some SQ Lab stuff and it's been great. I got a 30x carbon 12' bar and 711 grips. Not sure if it's that the bar is 31.8 but it's very comfortable for my 230 lbs. I got on with the 12' sweep immediately. The grips are really good too, a weird gummy vibe, like old Ritchey True Grips. I'm still experimenting with how the bars and grips are rolled but so far it all feels really good.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 12:32 p.m.

Wow, best explanation of the grip rubber/feel I’ve heard!!!

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 12:34 p.m.

Cheers! Great to know Kitsuma fits as I’ve been asked a couple times.

I’m definitely very keen to do more frame-only reviews.

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DanLees1978
+3 Andrew Major Pete Roggeman Paul Stuart
Dan Lees  - June 9, 2021, 2:59 a.m.

Nice review!

As someone who has been happily riding the oft overlooked middle sibling in Banshee's range, the Prime for a couple of months this is interesting and to be honest I broadly agree based on my experience. I ummed and ahhed between all three bikes (along with a fair few other bikes from other brands) and came to the conclusion that the Prime was the right one for me and the mix of riding I do/plan to do. Based on the info I could glean from the internet the Prime is a shorter travel Titan rather then a longer travel Phantom.

My local riding (after work) is flatter, twistier but still quite rough. The riding I do quite regularly at weekends i.e. normal "UK" riding which can mean flow trails, tight steep techy singletrack, all the way to open wider but much rougher tracks, sometimes all in the same ride. I also have plans to get back to the Bike Park (Wales) and over the channel for some big alpine descents. So the Phantom was likely not enough bike and the Titan maybe a bit much?

- Noise...I found the cable rattle a bit annoying but 2 things that have helped for me are retrofitting tiny pipe lagging stuff (cut lengthways and slide onto already fitted cables/hoses and secure with a wrap of elec tape) and adding cable ties double wrapped around the cable/hose and pulled tight so you can tension the cable in the frame much like Andrews elec tape method.

-Shock, the Prime comes with a DPX2 rather than the X2, I'm pretty happy with the DPX2 but i did need to swap the middling volume reducer for a smaller one, so I got a bit more air volume. The back end felt a bit constipated wouldn't give up it's last 3rd of travel with the pressure needed to get the prescribed shock sag. The fact that both bikes ride nicely with coil shocks shows that a bigger air volume is nice match to the suspension kinematics. There will definitely be a coil shock in the future, likely Marzocchi Bomber CR to match the fork.

-Bearings, no issues after a couple of months that have gone from dry and dusty to very wet and muddy and then back to dry and dusty. I'm not a jet washer of bikes and I have fashioned a rear fender using the open source template and an old "buttfender" which was just the right size and material.

- Drop out position, I have tried both, the lower and slacker is my favourite, probably not surprising. I haven't tried the longer drop outs, don't really feel the need to.

- Mullet - Might try it, I have a wheel I can steal for a ride or 2.

- Climbing - climbing is drama free. Though I admit to reaching for the 3 position lockout lever (I flip it to Medium) for smooth gravel or tarmac climbs.

- Descending - Great fun, very playful, confidence inspiring whilst not a plow bike.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 6:31 a.m.

Thanks!

Re. Mullet, if you put it in the ‘high(er)’ setting then your BB height, STA, HTA will all stay ~ the same as dual 29”. So it’s possible to test how you like the smaller hoop without disrupting anything else.

The Titan was the obvious bike to review for NSMB. It climbs anything and has the edge most folks I talk to locally are looking for descending the local trails.

I’ll always be intrigued by the idea of a Phantom or Prime with a 2* Angleset and a Mullet wheel in the low setting. I’m more of a cloud-drawer than a numbers guy and those bikes both look beautiful and crazy fun in the sky.

Do you have the INA bearings or Enduros? The fender is absolutely a saving grace for the lower link. If you pop your shock out at the top your Onion bearings still spin nicely (v. indexing)?

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ShawMac
+1 Andrew Major
ShawMac  - June 9, 2021, 11:50 a.m.

Awesome Dan. This almost my exact experience with the Prime as well for riding in Squamish. Phantom wouldn't feel like enough, and the Titan was just too much bike for my level of confidence.

I have not had any bearing issues yet... I don't know if they are INA or Enduro, but when it comes time to replace I will look for the highest quality I can. I think I am going to check those trunnion bearings though... I did not notice any catches when I re-greased recently, but didn't really focus on it either.

I did not know that there was the template for the inner fender! The first thing I did for winter riding was cut out a clear cranberry juice container and sip tie it in there. The amount of mud that builds in the lower linkage is unacceptable without.

I do use the "climb switch" on the DPX2 for road climbs and use the middle setting for rougher trail climbs. It is tuned to be a really minimal compression change vs older true lock out modes so it isn't necessary. I have been a "sit and spin" climber for a long time; however contrary to Andrew, in the last few weeks I have seen a lot of success in getting up out of the saddle with a slower grind cadence for technical parts... maybe the Prime is a little more suited for it. 

I too have debated trying a mullet, and if I can find a reasonably priced rear wheel with an old HG driver I may just plunge in. Have also considered trying a coil but the 185x55 coilers are harder to come by (and I really don't know how much money I am willing to throw at a bike trying things lol).

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DanLees1978
+2 Andrew Major MuscogeeMasher
Dan Lees  - June 9, 2021, 1:49 p.m.

Just checked the Trunnion bearings. The seem to be plain black with no markings which suggests they might be ABEC3 Enduro. Hard to tell though.

However they are still as smooth as silk. 

One thing I have noted is that the trunnion bearings needed (F6900?) seem to be pretty rare (at least online) on this side of the pond so I have set of those on their way after managing to find some. I couldn’t locate F6900 LLU bearings but I could get 2RS, which should be well sealed enough according my mech eng training from the distant past. The other bearing have the tell tale red seals of enduro llu bearings.

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ShawMac
0
ShawMac  - June 11, 2021, 3:14 p.m.

I was just looking and they aren't easy to find in North American either. It was a bit more common to find the F6900ZZ online (metal sealed)

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Znarf
+7 Andrew Major Pete Roggeman Paul Stuart Velocipedestrian MuscogeeMasher Todd Hellinga Tremeer023
Znarf  - June 9, 2021, 5:27 a.m.

Very cool review - I really love that on nsmb.com there seems to be a place, appreciation and editorial willingness to allow in-depth, nerdy (good), content with context and depth! Many other websites or magazines (which I also enjoy somewhat) only seem to concentrate on brief content which reduces products to disposable items only current for a blink. 

I enjoy that there are articles which are long enough, that I have to file them away in my reading list and then find an occasion a bit later where I find the time to actually read through it. Also the needed tinkering and "ripening" of a bike (and actually sinking hours in wrenching, RIDING, WRITING and photography) show in a lot of posts. 

REALLY COOL!

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AndrewMajor
+2 Pete Roggeman Sun Hester
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 6:44 a.m.

Thanks! I think the format of a rolling frame-only nerd-out, while being a lot of work, proves to be a great driver of content. Definitely eager to do it again. 

The Dentizt did a killer job with the photos for this piece too, which always makes my job easier. 

-

Credit to Cam & Pete for creating and maintaining an interesting mountain bike space that has an obvious mission - the ‘North Shore’ in NSMB - and a lot of room for imagination. I always go back to Best Bike In The World, or my various experiences with alt-bars, or rigid forks, or my somewhat infamous attempt at satire, when I account for my own experiences over 350+ articles published.

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skooks
+1 Andrew Major
Skooks  - June 9, 2021, 1:10 p.m.

Absolutely agree Andrew. Love the photos too. Where is that rock-roll to wood ramp feature (if you are allowed to say)?

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 5:03 p.m.

It’s definitely not a secret trail or in a forbidden zone or anything but I religiously don’t post trail directions publicly - it’s all exjohnbobdeersledpresso when I’m asked.

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mammal
+1 Andrew Major
Mammal  - June 10, 2021, 12:04 p.m.

Or as Mr. Lau would say, "Upper upper upper Bobsled".

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 2:34 p.m.

Heh. Never heard that one! It’s good.

velocipedestrian
+1 Andrew Major
Velocipedestrian  - June 9, 2021, 4:56 p.m.

"Ripening". Perfect.

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AverageAdventurer
+1 Andrew Major
AverageAdventurer  - June 9, 2021, 6:32 a.m.

So I haven't really been in love with trunnion mount shock bearings either. Seeing enduro release those XD-15 bearings with a lifetime warranty maybe those are worth the cost in that spot if they hold up.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 6:49 a.m.

It would be interesting to see if the super-hard bearing races mean that they hold up better for the application.

I’ve wrenched on enough different Trunnion bikes now I’m fairly convinced nothing short of routine, regular, replacement is the answer to preserving performance and shock life.

I get why the system exists (space on bikes with vertical shock orientation) but I wish it didn’t.

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babyzhendo
+1 Andrew Major
babyzhendo  - June 9, 2021, 9:31 a.m.

My trunnion mount bearings got crunchy on my Titan WAY before other bearings did. I had a warranty issue on the bike and ended up with an extra upper rocker link from Banshee, so I was lazy and just threw the new rocker on rather than replacing the original rocker's bearings. I'll have to do it at some point though, and I wish there was a more durable option than the stock bearings. The bearings are a bit oddly sized and internet searching doesn't yield many replacement options.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 2:35 p.m.

Any shop should be able to order the Enduro ones for you.

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BillT
+1 Andrew Major
Bill T  - June 9, 2021, 7:34 a.m.

Glad to know I'm not the only Titan rider that has had an incident or two with wheels sliding off on log rides with turns on them.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 7:45 a.m.

Hahaha, no certainly not. I did a very impressive rear wheel slip to accidental backflip off the first log ride on Team Pangor - running dual 29” and the longest dropout setting - early in my test experience and I knew right away it wasn’t going to be the last time!

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BillT
+1 Andrew Major
Bill T  - June 9, 2021, 9:59 a.m.

I'm going to switch back to the less long dropouts and see if that helps.  After initial cable rattling, i managed to cure it with the provided ziptie locations and perhaps and generous portion of luck but I do have an annoying creak that I believe is saddle/seatpost related that I need to fix.

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Stoke
+1 Andrew Major
Rob Stokes  - June 9, 2021, 7:45 a.m.

I've been waiting for this review, in the hope you'd go into more detail as to why you don't like the stock shock. I have a Titan and X2 and I'm also not a huge fan of the shock and wanted to see if our reasons aligned. I find it hard to pinpoint small intricacies in bike/suspension setup sometimes, so having my thoughts validated (or not!) helps me out!

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 8:32 a.m.

The SR Suntour Tri-Air and my CCDB were such improvements I never looked back (or reinstalled the shock) so my experiences didn’t differ from the first piece & Tri-Air review.

The X2 felt very restricted no matter how I set it up - almost like the ProPedal was always engaged. I’d get full travel but it always felt like significantly less travel than with the other shocks I tried. Generally, it was poor and it would have been a very different review experience had I not swapped it. There are quite a few Titan owners who’ve reflected on a similar experience.

Cheers!

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MuscogeeMasher
0
MuscogeeMasher  - June 9, 2021, 9:11 a.m.

Are the other Titan owners you mention also on 2021/updated X2’s?  Thx!

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AndrewMajor
+1 MuscogeeMasher
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:20 a.m.

Yes. Apparently the 2020 Performance shock works better in the Titan. I haven’t ridden the combination. Banshee may be able to address some of the issue with their tune spec too but I’ve heard mixed opinions on that from people who know a lot more about shocks than me.

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babyzhendo
+2 MuscogeeMasher Andrew Major
babyzhendo  - June 9, 2021, 9:29 a.m.

I had the 2020 X2 Performance shock in mine, and I suffered a lot of the same vagueness and general lack of support. That's 2/2 on hating the X2 on bikes I've had (Commencal Furious was the first, this Titan was the second).

I can vouch for the EXT Storia being incredibly sweet on this bike. Apparently Keith over at Banshee is recommending that to folks these days, obviously only if you have the $$$ to splurge on one. I do recommend smashing your piggy bank to buy one though.

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MuscogeeMasher
+1 Andrew Major
MuscogeeMasher  - June 9, 2021, 11 a.m.

Thx for confirmation.  Been happy with the 2020.

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rwalters
+1 Andrew Major
Ryan Walters  - June 9, 2021, 8:19 a.m.

I'm still curious about your experience with the X2, Andrew. Maybe I need to try that Triair or CCDB on my Enduro for some apples to apples comparisons.....

I did run a DPX2 Performance for a couple days while my X2 was being serviced, and was utterly unimpressed with that little shock - but no surprises there.

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AndrewMajor
+1 Ryan Walters
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 8:53 a.m.

One shock on one frame in both cases - not a big sample size - but there’s enough Banshee owners who experienced similar and enough folks I trust who’ve had similar issues with their Float X2 Performance shocks on other bikes that I’m very satisfied I don’t have an outlier.

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rwalters
+1 Andrew Major
Ryan Walters  - June 9, 2021, 10:39 a.m.

Wait - you're talking about the X2 Performance? My experience is on the Factory, so very different things going on damper wise.

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AndrewMajor
+1 Ryan Walters
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:23 a.m.

As I noted just above, while I haven’t ridden it, the 2020 Float X2 apparently works better in the Titan. 

I don’t know about the Enduro/2021 X2 from my own first hand experience but based on the number of owners I’ve talked to who’ve bought different shocks you may be lucky, or prefer a more damped setup, or it’s the case of being fast enough to overcome the issues other folks experience?

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dbozman
+2 Andrew Major MuscogeeMasher
dbozman  - June 9, 2021, 7:48 p.m.

Another data point. I had two Titans, one with the 2020 X2 and the other with the ‘21. The 2020 version was definitely noticeably superior in all aspects.

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AndrewMajor
+1 MuscogeeMasher
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:39 p.m.

Thanks, this has certainly been the general consensus.

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skyler
+1 Andrew Major
Skyler  - June 9, 2021, 8:37 a.m.

The Titan has been near the top of my frame dream/wishlist for a while, and your comments about mulleting it boost that. I've run my Instinct BC with a 27.5 rear wheel, using a Ride9 link to correct the geo, and was similarly blown away by the cornering and poppiness. (If my 27.5 rear wheel wasn't terrible, I'd keep it like that.)

Another big selling feature is that your use of a 28t chainring didn't seem to affect the suspension performance. My preference is definitely for the shorter derailleurs, lighter cassettes, and - in my experience - much better reliability of 11 speed, with a 10-42 cassette. But I still like that 28/42 low gear. I really wish more frames didn't make using a 28t such a compromise.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 8:56 a.m.

Lots of frames don’t clear smaller than a 30t these days (carbon mainly) but I love the 28t ‘micro drive’ setup so it’s something I’d look for in a frame I’m buying.

Banshee says a 28-to-32t ring is what the Titan is optimized around and it was great for me.

Currently running the same drivetrain on a different project - Yeti SB104BBR - which is really an extension of this project with similarly great results. NSB’s N/W Grannie is a great product!

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MuscogeeMasher
0
MuscogeeMasher  - June 9, 2021, 9:15 a.m.

Re the Trunnion bearings, for me and other first-time trunnion folks, does the F6900 descriptor in the exploded diagram refer to “flanged offset” 6900s?  Can they be pressed in with a normal 6900 drift?  Anything weird or any tips or tricks relative to normal bearings?  Any manufacturers in addition to enduro?  Going to order a pair to have on hand.

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BillT
+2 Andrew Major MuscogeeMasher
Bill T  - June 9, 2021, 11:05 a.m.

Uses the same drift and no real tricks to the install.  In some ways it is easier as the flange will bottom out when the bearing is fully in.

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MuscogeeMasher
+1 Andrew Major
MuscogeeMasher  - June 9, 2021, 1:42 p.m.

Thx.  Will get some ordered.

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babyzhendo
+1 Andrew Major
babyzhendo  - June 9, 2021, 2:12 p.m.

Let me know if you find a good place to order them from...can't seem to find the flanged, non-offset bearings anywhere online aside from ordering a full bearing kit from Banshee.

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andrewbikeguide
+1 Andrew Major
AndrewR  - June 9, 2021, 6:11 p.m.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:40 p.m.

Any bike shop should be able to order them in as well - 'rona supply issues aside.

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cooperquinn
+4 Cr4w Andrew Major roil Velocipedestrian
Cooper Quinn  - June 9, 2021, 9:16 a.m.

"Enough geometry to get me into all kinds of trouble on the trail and certainly not enough travel to get me out"

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AndrewMajor
+2 fartymarty Velocipedestrian
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:41 p.m.

Put a -2° angleset in that bike and we can talk. Actually, look at that sky-high BB, mullet too.

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boomforeal
0
boomforeal  - June 15, 2021, 6:28 a.m.

hey andrew, have you ridden an optic?

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babyzhendo
+1 Andrew Major
babyzhendo  - June 9, 2021, 9:40 a.m.

Andrew I'm very intrigued by that Wolftooth -1 headset setup. I'm running an Ohlins RXF36 m.2 up front which is a lovely fork, but has a long A2C height compared to others on the market, so the slacker HA bringing the front end height down ever so slightly wouldn't be a bad thing. I also feel like the bike could do with a slightly slacker head angle for the very steep trails I'm often riding, as you suggest.

I'm struggling to understand how the Wolftooth headset increases reach, though - wouldn't a slacker head angle shorten the reach slightly by bringing the top of the steerer tube back toward the rider? Let me know if you have any other reflections on that headset change, I'm seriously considering giving it a go!

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geraldooka
+1 Andrew Major
Michael  - June 9, 2021, 12:01 p.m.

All things being equal, you'll get a touch of extra reach because the bike will sit slightly lower at the front. Much like how a hardtail reach will get longer as the fork sags. The amount will be quite small as the offset of the angleset itself cancels out some of those gains.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 12:29 p.m.

The actual Reach increase is small but noticeable as the front end is lower due to the slacker HTA.

It’s a reason I usually combine over-forking with the Angleset.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 12:29 p.m.

This comment has been removed.

khai
+2 Andrew Major Velocipedestrian
khai  - June 9, 2021, 10:08 a.m.

>> I want the geometry. I want all the geometry - Wolf Tooth angleset, and mullet, and lightly over-forked front end - but I want it dropped directly into a much shorter travel rig.

This was my exact thought when I saw the new Transition Patrol.  "Make the new Scout just like that [metal/straight, fat ht/appropriate reach, HTA & STA/dialed RC & WB/mullet/great build options] and I'll be sold!"

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 12:28 p.m.

Yeah, I’d ride that!

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rnayel
+1 Andrew Major
RNAYEL  - June 9, 2021, 11:50 a.m.

Great write up Andrew.

I am still loving my Titan. Developed a creek, it was the lower headset bearing and by right BB cup that had come loose.

Replaced the stock banshee lower bearing with a Ritchey WCS gold bearing (not sure who makes them, but I like them), and tightened the BB cup, creak went away and hasn't returned.

+1 on the CC Kitsuma. It's been a great upgrade from the 2020 X2. I'm toying with the idea of lowering the fork from 180mm to 160mm and putting in an angleset at -1.5. Maybe when the headset bearings die again. Haven't had any issues with the frame bearings after a full year of use.

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AndrewMajor
+1 RNAYEL
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 12:27 p.m.

Cheers Rachid!

I suggest doing the Angleset first and then lower the fork 1cm at a time! With the slacker front end I suspect you’ll want the 170mm fork minimum.

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WalrusRider
+2 Sun Hester Andrew Major
WalrusRider  - June 9, 2021, 11:56 a.m.

If I manage to break my Stumpjumper Evo frame I'm getting a Titan.

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Suns_PSD
+1 Andrew Major
Sun Hester  - June 9, 2021, 12:16 p.m.

Really cool review and the Titan has been on my very short list for some time. 

But one thing I always pick up from the reviews is that no one seems to really like climbing (as in for fun to enjoy tech) on the thing, even after stating it doesn't squat and pedals quite well. Never know what to make of this. Is the bike too stable? Is is actually just too heavy? I associate a good pedaling bike, with a fun bike to climb tech on.

Also, in regards to the -1 angel set, pretty sure that's going to reduce/ decrease Reach, not extend it as the article states.

Another really excellent right up Andrew!

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 12:25 p.m.

Thanks!

-

The Angleset absolutely increases Reach by lowering the front end of the bike. 

Same as how over-forking a bike reduces the Reach, or how Reach grows with sag on a hardtail.

-

I tried to make sure in the review that I was singling out the Titan as regards climbing and 6” bikes. The best pedaling 6” rigs - that still rip downhill at least - are not inspiring climbers in my experience. None of them. 

I think the only way to get that speed metal experience is to cut the travel down and firm everything up.

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Timer
+1 Andrew Major
Timer  - June 10, 2021, 1:45 a.m.

I don't think i ever read a review of a burly 6" travel bike which described the climbing as enjoyable or "for fun".

I don't see how that would work anyway. Once you spec the components required for this kind of bike, climbing becomes a slog, no matter which frame. (tough+sticky tyres, strong=heavy wheels, short stem on a long fork, etc.)

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fartymarty
+1 Andrew Major
fartymarty  - June 10, 2021, 2:02 a.m.

Timer - My Murmur is 40lb with tool bag (no water bottle) so I guess you would classify it as a burly trail bike.

It's reasonably enjoyable on short steep tech climbs.  It's not so bad up longer climbs either due to the geo.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 2:39 p.m.

Same build (even the same fork lowered to 120mm and CushCore inserts) on a short travel bike is so much snappier on climbs.

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Timer
0
Timer  - June 12, 2021, 2:48 p.m.

Are you sure that is not a placebo effect? Because if it isn't, the same must, by logical necessity, be true for a long travel bike with a lockout. (assuming similar geo as far as it concerns climbing)

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AndrewMajor
+1 Timer
Andrew Major  - June 13, 2021, 9:10 p.m.

Yes. 

All a 'lockout' is doing - fork & most shocks - is adding low-speed compression damping. It's not changing anything about how the air springs (or coil springs) perform. 

An 'open' short travel bike rides very differently from a 'closed' long-travel bike. If you're curious to try wait until demo bikes are a thing again and ride something like a Spur v. Sentinel or a new Stumpy v. Enduro. Even with the wheels swapped the shorter travel bike will be lively and more interesting on the climbs.

Not everyone's cup of tea mind you. Nor always my cup of tea. I've been missing the Titan quite a bit since I started stripping it down.

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Stu2
+1 Andrew Major
Paul Stuart  - June 9, 2021, 12:42 p.m.

Andrew,

Been waiting for this and it didn’t disappoint - thank you. Love the depth and detail - very helpful

I have a few questions about the angle set. Was there any creaking associated with it, I’ve heard they can do that. Do you know if it voids the warranty (maybe a better question for banshee)?  Lastly, easy or hard to install?

Cheers

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AndrewMajor
+1 Paul Stuart
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 5:16 p.m.

Hi Paul, thanks!

No issues at all with Angleset creaking with the Wolf Tooth or the Works Anglesets I’ve used.

The original CaneCreek Anglesets with their gimbals could creak up a storm if you didn’t assemble them just so (Pope Jimmy @ SuspensionWerx was _the master _of a creak-free CC Angleset) but you’ll have no issues with either of those units. Just take the time to press them straight.

No harder to install than pressing in any other headset - just have to take your time to line it up and be prepared to restart if it walks a bit. I’ve put plenty in and have had few headaches.

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moraucf
+1 Andrew Major
moraucf  - June 9, 2021, 2:17 p.m.

Awesome review! Brings up two thoughts.

1. This is a REAL bike review. I'd argue it's so hard to gain anything from one ride "reviews" when we all know that 10cm adjustment here, a little suspension adjustment there, and small component changes to top it off have absolutely massive impacts to how a bike rides.  

2. I kind of get wanting same geo in shorter travel but on the other hand, shorter travel frames and suspension are not much lighter, if at all, and you can get a shorter travel ride feel with suspension adjustment (increase spring rate). Works especially well with suspension that has decent midstroke support and can be made linear enough to still bottom with increased initial spring rate, like a mezzer.

Case in point, I have 2 geometron g16s. One of them is 27.5, 180mm Mezzer, 175mm Storia while the second one is setup 29er, 160mm Mezzer, 155mm Mara Pro and light wheels and fast tires. Also the suspension on 29er is setup a lot more linear with a fairly stiff initial spring rate (I use ~125 out of 160 on a normal ride but still bottom when needed). It feels like a snappy trail bike in comparison with the change in pump/jump timing and everything but I still have the wonderful geometry I love and is still fun on even tamer trails in my opinion. 

Also,  Add me to the 2020 DHX2 hater club. My Mara Pro and Storia both vastly outperformed that shock.

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araz
+2 Andrew Major Velocipedestrian
araz  - June 9, 2021, 8:10 p.m.

I think Andrew owes it to us to test this out and build up a Phantom :) 

It does seem like like it'd be a good way to compare the benefits/drawbacks of more/less travel and over/under biking, given the adjustability of Banshee's frames and the overall similarity between models. Couldn't get the exact same geo, but a 2 degree angle set and 140 fork and it'd be pretty close.

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AndrewMajor
+2 Velocipedestrian jaydubmah
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:47 p.m.

A -2° HTA, mulleted, Phantom is absolutely in my top-ten, maybe even top-five, list of frames I'd love to try. I'd leave the fork at 120mm (albeit a tall 120mm given it's a Durolux). That's how I have my current project - the Yeti SB104BBR - setup but I'd love to have the high/low BB height adjustment and multiple wheelbase options to play with. 

I should actually do a piece about my top-five frames I'd love to try and why. That could certainly lead to some fun discussions. My absolute #1 right now is the new Santa Cruz Blur. I'd mullet that, ram a 2.6" tire in the back, lock in a 1.5° 9Point8 Slack'r headset, throw on my 120mm Durolux, and Shore-XC the crap out of that bike. 

So yeah, nothing realistic about the top-five, but it would be fun.

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AndrewMajor
+2 Velocipedestrian moraucf
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:50 p.m.

I so beg to differ. Sadly there are scant few opportunities, or really no opportunities, for folks to ride 100mm travel bikes with DH geometry but it's ridiculously funtacular. 

I hear the argument all the time that for the same weight, with modern pedaling kinematics, why not just get the longer travel bike and have the more versatile platform, and I get it. But it's still not the same as hanging it out on a rigid bike and the short travel 100/120 bikes with DH geo that I imagine are even more fun than that.

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bullit
+1 Andrew Major
bullit  - June 9, 2021, 2:28 p.m.

Hi Andrew ,all reviews should be like this one, congratulations for not kissing the ass of the big brands, i have a medium Titan and after trying a DVO Topaz T3 ,Marzocchi CR,X2 from a EBike (Scott); DVO Jade ( not the X one) ,EXT Storia ( which i didn´t like) and finally the CCDB CS Coil that`s the one to keep, i´ve tried the 400 pound for my 73 kg weight and now on a 350 ( not ride it yet),the 400 seem´s a bit on the stiff side, how much do you weight?

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:52 p.m.

Thanks!

I have ~ +10kg on you. 350lb sounds right to me for your weight although settings do play a role as well.

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Carmel
+1 Andrew Major
Carmel  - June 10, 2021, 2:20 a.m.

I weigh a little less than 70kg without a backpack and I currently run a 300lb spring in the DVO Jade.Never noticed any hard bottom outs, damper works awesome so far. 

I recently noticed some rubbing on the reservoir stickers though (both sides), so I guess the shock moves a little side-to-side when railing berms. It is a tight fit anyhow.
Trying to somehwo procure a Mara Pro now, but stock over here is super rare. Just missed a TriAir on the classifieds a week ago.

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bullit
+2 Andrew Major Carmel
bullit  - June 10, 2021, 2:32 a.m.

Tried the Jade with a Sprindex coil and yes at full compression and railing berms the stickers on the piggyback rub inside the frame,sold it ,although it was the best shock I’ve tried on the Titan,I was afraid of some rock get stuck between the frame and shock and damaging it

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Carmel
+1 Andrew Major
Carmel  - June 10, 2021, 2:11 p.m.

How is the CC DB Coil in comparison to the Jade? Definitely want to keep a coil option as well.

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bullit
+2 Andrew Major Carmel
bullit  - June 10, 2021, 2:15 p.m.

The ccdb has more midstroke support and have the climb switch that might help on those fireroads but in Europe it’s way more expensive

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 2:44 p.m.

Hard to beat the quality (materials and manufacturing) of the CCDB as well. I think the reason folks don’t gravitate to it the same as ‘cool’ shocks is that it’s only had minor changes over years & years on the market. I’ve never had a bad experience so it’s an easy suggestion.

cheapondirt
+1 Andrew Major
cheapondirt  - June 9, 2021, 6:22 p.m.

Really enjoyed this. Mini-reviews inside the review, and lots of meat to digest.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:53 p.m.

Cheers! Yes, no shortage of words - and links - for this one. I'm actually very flattered by how many folks have actually read it (not just looked at El Dentizto's wonderful images).

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Bondseye
+1 Andrew Major
Kevin Bond  - June 9, 2021, 7:44 p.m.

Cool review. Thanks! 

I’ve had time on the Phantom, Prime, and Titan. Of the three the Titan is the more irresponsible choice as it climbs the slowest, but is more fun coming back down and in the turns. Having fun is why I ride, so I’ll happily suffer slightly more on a climb to get my reward. That said I don’t hate climbing my Titan, but I’m not a Strava chaser. If I wanted to rank on segments I should probably buy a plastic wonder bike, lycra, a heart rate monitor and start climbing faster. 

I bought a Tri air based largely on your recommendation and it absolutely made the bike come alive. Lately I’ve been running the tri air in the mid position and firming up my grip 2 for trail riding with great results. More platform to push against with some travel in reserve for emergencies. 

Btw If anyone is interested in a Tri air act soon. Suntour is revamping the shock for 2022 and the new version is no longer Banshee compatible. 

Thanks for all the insights!

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AndrewMajor
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Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 9:55 p.m.

So impressed with the Tri-Air shock, very glad you're enjoying it! The scariest part of giving a product a - well deserved - positive review is recognizing that someone may take it into account when spending their hard-earned money in that category. I loved mine. 

I'll disagree with you re. the responsible choice. I think the Titan - at least how I have it set up - is the most stable, rideable, and the failsafe option of the three. At least how I would build them. My ultra-slack mulleted Phantom would absolutely get me into way more trouble than the Titan.

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Bondseye
+1 Andrew Major
Kevin Bond  - June 10, 2021, 4:48 a.m.

With all due respect I owned, and put miles on all three. Nothing theoretical about my opinion. All the bikes have their sweet spot in terms of terrain, but for pure seat of your pants fun and speed the Titan wins. I agree it’s more stable and fail safe, and for me that encourages faster turns, and far more aggressive lines. Lines that would have bucked me off my my Phantom regardless of any angle changes.

The Titan isn’t as great as it’s shorter siblings on the climbs because in part of all that travel, and for most of us the Prime and Phantom have enough travel for 98% of what we ride, but the Titan has the secret sauce. It almost seems Banshee designed ks2 for the Titan and just shortened it for their other bikes. I’m not sure if that’s true, but I am sure that in my experience the Titan utilizes the ks2 platform just a little better then the Phantom, or Prime.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 7:01 a.m.

Ha, yeah sorry I certainly wasn’t trying to contradict your experience. I was just making funny about what may be defined as ‘irresponsible’ since the Titan obviously has the biggest get-out-of-jail-free-card of the bunch.

Fun is of course subjective. I always go back to the same Bontrager quote:

If you are a pro, you ride the fastest thing you can get. If you aren’t, then you can ride anything that suits you.

I am after all the person trying to get everyone to ride rigid single speeds...

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Bondseye
+1 Andrew Major
Kevin Bond  - June 10, 2021, 8:29 a.m.

No apologies necessary. It all depends on how you define irresponsible, and what you consider fun. Different stroke (lengths) for different folks.

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Bondseye
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Kevin Bond  - June 10, 2021, 8:29 a.m.

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velocipedestrian
+2 Andrew Major Timer
Velocipedestrian  - June 9, 2021, 9:30 p.m.

I was surprised to see Banshee embracing onion mount and internal routing. The onion (kind of) makes sense - as you say, fitting a longer shock vertical to make space for a bottle. But the routing is a bit sad, if ever there was a brand who could have embraced the idea that a mountain bicycle is a machine, and should be function first it's this one.

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AndrewMajor
+1 MuscogeeMasher
Andrew Major  - June 9, 2021, 10:01 p.m.

How you feel about internally routed cables - especially brake cables - is directly correlatable to who's working on the bike. Folks who don't do any of their own labour love the look of internal routing. 

At home, I would always choose external routing although the tube-in-frame Yeti or some-Santa Cruz' style routing is equally simple to put in fresh and does look so clean though it requires spending for carbon. 

Other than the exit ports needing a bit of a tweak (due to noise) the Banshee has excellent and easy to run internal routing. It's one of the simplest and most straightforward I've used other than having to add the silencer.

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Carmel
+2 Andrew Major MuscogeeMasher
Carmel  - June 10, 2021, 2:22 a.m.

One more gripe with cable routing is the path of the dropper cable. I am 100% sure it will eat into the lower link sooner or later even with the mastic I put.

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MuscogeeMasher
+1 Andrew Major
MuscogeeMasher  - June 10, 2021, 6:55 a.m.

Agree. I can accept the the routing other than this aspect. Just going to part of regular maintenance to check the trunnion bearings and the user-installed mastic tape on that link. Neither is that big of a deal.

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AndrewMajor
+1 MuscogeeMasher
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 7:03 a.m.

I ran a big chunk of 3M and have seen no issues. Good reminder though as I missed that in the write up.

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DanLees1978
+1 Andrew Major
Dan Lees  - June 10, 2021, 8:03 a.m.

The prime had some clear protection tape on the link.

I put some All Mountain Style Frame protection stuff on there as well just to be safe.

Carmel
0
Carmel  - June 10, 2021, 2:22 a.m.

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MuscogeeMasher
0
MuscogeeMasher  - June 10, 2021, 6:57 a.m.

Is anyone actually routing the derailleur cable and brake hose above the bottom bracket as shown on Banshee’s FAQ?  I looked at it when building mine up but didn’t like it and went under the BB, which is what Andrew seems to have done as well.

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DanLees1978
0
Dan Lees  - June 10, 2021, 8:05 a.m.

Yeah, I have routed as per over the top of the BB, seems fine.

Danger of having it under the BB is rock strikes.

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MuscogeeMasher
0
MuscogeeMasher  - June 10, 2021, 9:03 a.m.

Interesting to know.  Yep as to downside of under BB.  They do sit pretty tight under there and I’m running a bash guard which helps a little as well.  Not worried about it but def not ideal.

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Bondseye
0
Kevin Bond  - June 11, 2021, 6:27 a.m.

Mine is over the BB and the cables are actually quiet. Not sure why.

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Bondseye
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Kevin Bond  - June 11, 2021, 6:27 a.m.

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fartymarty
+1 Andrew Major
fartymarty  - June 9, 2021, 10:52 p.m.

Andrew, what wheelbase did you end up with in the shorter CS position?

I've was comparing FC  / WB on various bikes and it would be good to see where you got to.  My XL Murmur (515R) comes in at 0.657 whereas the equivalent sized G1 (515R) is 0.658.  I think this is a useful number to compare how bikes of varying sizes and angles handle.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 7:04 a.m.

I actually never put a tape on it after I put the Angleset in. Like the final HTA it was just ‘perfect.’ Sorry!

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fartymarty
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fartymarty  - June 9, 2021, 10:52 p.m.

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rcybak
+1 Kevin Bond
rcybak  - June 10, 2021, 7:45 a.m.

I have a 2021 Rune, which is by far the most fun bike I've ever ridden. I think it's essentially a Titan, but with a tiny bit more travel. First, if you think that a 29/27.5 mullet corners well, you should see how a full 27.5/27 5 corners! It's out of this world how the Rune holds its line through any type of corner, with just having to keep your weight over the pedals the entire time. You can feel the tires digging in, with traction loss only something that happens to other bikes. I resisted the bike industry's marketing department insistence that 29ers are the future, and went with the wheel size I know works better for the riding I love to do out here in Coquitlam, on the Shore, and up in Squamish and Whistler. All this shock talk does have me curious about what I might be missing out on, but the 2021 X2 Performance that came with my frame seems to be doing a great job of what I'm asking it to do. I find that this bike definitely needs to be let go, or let loose to really experience the benefits of the design. I didn't realize how much holding back I was doing with my previous bikes until I got comfortable on the Rune, because as soon as I started letting it go, and trusting what it is capable of, that's when I was rewarded. It definitely favors pounding through rough sections, and it does so by refusing to be bounced around by anything. The added weight of the frame, especially the shock cage right where you want to weight the bike is so advantageous that the UCI would probably ban it if they could. I used to be quite a weight weenie, so the decision to weight up was a tough one, but I can unequivocally say that it's effects are only positive. On the hill climbs, it rides as well as my last bike, which was a few pounds lighter. Anyway, everyone should find the Banshee that suits them, and buy one now.

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MuscogeeMasher
+2 Paul Stuart Andrew Major
MuscogeeMasher  - June 10, 2021, 9:58 a.m.

Great review.

FWIW, I’ve got an XL Titan at 6’1” with long legs and really, really long arms (ape index of 1.06) and am really happy. 

Running 29 both ends with the shorter dropouts and, even though it’s a big change for me, I’m liking the long rear center (which is really the only geo aspect that might be objectionable given it will take an angleset). Definitely a little different and not sure I’d like it on my trail bike, especially given that the trail bike no longer sees winch-and-plummet riding or long gnarly or really-high-speed descents. My trail bike is 475 reach, 435mm rear center. If I had a magic wand, I’d make it 440 or 445 and see how that felt.  But, digging 452 on the Titan.

I’d highly recommend the Titan so long as you pay close attention to the seat post insertion and making sure you’re going to be content.

On the fender, you can play around in Adobe and get their template to print to scale with a normal printer on a legal sheet of paper. However, after doing that I think that time is better spent making your own fender. I threw up some pictures of what I did in case it helps others.  

https://nsmb.com/photos/user/16758/album/misc/

Beyond the fender, I’d also say mandatory build and maintenance items to make sure you have when you build it up are:

1 - foam tubing or another plan to make sure the cables are quiet

2 - mastic tape to put on the bottom link where the dropper housing is going to rub on it

3 - if you don’t already own one, a 6mm stubby l-wrench so you can check the torque on the lower pivot without removing the chainring or resorting to a ball-end hex. That was a new one for me given the full suspension bikes I’ve owned to date.

Really like what Banshee is doing as a company and appreciate them, Knolly, and others for still making bikes like the Titan!

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Bondseye
0
Kevin Bond  - June 11, 2021, 6:46 a.m.

Nice Titan! What material did you use for the fender?

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MuscogeeMasher
+1 Kevin Bond
MuscogeeMasher  - June 11, 2021, 8:44 a.m.

Thanks!  I looked locally but ended up ordering some black plastic sheets from Amazon at .5mm based on some general forums on fenders.  Top fender is cut out of another fender I had laying around and is 1mm thick.  I’d look for a couple sheets of 1mm abs plastic.  .5mm pretty flimsy for that top fender.

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MuscogeeMasher
0
MuscogeeMasher  - June 10, 2021, 10:59 a.m.

SO ABOUT THOSE TRUNNION BEARINGS . . .

Banshee has a nice exploded diagram that lists those bearings as F6900 LLU Max Enduro.

Problem is that, as best I can tell in the US looking at ABI Industries, those bearings don't exist or at least are not part of Enduro's regular catalogue.  It's either:

6900 FO LLU Max, which is flanged but also offset

F6900-2RS, which I think is flanged without an offset, but I also think is not a full complement bearing and I know does not have as good a seal as an LLU.

If I remember correctly from pulling the linkage apart awhile ago, the seals on those trunnion bearings do look different than a typical MAX bearing and may very well be the 6900-2RS.  I know trunnions can be hard on bearings, but the Titan seems to be really well aligned.  If they are 6900-2RS, maybe some of the difference in longevity could result from a less-than-ideal bearing spec on the trunnion (assuming you want MAX bearings on a trunnion mount)?

Can anyone clear this up so we can all order our spare trunnion bearings?  Am I just totally whiffing on some aspect of this?  Thanks in advance!

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builttoride
+2 Paul Stuart MuscogeeMasher
builttoride  - June 11, 2021, 1:17 a.m.

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Bondseye
+1 Paul Stuart
Kevin Bond  - June 11, 2021, 6:31 a.m.

Thanks! Any plans to sell a fender for the rear end?

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Stu2
0
Paul Stuart  - June 11, 2021, 7:07 a.m.

I would buy it

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DanLees1978
+1 MuscogeeMasher
Dan Lees  - June 11, 2021, 1:40 a.m.

Looking at the below they spec F6900 which is different to 6900 FO. I have looked at both sides of the bearing pressed into the link and I'm 99% sure they are F6900 not 6900 FO as there is no offset.

I don't think you can buy actually buy F6900 LLU bearings separately and I would be surprised if that is what is in the kit Banshee sell. LLU is the type of sealing.

I have ordered some F6900-2RS Enduro bearings (2RS = 2 Rubber Seal) which seem to be the best, and aside from cheap generic bearings, the only option. 

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MuscogeeMasher
0
MuscogeeMasher  - June 11, 2021, 4:08 a.m.

Many thx for the response and saving me from having to pull that link and look.  I agree that they're most likely the F6900-2RS and that seems to be the only option.  I have a very hard time believing a boutique company like banshee is getting enduro to make a custom bearing.

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MuscogeeMasher
0
MuscogeeMasher  - June 11, 2021, 4:08 a.m.

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MuscogeeMasher
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MuscogeeMasher  - June 11, 2021, 4:08 a.m.

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shapethings
+1 Andrew Major
shapethings  - June 10, 2021, 2:31 p.m.

Couldn't agree more with the need for more companies to add an additional size between M & L. 

I'm always at the top end of a medium or the lowest end of a large. 

Ultimately, custom is probably the ultimate solution.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 10, 2021, 2:49 p.m.

This has been a pet perspective of mine for years now. Ditch a colourway, add a size, better fits & less SKUs. The large becomes a real large, the medium is no longer just a mid point on a geo chart between small and large. Beauty.

Custom is an option of course, but stock sizing options could be better.

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WalrusRider
+1 Andrew Major
WalrusRider  - June 14, 2021, 4:48 a.m.

Very curious about the Banshee Titan vs the Knolly Chilcotin if anyone has experience with both.

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AndrewMajor
0
Andrew Major  - June 14, 2021, 7:15 a.m.

For two ‘boutique aluminum’ bikes they’re are almost antithesis to each other.

Just to start:

The Knolly has relatively standard length stays (438mm) and a tiny headtube (106mm / size large) for a 6” bike.

The Banshee has long (452mm) or longer (462mm) stays and a long headtube (130mm / size large) for a 6” bike.

From there it’s just a rabbit hole of differences from seating position to the bushings v. bearing argument.

//

I don’t have adequate time pedaling a Chilcotin (only parking lot test) to comment on the comparative ride.

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WalrusRider
0
WalrusRider  - June 14, 2021, 4:48 a.m.

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